All Claims of The Son's Deity

[101G]

@101G

As Jesus Christ once told Thomas, & be not faithless, but believing!

"Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God." John 20:27-28

Correct, Jesus is Lord and LORD. the same "ONE" person.

101G.

 

[mikesw]

Jesus would have been crucified the first time he explicitly said "I am God."

So in your mind you think the Jews could of killed God. And so God could not say who he was because He was afraid. Image if you will that you are going to kill God. Just stop your mind for a few seconds and honestly think about that. Does it cross your mind that you just might be picking a fight with someone that is just a little itty bitty tad bit bigger than what you could handle?

You do not follow scripture very well. Jesus as the incarnation of God would be killed. That is the obvious point that you just totally missed. This is not ending God's "life" since he is spirit.
Remember the humbling? This meant Jesus was not going around striking people dead because he could. It is a basic principle that God establishes certain constraints in what he will do and how interaction with man would be done -- incorporated within promises -- like that to humanity given to Noah. So we could see that in Jesus where he does not go and say he is God during his incarnation just to avoid hundreds of attempts to stone him for what the Jews think as blasphemy.
Maybe someday you will realize what God can do and even what he has constrained himself not to do.
However, we do see him walking on water and also passing through a crowd of leaders that wanted to grab him (Luke 4:28-30).

 

[mikesw]

#1 The pnuema is used of God Himself or the "Father". "God" is pneuma." (John 4:24) It is His Divine Nature that is spoken of. . . . #2 The word pneuma is used of Christ, the second Person of the Trinity. He, in resurrection, became a quickening or life-giving pneuma (1 Cor. 15:45) . . . (Word Studies of the Holy Spirit, p. 14,15)

As you see above he does mention "the second Person of the Trinity" --- I don't believe in the Trinity so I don't believe that Christ is the second person of the Trinity but I do believe Jesus was resurrection and became a life-giving spirit. As you can imagine there is a whole list of occurrences and usages of spirit with their corresponding verses and not all meanings have to do with being a 'person.'

Since I am not New Age then I don't know how they speak therefore I cannot stop doing something I don't recognize.


Yes, Jesus walked on water . . . what's that got to do with anything?
So, you believe Jesus poured out the third person of the Trinity on the day of Penecost . . . ok.

#14 Pneuma Hagion. This expression (which occurs fifty times) without articles, is never used of the Giver (the Holy Spirit), but always of His Gift. What this gift is may be seen by comparing Acts 1.4,5 with Luke xxiv. 49, where "the promise of the Father" is (in Acts) called pnuema hagion (holy spirit), and (in Luke) it is called "power from on high". This "power" includes whatever spiritual gifts the Holy Spirit may be pleased to bestow. . . . . Whenever spirit is said to fall, or to be given, or to fill, or be baptized with, it is always pneuma without the article, or pneuma hagion. (Word Studies on the Holy Spirit, p. 214)

Your thinking can be corrected while you are alive also!

After all these years, I think 'a better description of the Godhead' has given way to "it's a mystery" . . . .

so you went from knowledge to mystery and ignorance.

 

[mikesw]

Oh, but no I did not forget. I took the time to write down what he had said in his blog post.

I have changed my major doctrine once - from Trinitarian to Unitarian. Other specific areas, yes, I have also changed my mind.

However, moving from truth to heresy with a denial of critical passages is not the right direction.

 

[Peterlag]

You do not follow scripture very well. Jesus as the incarnation of God would be killed. That is the obvious point that you just totally missed. This is not ending God's "life" since he is spirit.
Remember the humbling? This meant Jesus was not going around striking people dead because he could. It is a basic principle that God establishes certain constraints in what he will do and how interaction with man would be done -- incorporated within promises -- like that to humanity given to Noah. So we could see that in Jesus where he does not go and say he is God during his incarnation just to avoid hundreds of attempts to stone him for what the Jews think as blasphemy.
Maybe someday you will realize what God can do and even what he has constrained himself not to do.
However, we do see him walking on water and also passing through a crowd of leaders that wanted to grab him (Luke 4:28-30).

Trinitarians commonly say that Jesus claimed to be God, and for that reason the Jews hated him and tried to kill him, but that is not the case because Jesus had been stating in various ways that he was the Messiah, and that is what the Jews were upset about. The Jews all throughout their history made a clear distinction between “God” and the “Messiah” and they did not think the Messiah was going to be God or a “Person” in a triune God.

 

[amazing grace]

so you went from knowledge to mystery and ignorance.

I don't believe so.

 

[mikesw]

Trinitarians commonly say that Jesus claimed to be God, and for that reason the Jews hated him and tried to kill him, but that is not the case because Jesus had been stating in various ways that he was the Messiah, and that is what the Jews were upset about. The Jews all throughout their history made a clear distinction between “God” and the “Messiah” and they did not think the Messiah was going to be God or a “Person” in a triune God.

If some say "they" tried to kill him for a claim to be God, then those Trinitarians have conflated the High Priest's response with the broader people's awareness. So you have a point of correction if we find that to be a true fact.
Only the leaders appear to have recognized the divinity claim made clearer only in the "trials" of Jesus at the end. But maybe some Bible translations forget to include Matt 26:64-68.

 

[amazing grace]

However, moving from truth to heresy with a denial of critical passages is not the right direction.

More like leaving idolatry and heresy of a Triune God to belief in the ONE true God, the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[mikesw]

More like leaving idolatry and heresy of a Triune God to belief in the ONE true God, the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

If you reject Trinitarian doctrine as if it were the polytheism heresy, no wonder you are confused. Jesus was never suggested to be a separate god. Just remember that detail when you try to deny the scriptural testimony of the Triune God.

 

[amazing grace]

If you reject Trinitarian doctrine as if it were the polytheism heresy, no wonder you are confused. Jesus was never suggested to be a separate god. Just remember that detail when you try to deny the scriptural testimony of the Triune God.

Let's see: we have God the Father who dwells in heaven . . . we have God the Son, a 'human nature', who is God in the flesh on earth and we have God the Holy Spirit. Each of these 'persons' but not 'persons' as to the normal definition, but in a specific way known only to Trinitarians . . . Each are distinct (normal definition for distinct - recognizably different in nature from something else of a similar type) and separate (normal definition for separate - forming or viewed as a unit apart or by itself) yet ONE in nature, essence (please note definition for distinct). . . three separate and distinct beings, things, whatever are NOT ONE.
I'M CONFUSED!!!!!! It's not me who is confused - I have one God who is also known as the Holy Spirit and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who pours out the gift of holy spirit to whoever repents and believes. . . in simplistic terms anyone can understand.

Those who believe in said Trinity can not explain it in a manner that is understandable to others (nor to themselves!) so they have to claim that it's a mystery. Thanks but no thanks -

 

[mikesw]

Let's see: we have God the Father who dwells in heaven . . . we have God the Son, a 'human nature', who is God in the flesh on earth and we have God the Holy Spirit. Each of these 'persons' but not 'persons' as to the normal definition, but in a specific way known only to Trinitarians . .

you really should stay out of trinitarian discussions if you do not know how "person" is used in these. As to "human nature," I'm not sure how exactly that applies and may be an unanswerable metaphysical issue in the incarnation of the Son of God. I do not think you are fully ignorant of the philosophical concept but maybe you are.

. Each are distinct (normal definition for distinct - recognizably different in nature from something else of a similar type) and separate (normal definition for separate - forming or viewed as a unit apart or by itself) yet ONE in nature, essence (please note definition for distinct). . . three separate and distinct beings, things, whatever are NOT ONE.
I'M CONFUSED!!!!!! It's not me who is confused -

I know you are confused. That explains why you do not hold to orthodox understanding. Just remember that Christ Jesus cannot be a separate god, as some unitarians push the argument. Therefore, Jesus must be of the same God, as found in John 1:18.

I have one God who is also known as the Holy Spirit and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who pours out the gift of holy spirit to whoever repents and believes. . . in simplistic terms anyone can understand.

Great. If you realize it is one God, that is a start. Just remember the divinity of Christ in this. The goal is not to find something anyone can understand. The goal is to know Christ Jesus in his full sense.

Those who believe in said Trinity can not explain it in a manner that is understandable to others (nor to themselves!) so they have to claim that it's a mystery. Thanks but no thanks -

You said you like keeping it a mystery. Only Jesus has revealed God because he is God incarnate although God in purely spirit sense is invisible.