"Works Salvation"

[Eternally-Grateful]

That is eisegesis at its worst!! It is rewriting God's word to support your own false teaching. The words there are not PLACED INTO, but rather IMMERSED INTO.

Its interpreting the word.

have you actually stuidied the greek word? Have you studied greek histroy and how the word was used. Do youi uinderstand in greek society what a baptizer did?

it does not appear like it.. Your taking an english translation and a church translation. and missing the whole word.

I translated it literally using a possible interpretation for the greek word Baptizo.

So what? The word immerse is certainly a native English word.

so is being placed into

If I am immersed or placed into something, does it matter what word I use.

of course not

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

AMEN!

In fact, in Matthew 28:19-20, the words baptizing and teaching or participles modifying the command "make" disciples. It describes the actual procedure for making disciples. Baptizing and teaching is not a description of what is done to disciples but rather how disciples are made.

John the baptist

I indeed baptize in water, he will baptize with the hs and fire

Jesus. You will be baptized with the HS

Paul. they were baptized into moses.

so you are both wrong on all counts

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Baptism is not a native English word, in that you are correct. It means "immersed". And as I said, there is only one immersion in the NT Church. And that one immersion requires water, and human action to accomplish.

it means much more than this.

study the greek word and greek literature in which the word was used. to see how they saw the word.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Where did he give that number?

1. the final seven years of Daniels 70 weeks have not yet
2. Then we have Christ returning at the end of this period. to put an end to Daniel's final beast (New Rome) and we are told he will rule with a rod of Iron for 1000 years.

that gives us at least 1007 years after the future prince signs a covenant with many as in daniel 9.

the problem is I do not think we will know when that happens. the next sign is the abomination of desolation which occurs in the middle of that week. In which Jesus told everyone to run, because then their will be great tribulation.. Jesus puts and end to this at his return. (matt 24)

 

[brightfame52]

@Tothalordbeallglory

Rather odd this is . The GOSPEL as a WORD of salvation is sent
TO THE WORLD ,

It makes perfectly good sense to me since the saved elect are scatter throughout the world.

 

[brightfame52]

Oh good grief! What was called common or unclean in verse 14 was the food presented to Peter in the vision. What was declared to be cleansed in verse 14 was that food. It was a message to Peter that God no longer separated the Gentiles from the Jews in His plan of salvation for mankind. It was not a declaration of the salvation for any particular individual, Jew or Gentile. The barrier that that had existed between the Jew and the whole rest of mankind, the Gentile, was broken down ant the whole world was to be admitted to the same fellowship and privileges in the gospel.

And by the way, you are not the standard that any should go by.

You can good grief all you want. Cornelius was a forgiven man way b4 Peter preached to him to believe.

 

[Red Baker]

@DavidTree

Cornelius obeyed the Gospel = Acts chapter 10

David, what nature obeyed God, his old adamic nature, where there is no good thing, or, his new nature that had been created after the image of Jesus Christ? I will allow you to answer this question.

 

[Red Baker]

@brightfame52 @Jim

Cornelius was a forgiven man way b4 Peter preached to him to believe.

Of course he was, and this can be easily proven.

 

[Red Baker]

@Seabass

Good works cannot earn the atheist salvation, the atheist must obey the gospel (2 Thess 1:8) to be saved then do good works Tts 2:14; Tts 3:8,14.

What do you think obeying is? So, you have the sinner obeying God first, then get saved, and then do good works! That sound par for the course of the average church goer.

 

[DavidTree]

@Tothalordbeallglory



To be saved not hear and get saved. Cornelius was already saved, but he needed assurance, and God through Peter sent him the message of his salvation, now he can know and be saved in his own mind and heart. The Gospel as a word of Salvation is only sent to the saved, not to the lost perishing.

@DavidTree

David, what nature obeyed God, his old adamic nature, where there is no good thing, or, his new nature that had been created after the image of Jesus Christ? I will allow you to answer this question.

i love Acts ch10/Cornelius

Before Peter was sent by the Lord to Cornelius we know that he was hearing the Word of God thru the Jewish people.
For the FATHER was already at work in Cornelius heart

There is a GREAT Precedent that God set in Acts chapter = can you see it

 

[FreeInChrist]

Eph 2: 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
2: 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

IOW..Faith is not considered a work in the context of salvation; rather, it is viewed as a gift from God that does not rely on human effort. The Bible teaches that we are saved by grace through faith, not by our works

Requiring anything in addition to faith in Jesus Christ for salvation is a works-based salvation. To add anything to the gospel is to say that Jesus’ death on the cross was not sufficient to purchase our salvation. To say that baptism is necessary for salvation is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ’s death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus’ death alone paid for our sins

But you all are certainly entitled to your opinions....

 

[DavidTree]

Eph 2: 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
2: 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

IOW..Faith is not considered a work in the context of salvation; rather, it is viewed as a gift from God that does not rely on human effort. The Bible teaches that we are saved by grace through faith, not by our works

Requiring anything in addition to faith in Jesus Christ for salvation is a works-based salvation. To add anything to the gospel is to say that Jesus’ death on the cross was not sufficient to purchase our salvation. To say that baptism is necessary for salvation is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ’s death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus’ death alone paid for our sins

But you all are certainly entitled to your opinions....

Would you like to SEE the OT equivalent to your post???

 

[Red Baker]

@Seabass

without God graciously giving man the gospel of Christ, salvation would be impossible.

Very thankful for the gospel of Jesus Christ, yet that of itself does nothing for anyone ~ one should be more thankful that God first gives his people a heart to believe and love it, or else it would be a savour unto eternal death.

2nd Corinthians 2:16​

“To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?”

 

[Doug Brents]

it means much more than this.

study the greek word and greek literature in which the word was used. to see how they saw the word.

I have studied the word "baptizo" in the Greek, and it is used to mean "to immerse," "to submerge," or "to dip". It can also imply cleansing by immersion, or even being overwhelmed.

But again, there is only one immersion/baptism in the NT Church. And it is not "Spirit immersion/baptism", although the Spirit is definitely involved in baptism/immersion. The one baptism/immersion in the NT Church requires/demands/is not NT baptism without water (1 Pet 3:21) and human action (Matt 28:19). Without water and human action you don't have NT baptism/immersion.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Would you like to SEE the OT equivalent to your post???

Not particularly for the reason we were sent Christ Jesus. It is only things in the NT that should apply to our salvations.

Unless you are going to post Ezekiel 36:25.

Or unless you are going to quote from a specific Confession which says "III. Dipping of the person into the water is not necessary; but baptism is rightly administered by pouring or sprinkling water upon the person."

 

[Red Baker]

@FreeInChrist

Eph 2: 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
2: 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

IOW..Faith is not considered a work in the context of salvation; rather, it is viewed as a gift from God that does not rely on human effort. The Bible teaches that we are saved by grace through faith, not by our works

Requiring anything in addition to faith in Jesus Christ for salvation is a works-based salvation. To add anything to the gospel is to say that Jesus’ death on the cross was not sufficient to purchase our salvation. To say that baptism is necessary for salvation is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ’s death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus’ death alone paid for our sins

But you all are certainly entitled to your opinions....

Brother, you are close, much more so than those who have a work gospel they are peddling. Consider my notes on Ephesians 2:8, if you would please.

"In Ephesians 2:8 we have a classic example of an metonymy. The only faith that saves us legally is the faith of Christ, for no man can have faith in God, the faith that meets the requirement of a Royal law, a faith that is produce by perfect obedience to its laws! Jesus Christ alone had the faith that honoured God's law in all points, from conception, to death, in thoughts, words, and deeds ~ and this faith alone is the means of man's free justification. This faith is not of ourselves, it is the gift of God secured for God's elect by our surety, Jesus Christ. This faith is given to us in regeneration when the Spirit of God creates a new man within us after the image of his Son, Jesus Christ.

When a man hears and believes, it is not the old man (for that is impossible) but his new man that is a creative work in God's elect by the almighty power of God~this birth happens to a child of God sometimes after conception and before death, and is evidenced by faith and obedience to the word of God. Two prime examples of this is John the the Baptist and the thief on the cross.

I could spend more time proving the metonymy in Ephesians 2:8 by the context in just before verse 8, in verses: 4-6..."But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:"

We were IN CHRIST from all eternity, even while he lived in this world and in his death and resurrection, which secured our redemption for us. What he did, it was as though we did it, what happen to Christ happened to us legally speaking two thousand years ago."

Brother this is the truth of Ephesians 2:8, not because I put this together, but because it can be supported by the word of God when ALL scriptures are compare ~ it will flow perfectly with them all, for only then can we know we have the truth or not. All of God's children said amen, amen.

 

[DavidTree]

I have studied the word "baptizo" in the Greek, and it is used to mean "to immerse," "to submerge," or "to dip". It can also imply cleansing by immersion, or even being overwhelmed.

But again, there is only one immersion/baptism in the NT Church. And it is not "Spirit immersion/baptism", although the Spirit is definitely involved in baptism/immersion. The one baptism/immersion in the NT Church requires/demands/is not NT baptism without water (1 Pet 3:21) and human action (Matt 28:19). Without water and human action you don't have NT baptism/immersion.

water is wet and cannot save = let's SEE what Peter wrote

For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water. There is also SYMBOLIC which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him.

 

[DavidTree]

Not particularly for the reason we were sent Christ Jesus. It is only things in the NT that should apply to our salvations.

Unless you are going to post Ezekiel 36:25.

ok, if you do not want to know

 

[FreeInChrist]

ok, if you do not want to know

Well, I know I should so yes I do want to know. Please

 

[Doug Brents]

water is wet and cannot save =

So water cannot save us because it is wet??????? Huh??????

let's SEE what Peter wrote

For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water. There is also SYMBOLIC which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him.

1 Pet 3:21 says that the water of the Flood is symbolic of what now saves you: baptism. The Flood was the symbol, not baptism. But the baptism that saves us must have water (John 3:5) to fit the symbol.