civic
Well-known member
Amen !
The problem in calvinism is the assumption God causes everything that comes to pass including all sin, evil.
To be consistent they must say God is the cause of their faith too. He causes their faith and sin alike.
An Article on free will
- Thread starter TomL
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The problem in calvinism is the assumption God causes everything that comes to pass including all sin, evil.
To be consistent they must say God is the cause of their faith too. He causes their faith and sin alike.
ἀρχηγός, οῦ, ὁ—1. leader, ruler, prince (Aeschyl.+; POxy. 41, 5; 6 and mostly LXX) ἀ. καὶ σωτήρ Ac 5:31 (this combin. also 2 Cl 20:5).—τ. ζωῆς 3:15, where mng. 3 is also poss.
2. one who begins someth. as first in a series and thus supplies the impetus (Aristot., Metaph. 1, 3 of Thales ὁ τῆς τοιαύτης ἀρχηγὸς φιλοσοφίας; Aristoxenus, fgm. 83 Ὄλυμπος ἀ. γενέσθαι τ. Ἑλληνικῆς μουσικῆς; Polyb. 5, 10, 1; Plut., Mor. 958D; 1135B; Dit., Or. 219, 26 ἀ. τοῦ γένους; 1 Macc 9:61; 10:47; Mi 1:13; Jos., C. Ap. 1, 130[of Moses]) in bad sense instigator 1 Cl 14:1 ζήλους; ἀ. στάσεως 51:1 (cf. Herodian 7, 1, 11 ἀ. τ. ἀποστάσεως).
3. originator, founder (Diod. S. 15, 81, 2 ἀ. τῆς νίκης=originator; 16, 3, 5 τῆς βασιλείας ἀ.=founder; Jos., Ant. 7, 207.Oft. of God: Pla., Tim. 21E al.; Isocr. 4, 61 τῶν ἀγαθῶν; Diod. S. 5, 64, 5; Dit., Or. 90, 47, Syll.3 711L, 13 Apollo ἀ. τ. εὐσεβείας) ἀ. τῆς ἀφθαρσίας 2 Cl 20:5; ἀ. τῆς σωτηρίας Hb 2:10; τῆς πίστεως ἀ. 12:2. M-M.*
William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 112.
TibiasDad
Well-known member
It doesn’t say we were granted belief/given belief, it says we were graciously allowed/granted “to believe”! We are given the opportunity to believe and the opportunity to suffer for the name.
Secondly, the two scenarios, belief/suffering, are linked together, so if belief is given effectually, then why isn’t suffering also effectually given to every believer?
Doug
Calvinists interpret the granting (enabling) of faith as an instilling, transferring, infusion of faith
Dort takes this stand
The Canons of Dort
ARTICLE 14Faith is therefore to be considered as the gift of God, not on account of its being offered by God to man, to be accepted or rejected at his pleasure, but because it is in reality conferred upon him, breathed and infused into him; nor even because God bestows the power or ability to believe, and then expects that man should by the exercise of his own free will consent to the terms of salvation and actually believe in Christ, but because He who works in man both to will and to work, and indeed all things in all, produces both the will to believe and the act of believing also.
The Westminster confess uses infuse to speak of grace and righteousness
Chapter XI. Of Justification Westminster Confession of Faith Chapter XI, 1
THOSE whom God effectually calleth he also freely justifieth; not by infusing righteousness into them, but by pardoning their sins, and by accounting and accepting their persons as righteous: not for any thing wrought in them, or done by them, but for Christ’s sake alone: not by imputing faith itself, the act of believing, or any other evangelical obedience, to them as their righteousness; but by imputing the obedience and satisfaction of Christ unto them, they receiving and resting on him and his righteousness by faith: which faith they have not of themselves; it is the gift of God.
The Larger Catechism Westminster Larger Catechism Question 77
A. Although sanctification be inseparably joined with justification, yet they differ, in that God in justification imputeth the righteousness of Christ;t in sanctification his Spirit infuseth grace, and enableth to the exercise thereof; in the former, sin is pardoned;w in the other, it is subdued: the one doth equally free all believers from the revenging wrath of God, and that perfectly in this life, that they never fall into condemnation;y the other is neither equal in all, nor in this life perfect in any,a but growing up to perfection.
Westminster Assembly, The Westminster Confession of Faith: Edinburgh Edition (Philadelphia: William S. Young, 1851), 66–222.
Though I think he spoke of it a permission
Where do you see allowed?
Not necessarily. Why would it be necessary? It is written to a specific church at a specific time that was suffering persecution.
Everything is determined. Or are somethings left to chance? How do you work in chance with a omniscient God?
It does not say granted to be ABLE to believe.
God.
Do you know what a question mark is?
Explain how God gives faith according to your view
Does he just instill it?
Can you deny it or resist it?
Do you know what a question mark is?
Explain how God gives faith according to your view
Does he just instill it?
Can you deny it or resist it?
Quote me then we may procede
Again a question does not need a quote
Stop dodging
Do you know what a question mark is?
Explain how God gives faith according to your view
Does he just instill it?
Can you deny it or resist it?
Omniscience is knowing all that is possible to know
The future is not yet a thing to be known
Calvinist routinely deny God can know what a yet uncreated free will being will do
All that can be logically known. Christ knew you and loved you on the cross right?
Then you deny omniscience. lol How did God know Judas would betray Chist? A good guess?
Nonsense since we believe all things are determined.
Nope. Grant means to give. Permission "granted" does not mean permission enabled. lol
Quote me
