Acts 22:16 Paul's salvation

Sorry but you err

Colossians 2:13 (KJV 1900) — 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

forgiveness precedes regeneration - being made alive
Yes, forgiveness precedes regeneration which precedes the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
First forgiveness/justification,
Then regeneration/rebirth,
Then indwelling.
All of this takes place DURING water baptism, but they happen in that order in the same instant
 
Yes, forgiveness precedes regeneration which precedes the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
First forgiveness/justification,
Then regeneration/rebirth,
Then indwelling.
All of this takes place DURING water baptism, but they happen in that order in the same instant
Nope you ignored both scripture and systematic theology which show regeneration is a feature of the Spirit's indwelling

Regeneration is by way of the Indwelling spirit

John 7:38 (KJV 1900) — 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.


John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

 
Nope you ignored both scripture and systematic theology which show regeneration is a feature of the Spirit's indwelling

Regeneration is by way of the Indwelling spirit

John 7:38 (KJV 1900) — 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.


John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Yes, forgiveness precedes regeneration which precedes the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
First forgiveness/justification,
Then regeneration/rebirth,
Then indwelling.
All of this takes place DURING water baptism, but they happen in that order in the same instant
There is no indication of any order associated with forgiveness/justification, regeneration/rebirth and indwelling/sanctification. They all occur at the same instant in time in the life of the believer when he is baptized. Given that they all occur instantaneously, there cannot be any order indicated.

The order of salvation, if you wish to think of it that way is hear, believe (have faith), repent, be baptized.
 
Nope you ignored both scripture and systematic theology which show regeneration is a feature of the Spirit's indwelling

Regeneration is by way of the Indwelling spirit

John 7:38 (KJV 1900) — 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.


John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
No, regeneration is not by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. The indwelling is a result of regeneration.
Rom 6:1-7 shows that the The Holy Spirit removes our sins and then He resurrects us, just as Jesus died and then was resurrected.
There is no indication of any order associated with forgiveness/justification, regeneration/rebirth and indwelling/sanctification. They all occur at the same instant in time in the life of the believer when he is baptized. Given that they all occur instantaneously, there cannot be any order indicated.

The order of salvation, if you wish to think of it that way is hear, believe (have faith), repent, be baptized.
Clearly there is an "order" to it, because one cannot be reborn while they are still in sin. And the Holy Spirit does not move into the old person's heart. Only the new man's heart is pure, and a place where the Holy Spirit will reside.

Yes, the "order of salvation" is 1. hear, 2. believe 3. repent/confess Jesus 4. be baptized. All of these are prerequisites for salvation according to Scripture. And the order of actions taken by the Holy Spirit during baptism are removing sin/dying to sin, then regeneration/being born again, and then receiving the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
 
No, regeneration is not by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. The indwelling is a result of regeneration.
Rom 6:1-7 shows that the The Holy Spirit removes our sins and then He resurrects us, just as Jesus died and then was resurrected.
But it all happens at one and the same instant in time.
 
No, regeneration is not by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. The indwelling is a result of regeneration.
Rom 6:1-7 shows that the The Holy Spirit removes our sins and then He resurrects us, just as Jesus died and then was resurrected.
Sorry you provided nothing to show that.

Instead you ignored both scripture and systematic theology

John 7:38 (KJV 1900) — 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.


John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Regeneration. A biblical motif of salvation that emphasizes the rebirth or re-creation of fallen human beings by the indwelling Holy Spirit. One central biblical text depicting salvation as regeneration is Jesus’ conversation with Nicodemus in which he emphasized the necessity of being “born again” (Jn 3:1–21). Pocket dictionary of Theological terms

The perfect tense “has given” denotes the resultant indwelling of the Spirit imparted at regeneration. In 3:24 use of the aorist tense asserted the historical

Bibliotheca Sacra: A Quarterly Published by Dallas Theological Seminary (Dallas, TX: Dallas Theological Seminary, 1955–1995).

The Holy Spirit applies the benefits of salvation to those whom he indwells. The indwelling of the Spirit is both corporate and individual; Christ’s church is his temple, as are individual Christians. In regeneration, the Spirit gives new life to the believer, birthing a new creation.

Susanne Calhoun, “The Spirit’s Indwelling,” in Lexham Survey of Theology (ed. Mark Ward et al.; Bellingham, WA: Lexham Press, 2018).

Regeneration. That mighty work of the Holy Spirit of God whereby one is “delivered out of the power of darkness and translated into the kingdom of the Son of his love” (Col. 1:13; comp. 1 Pet. 2:9) is spoken of in John 3:5–8, as being “born of the Spirit.” Whosoever is thus begotten of God is conceived as a “new creation” (2 Cor. 5:17; Gal. 6:15), “created in Christ Jesus for good works” (Eph. 2:10), “the new man, who after God hath been created in righteousness and holiness of truth” (Eph. 4:24). This mighty change is also conceived as being raised from the dead so as to “walk in newness of life” (Rom. 6:4); and even the quickening of our mortal bodies into the resurrection life is through the power of the indwelling Spirit (Rom. 8:11)

Milton S. Terry, Biblical Dogmatics: An Exposition of the Principal Doctrines of the Holy Scriptures (New York; Cincinnati: Eaton & Mains; Jennings & Graham, 1907), 499.


Regeneration is the divine action by which God renews the fallen creation so that it reflects his character.

For human beings, regeneration is the answer to the corruption of moral character caused by sin. It is essential for participation in the kingdom of God (John 3:3). At conversion, God grants the believer new life and a new identity in Christ. This event is so powerful that John refers to it as a new birth, a birth “from above” (John 3:3), while Paul refers to it as a “new creation” (2 Cor 5:17). In either case, the change is brought about by the Holy Spirit, who comes to indwell the believer.

Brenda B. Colijn, “Regeneration,” in Lexham Survey of Theology (ed. Mark Ward et al.; Bellingham, WA: Lexham Press, 2018).
 
There is no indication of any order associated with forgiveness/justification, regeneration/rebirth and indwelling/sanctification. They all occur at the same instant in time in the life of the believer when he is baptized. Given that they all occur instantaneously, there cannot be any order indicated.

The order of salvation, if you wish to think of it that way is hear, believe (have faith), repent, be baptized.
I would say

There is a logical order

The Holy Spirit will not indwell an unclean vessel and it is the indwelling presense of the Holy Spirit which is the source of life
 
I would say

There is a logical order

The Holy Spirit will not indwell an unclean vessel and it is the indwelling presense of the Holy Spirit which is the source of life
Being born of water and Spirit is the cleaning of the vessel concomitant with the receiving of the gift, the indwelling, of the Holy Spirit.
 
Being born of water and Spirit is the cleaning of the vessel concomitant with the receiving of the gift, the indwelling, of the Holy Spirit.
It is the holy Spirit indwelling which imparts life which is regeneration

John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
 
It is the holy Spirit indwelling which imparts life which is regeneration

John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
To be born again is regeneration.
 
Acts 22:16 "Acts 22:16 — The New King James Version (NKJV) 16 And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.’

Paul tells us that he did not receive or hear the gospel from Ananias, but rather he heard it directly from Christ:

Gal. 1:11-12 " ... the gospel ... I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ." So we know that Paul heard and believed in Christ on the road to Damascus, even before Ananias came to him. That was indeed a revelation of Jesus Christ. But listen to Paul's own account on his way to Damacus:
"I saw on the way a light from heaven ... and I heard a voice saying to me in the Hebrew dialect, 'Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me? It is hard for you to kick against the goads.' And I said, 'Who are You, Lord?' And the Lord said, 'I am Jesus whom you are persecuting. But get up and stand on your feet; for this purpose I have appeared to you, to appoint you as a servant and a witness not only to the things in which you have seen Me, but also to the things in which I will appear to you, rescuing you from the Jewish people and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you, to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me." Acts 26:13-18

So if Jesus was sending Paul to both Jewish and Gentile people "to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Him,

then what are the chances that Paul himself did not have:

1. his eyes opened (spiritually) so that he turned from darkness to light and that
2. he had not been rescued from the power of Satan to God,
3. and that he did not receive forgiveness of sins,
4. and that he did not receive an inheritance among those who had been sanctified by faith in Him?

Answer: The chances are slim to zero. Jesus would not send Paul to facilitate all these things in others, if He had not first accomplished all these things in Paul himself.

So on the road to Damascus, Paul had his eyes opened (spiritually) and he turned from darkness to light, and he was rescued from the power of Satan to God, and his sins were forgiven, and he received an inheritance among those who had been sanctified (saved) by faith in Him.

Paul was saved, delivered, forgiven, given an inheritance with those who were saved by faith (not baptism), and indwelt by the Holy Spirit - all on the road to Damascus, before Ananias even came to him.

How do we know that he received the indwelling Holy Spirit on that road (which happens to every person who gets saved)? Didn't Paul receive the indwelling Holy Spirit three days later, when Ananias laid hands on him?
Actually no, he was already indwelt by the Holy Spirit when he believed, on the road to Damascus. When Ananias laid hands on him, he was filled with the Holy Spirit, just like the 120 people in the upper room. They were already indwelt by the Holy Spirit, but on the Day of Pentecost, they were filled with the Holy Spirit, or baptized in the Holy Spirit, as Jesus promised in Acts 1:5. When one is saved they are immediately indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Later they may receive the baptism in the Holy Spirit, if they desire it - many do not, for whatever reason they don't want it.

So really, the only things that happened when Ananias laid hands on Paul was 1. he regained his sight and 2. he was baptized and 3. Ananias encouraged him.

No salvation or forgiveness of sins or indwelling of the Holy Spirit occurred when Ananias baptized him. They had already happened three days before.
What is meant by Ananias' command to "wash away your sins, calling on his name"? If his sins had already been forgiven, what is that all about? If his sins had already been forgiven, then what was there to "wash away"?
 
Logically, when two things occur in the same instant in time, neither precedes the other.
No there is a logical order

For example

you cannot be forgiven without faith/repentance

You cannot be saved unless first you believe
 
But it all happens at one and the same instant in time.
Yes, and no. In a physical sense, it all happens at the same instant. But in a spiritual sense, there is infinite time during the moment when the person is under the water. In that infinite moment, the Spirit can cut our sin from us, cause the old man to die, then resurrect the person as a new creation, and set us habitation in that new heart. But the Holy Spirit cannot set up His habitation within the old man's heart, so that person must die first.
 
Sorry you provided nothing to show that.

Instead you ignored both scripture and systematic theology

John 7:38 (KJV 1900) — 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.


John 4:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
I have not ignored Scripture, but I have rightly ignored much of your humanistic system of falsely understanding the Scriptures.

The two verses you quoted above have nothing whatsoever to do with this conversation. The Holy Spirit is certainly analogous to the water that is depicted flowing out from the resurrected heart. But there is nothing in either verse that gives a correlation between the regeneration of the heart and the indwelling presence of the Spirit.
 
No there is a logical order

For example

you cannot be forgiven without faith/repentance

You cannot be saved unless first you believe
Yes, all of that is correct. However, all of that, namely, hearing, believing, and repenting, happens prior to baptism for the forgiveness of sins and receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit. Thus it is in baptism that justification (forgiveness of sins) and regeneration (receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit) occurs instantaneously.

The hearing, believing and repenting may actually happen over a period of days, weeks, months or even years.
 
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Yes, all of that is correct. However, all of that, namely, hearing, believing, and repenting, happens prior to baptism for the forgiveness of sins and receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit.

The gift of the Holy Spirit was received (Acts 10:45) before water baptism (Acts 10:48).
 
The gift of the Holy Spirit was received (Acts 10:45) before water baptism (Acts 10:48).
That was not the gift of the indwelling Holy Spirit as in Acts 2:38; rather that was the gift of the empowering Holy Spirit as in Acts 2:4. We know that because upon receiving that gift of the Holy Spirit, they began speaking in tongues (Acts 10:46). The empowering Holy Spirit was not an indication of salvation. That had been happening throughout OT times, and not always just to people or believers.
 
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