Atonement Theories
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civic
Active Member
I’ve refuted it all day long today
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
No you have not
All you have done is post your anti calvin rhetoric. and tried to refute what they believe, and refusing to listen what others believe.. and thinking you proves us in error
and claimed that all forms of PSA teach the same thing. I think I have rightly proved this theory false by all accounts..
But hey. I am don beating a dead horse. Believe what you want. But your doctrine is dangerous. it has a God not being a God of love and justice. But a Universalist.
Nothing in the things I have said or the words of Mr Theime Jr resembles anything the calvinists teach concerning PSA.. so you could not have refutes us. because you have not heard us.
Open up bro.
civic
Active Member
PSA is antibiblical . You don’t even understand its teachings. I know it inside out.
You quoted him saying the following which is PSA
“ In a moment of time, your sin, my sin and the past present and future sins of the whole world were poured out on him. It was then that in his greatest agony he screamed. God the father turned his back on him. Why, Because thou art holy (ps 22:3) “
Jesus is Holy and sinless yet lived , ate, fellowshiped with sinners.
So much for your anti biblical ideas
Heretical
civic
Active Member
I have scripture declaring He was never forsaken nor did the Father turn His back on the Son for even a millisecond
The Father never forsook the sinless Son of God.
The following scriptures affirm that Jesus' relationship with the Father on the cross was still there and not broken and He was never forsaken by the Father
Psalm 22:24
For he has not despised or scorned
the suffering of the afflicted one;
he has not hidden his face from him
but has listened to his cry for help.
Luke 23:46
Jesus called out with a loud voice, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." When he had said this, he breathed his last.
John 16:32
"A time is coming and in fact has come when you will be scattered, each to your own home. You will leave me all alone. Yet I am not alone, for my Father is with me."
Hebrews 5:7
During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.
Scripture from both testaments on never being forsaken
2 Corinthians 4:9- persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.
Hebrews 13:5- Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, for God has said: "Never will I leave you, never will I forsake you."
Romans 8:35
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?Shall trouble or distress or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword?
Deuteronomy 4:31
For the LORD your God is a merciful God; He will not abandon you or destroy you or forget the covenant with your fathers, which He swore to them by oath.
Deuteronomy 31:6
Be strong and courageous; do not be afraid or terrified of them, for it is the LORD your God who goes with you; He will never leave you nor forsake you."
Deuteronomy 31:8
The LORD Himself goes before you; He will be with you. He will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid or discouraged."
Joshua 1:5
No one shall stand against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so will I be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you.
Psalm 9:10
And they that know thy name will put their trust in thee: for thou, LORD, hast not forsaken them that seek thee
Psalm 37:25, 28
I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread: For the LORD loves justice and will not forsake His saints. They are preserved forever,but the offspring of the wicked will be cut off.
Isaiah 41:17- The poor and needy seek water, but there is none; their tongues are parched with thirst. I, the LORD, will answer them; I, the God of Israel, will not forsake them
The Father never forsook the sinless Son of God.
The following scriptures affirm that Jesus' relationship with the Father on the cross was still there and not broken and He was never forsaken by the Father
Psalm 22:24
For he has not despised or scorned
the suffering of the afflicted one;
he has not hidden his face from him
but has listened to his cry for help.
Luke 23:46
Jesus called out with a loud voice, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." When he had said this, he breathed his last.
John 16:32
"A time is coming and in fact has come when you will be scattered, each to your own home. You will leave me all alone. Yet I am not alone, for my Father is with me."
Hebrews 5:7
During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.
Scripture from both testaments on never being forsaken
2 Corinthians 4:9- persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.
Hebrews 13:5- Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, for God has said: "Never will I leave you, never will I forsake you."
Romans 8:35
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?Shall trouble or distress or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword?
Deuteronomy 4:31
For the LORD your God is a merciful God; He will not abandon you or destroy you or forget the covenant with your fathers, which He swore to them by oath.
Deuteronomy 31:6
Be strong and courageous; do not be afraid or terrified of them, for it is the LORD your God who goes with you; He will never leave you nor forsake you."
Deuteronomy 31:8
The LORD Himself goes before you; He will be with you. He will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid or discouraged."
Joshua 1:5
No one shall stand against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so will I be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you.
Psalm 9:10
And they that know thy name will put their trust in thee: for thou, LORD, hast not forsaken them that seek thee
Psalm 37:25, 28
I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread: For the LORD loves justice and will not forsake His saints. They are preserved forever,but the offspring of the wicked will be cut off.
Isaiah 41:17- The poor and needy seek water, but there is none; their tongues are parched with thirst. I, the LORD, will answer them; I, the God of Israel, will not forsake them
praise_yeshua
Active Member
They insist the Incarnation serve their sin. The blacker they make their sin, the more they see God's Grace for them.
civic
Active Member
It’s a spiritual blindness and misconception about Gods good character and nature.
Well, we have Adam sinning, and we have David sinning, but Godc did not abandon either, but you think he abandoned Christ?
BTW Your question was answered by the examples of Adam and David.
civic
Active Member
Another fallacy since God was tempted numerous times in the OT. Tempt and Test are the same
civic
Active Member
Amen
It was a clear answer to me.
civic
Active Member
Yes indeed !!!
Matt 4:7Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.
Luke 4:12And Jesus answering said unto him, It is said, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.
Acts 15:10Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
Deut 6:16Ye shall not tempt the Lord your God, as ye tempted him in Massah.
Ps 78:18And they tempted God in their heart By asking meat for their lust.
Ps 78:41Yea, they turned back and tempted God, And limited the Holy One of Israel.
Ps 78:56Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, And kept not his testimonies:
Ps 106:14But lusted exceedingly in the wilderness, And tempted God in the desert.
Mal 3:15And now we call the proud happy; Yea, they that work wickedness are set up; Yea, they that tempt God are even delivered.
Indeed He was.
civic
Active Member
Amen I’m glad you are active in this thread bringing scripture to refute and rebuke the false teachings. Keep up the good work brother defending our Gods good name and character.
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
Yes
Once again
Did Christ use all of his attributes. Or did he as a man leave some behind?
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
lol..I never said he abandon them now did I.
Again, a failure to understand
PS. Did God abandon Christ? Last I read. Christ was restored and said it is finished and he gave up the ghost.
So much for being abandoned.
But the answer failed. Because apart from the death of Christ. David and Adam would be sitting in hades right nw awaiting their future sentence to hell.
civic
Active Member
If He did not possess all the divine attributes then He was not fully God which is the Kenosis heresy
praise_yeshua
Active Member
Nothing left behind. He chose to not use what He had available to Him.
The measure of Divinity isn't just what He does, it also includes what He will not do.
It is really senseless how you treat the Incarnation. It only serves you. If it serves everyone, then act like it in your theology.
praise_yeshua
Active Member
Where did David and Adam go before Christ? You do realize that Christ's sacrifice wasn't complete long before God has mercy on them all.
