except by faith
Hebrews 11:6 (LEB) — 6 Now without faith it is impossible to please him, for the one who approaches God must believe that he exists and is a rewarder of those who seek him.
An Article on free will
- Thread starter TomL
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Hebrews 11:6 (LEB) — 6 Now without faith it is impossible to please him, for the one who approaches God must believe that he exists and is a rewarder of those who seek him.
The verse does not say man cannot naturally please God
It does say
Romans 8:6–8 (LEB) — 6 For the mindset of the flesh is death, but the mindset of the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mindset of the flesh is enmity toward God, for it is not subjected to the law of God, for it is not able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh are not able to please God.
Sorry it is your invention
Believing is believing, there is no such thing as believing non spiritually vs believing spiritually
You invent things because you cannot deal with scripture as it reads
brightfame52
Well-known member
So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Man naturally cannot please God. Rom8:8
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Some times truth in scripture may not be something word for word, but its implied and or consonant or consistent with clear scripture in other places
Fellow Traveler
Active member
Or in plain language "Calvinism twists scripture to make it mean what they want it to mean".
brightfame52
Well-known member
Some times truth in scripture may not be something word for word, but its implied and or consonant or consistent with clear scripture in other places. Calvinism,Tulip is the Gospel
Fellow Traveler
Active member
Some times "Calvinism twists scripture to make it mean what they want it to mean". Well... make that most of the time.
And with you most times it is your imagination
Believing is believing, there is no such thing as believing non spiritually vs believing spiritually
You invent things because you cannot deal with scripture as it reads
You misquote the verse
The verse does not say man cannot naturally please God
It does say
Romans 8:6–8 (LEB) — 6 For the mindset of the flesh is death, but the mindset of the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mindset of the flesh is enmity toward God, for it is not subjected to the law of God, for it is not able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh are not able to please God.
Man can please God with faith
Hebrews 11:6 (LEB) — 6 Now without faith it is impossible to please him, for the one who approaches God must believe that he exists and is a rewarder of those who seek him.
MTMattie
Active member
What is your point?
Mine is this proves that there IS free will and those who exercise it, even though they were lost , yet turn , can be saved.
FREE WILL!
It was by FREE WILL that the prodigal son returned.
11 And He said, “A man had two sons. 12 The younger of them said to his father, ‘Father, give me the share of the estate that falls to me.’ So he divided his [d]wealth between them. 13 And not many days later, the younger son gathered everything together and went on a journey into a distant country, and there he squandered his estate with loose living. 14 Now when he had spent everything, a severe famine occurred in that country, and he began to be impoverished. 15 So he went and [e]hired himself out to one of the citizens of that country, and he sent him into his fields to feed swine. 16 And he would have gladly filled his stomach with the [f]pods that the swine were eating, and no one was giving anything to him. 17 But when he came to [g]his senses, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired men have more than enough bread, but I am dying here with hunger! 18 I will get up and go to my father, and will say to him, “Father, I have sinned against heaven, and [h]in your sight; 19 I am no longer worthy to be called your son; make me as one of your hired men.”’ 20 So he got up and came to [i]his father. But while he was still a long way off, his father saw him and felt compassion for him, and ran and [j]embraced him and kissed him. 21 And the son said to him, ‘Father, I have sinned against heaven and in your sight; I am no longer worthy to be called your son.’ 22 But the father said to his slaves, ‘Quickly bring out the best robe and put it on him, and put a ring on his hand and sandals on his feet; 23 and bring the fattened calf, kill it, and let us eat and celebrate; 24 for this son of mine was dead and has come to life again; he was lost and has been found.’ And they began to celebrate.
25 “Now his older son was in the field, and when he came and approached the house, he heard music and dancing. 26 And he summoned one of the servants and began inquiring what these things could be. 27 And he said to him, ‘Your brother has come, and your father has killed the fattened calf because he has received him back safe and sound.’ 28 But he became angry and was not willing to go in; and his father came out and began pleading with him. 29 But he answered and said to his father, ‘Look! For so many years I have been serving you and I have never [k]neglected a command of yours; and yet you have never given me a young goat, so that I might celebrate with my friends; 30 but when this son of yours came, who has devoured your [l]wealth with prostitutes, you killed the fattened calf for him.’ 31 And he said to him, ‘Son, you [m]have always been with me, and all that is mine is yours. 32 But we had to celebrate and rejoice, for this brother of yours was dead and has begun to live, and was lost and has been found.’”
What does Luke 15:32 mean?
The father of the prodigal son is explaining to his older son why he is celebrating the return of a rebellious, disrespectful brother (Luke 15:11–31). In parallel, Jesus is explaining to a group of Pharisees and experts in the law why He chooses to dine with sinners and tax collectors (Luke 15:1–2). God's response to us when we repent isn't just forgiveness and an accountant-like reconciliation of the debts of our sin. It's joy and celebration and acceptance and an enthusiastic welcome back into the family (Luke 15:7, 10).Those who stayed faithful to God are invited to celebrate the return of the lost, but they must realize an important truth: it's not about them. Their loyalty has nothing to do with God's choice to forgive and reconcile with the repentant sinner. God's forgiveness does not cheapen the steady service of a religious leader, and that steady service has no bearing on the forgiveness of a rebel. As Jesus explains in the parable of the laborers in the vineyard, God is free to bless His people as He sees fit (Matthew 20:1–16). The gift of salvation is so far out of human reach that there is no eternal difference between a "good" person and a "bad" person; all have sinned and deserve death (Romans 3:23; 6:23). The difference is in the life lived. It is a blessing to live a life faithful to God and stay in fellowship with Him. We should celebrate when others get the chance to join us.
@brightfame52, do you recall the fruit of the Holy Spirit of God of which one of the fruit of the Spirit is belief (Galatians 5:22-23)? Faith/belief is not among the works of the flesh recorded in Galatians 5:19-21.
TomL, the words Spirit and belief do appear in the Bible in relationship, and here is the relevant quote "the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, belief" (Galatians 5:22).
This verse can also be translated "the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and temperance. Against such things there is no law" (Galatians 5:22-23).
TomL, saving faith/belief is the work of God according to the Word of God “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29).
TomL, you idolize yourself because you believe that saving faith/belief is a work of your flesh instead of the Holy Spirit of God.
the works of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the Kingdom of God.
(Galatians 5:19-21)
Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men (Matthew 15:9).
In Truth (John 14:6), the Almighty God is Sovereign (Genesis 1:1) in man's salvation and affairs of man (Daniel 4:34-35)! PRAISE THE AUTHOR AND PERFECTER OF THE FAITH!!!
brightfame52
Well-known member
Some times truth in scripture may not state something word for word, but its implied and or consonant or consistent with clear scripture in other places. Calvinism,Tulip is the Gospel
brightfame52
Well-known member
Some times truth in scripture may not be something word for word, but its implied and or consonant or consistent with clear scripture in other places
brightfame52
Well-known member
So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. So they cant have the Faith of Heb 11:6 duh
civic
Well-known member
Amen !
civic
Well-known member
Exactly its believers not unbelievers with faith and the fruit.
You made our point for us.
next fallacy.
brightfame52
Well-known member
@MTMattie
My point is God saves people that by nature they dont seek God or cannot please God. And your point is bogus,the person in the flesh has no freewill to please God, he cant do it God says Rom8: 8
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Do you know who that is ? " they that are in the flesh "
My point is God saves people that by nature they dont seek God or cannot please God. And your point is bogus,the person in the flesh has no freewill to please God, he cant do it God says Rom8: 8
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Do you know who that is ? " they that are in the flesh "
