The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil

[jeremiah1five]

The promise is to Abraham, and as Hebrews says, the seed mentioned is Jesus. And by that seed (Jesus) the nations of the world will be blessed.

There is no covenant between God and Gentiles.
Under the Law the animal sacrifice was commanded slain by God for the yearly temporary atonement of the children of Israel. At one point the high priest sprinkled the blood of the animal upon the people. Christ said He came to fulfill the Law, NOT end it. And fulfill it He did. Just as the animal sacrifice was slain to atone for the children of Israel, so too, did Jesus Christ die to atone for the sins of the children of Israel. He obeyed the Law perfectly. His blood was shed to atone for the sins of the children of Israel. To claim Jesus died for Gentiles when there is no Scripture that says this, and to teach Jesus died for all men is to make Jesus change the Law which is to destroy the Law. So, either Jesus changed the Law thereby destroying the Law or your interpretation of Scripture is wrong.
Your interpretation of Scripture is wrong. Jesus did not change the Law to add Gentiles for Gentiles were never under the Law to begin with. Gentiles were never included in the covenants between God and Israel.

I never said He did because Jesus didn't have to. God expanded the gospel to include the gospel, and even Peter directly spoke to this when he discussed what happened with Cornelius to the Jewish leaders in the church. Peter recognized God's hand in saving the non-Jewish Gentiles, and ALSO giving them the Holy Spirit, and making that clear by having these Gentiles speaking in tongues like the Jews did. It speaks to the unity in the body of Christ, the church. And you will notice that in speaking of the church, there is no mention of any covenant. What else did Peter say about what happened with the non-Jewish Gentiles? Consider this take on Acts 11
"15 “As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. 16 Then I remembered what the Lord had said: ‘John baptized with[a] water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17 So if God gave them the same gift he gave us who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could stand in God’s way?”

18 When they heard this, they had no further objections and praised God, saying, “So then, even to Gentiles God has granted repentance that leads to life.”

God has granted.
Acts 15
" 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

Note even Peter says that the jews are saved by grace, not by any covenant. What did Peter have to say about the covenant? He called it a yoke that neither they nor their ancestors have been able to bear. How do we know he speaks of the covenant?
"5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”"

Why circumcised? A requirement of the covenant. And then, they also need to keep the law of Moses. So if you are looking for a Bible verse that talks about Gentiles under covenant and Law... HERE IT IS. However, this was outright rejected as any kind of requirement by not only Peter, but by the church council as a whole, as being contrary to what God wanted. God saved these non-Jewish Gentiles without it, why force it on them when even they and their ancestors could not bear it.

BTW what these pharisees were saying was that these non-Jewish Gentiles had to proselytize. This runs contrary to what Paul said in Galatians. Paul had been fighting the so called Judaizers (the faith you apparently belong to) for some time. Peter fought against them as well, especially after Paul basically attacked Peter for hypocrisy. Stop being a Judaizer. Paul had things to say against the Gentiles as well. What was that?

Romans 11:
"13 I am talking to you Gentiles. Inasmuch as I am the apostle to the Gentiles, I take pride in my ministry 14 in the hope that I may somehow arouse my own people to envy and save some of them. [Paul is speaking of the Jews here] 15 For if their rejection brought reconciliation to the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead? 16 If the part of the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, then the whole batch is holy; if the root is holy, so are the branches.

17 If some of the branches have been broken off [Jews], and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others [non-Jewish Gentiles] and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, 18 do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but tremble. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either.

22 Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off.

Paul wrote against haughty, proud Gentiles who would speak out against the Jewish unbelievers. (Some of whom would eventually/possibly come to believe in Jesus and be grafted back in.) Notice how Paul doesn't mention the covenant even once, but mentions faith strongly. YOU STAND BY FAITH. It is by kindness that God extended salvation to the Gentiles, but if one becomes proud/haughty, and does not continue within the kindness God has shown, they will be cut off just like the JEWS were. (Jews who rejected Christ. Again, if they come to accept Christ and believe in Him, they will be immediately grafted back in. Easily, since they are native/natural branches.) Do note that Paul is very clear that Gentiles are foreigners to the cultured olive vine/tree. who are there solely due to the kindness of God.

Once again, Saul always gave his name in the non-Jewish Gentile form of PAUL, because God had sent PAUL to the Gentiles. And no, Paul makes it clear that salvation is through faith. For by grace you have been saved, through faith... Not once in Ephesians 2:8-9 is a covenant mentioned, and it makes it clear that God is the one who saved them. No room to boast, so being Jewish... nope. Not a reason one is saved. One is saved by God's grace.

That has nothing to do with it. What did Jesu say about all of this? God could raise up descendants of Abraham from rocks. Did you know that proselytes don't have any Jewish ancestry? That's why they are proselytes. Yet Acts is clear that these proselytes were among those saved at Peter's speech in Jerusalem. (I know, you completely change what the Bible says, and that it doesn't mean they were there, even though it says they were explicitly.) Those who had a Jewish ancestor and chose their Jewish heritage were not known as proselytes, they were known as converts in Hebrew. (I don't remember the Hebrew word.) It does not translate as proselyte, but as convert.

Your interpretation is in error.
God did not change the Law to include Gentiles. If He did then show me the Scripture from the Old Testament that says God did.
In fact, God says what He means, and He means what He says. Not even God can change the Mosaic Covenant - or any covenant - because God's Word is as the say, written on stone. To change the Law requires a stonecutter with hammer to chisel the change of the Law thereby destroying the tablets upon which the Law was written by the finger of God.

Your interpretation is wrong. Jesus died in accordance with the Law and in doing so fulfilled the Law. Any change would destroy the Law. If God wanted to save Gentiles, then Jesus as High Priest would have prayed Gentiles in but Jesus does not pray for Gentiles, nor are they included in His offering for sin. Gentiles are not included in any covenants between God and Israel.
That is that.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Mostly the rubbish of a Judaizer. There is nothing in much of anything you have to say that should interest any Christian, whether Jew of Gentile.

Remain ignorant. What I posted can be verified if one is honest with God and Scripture.
You are neither. You post that Jesus added Gentiles to the Law but there is no Scripture to back that up.
The New Covenant is upon Israel, and they are the recipients of a salvation of the LORD.

If Jesus wanted to include Gentiles, He would have prayed for them right before offering Himself to Israel, the apple of God's eye. But He didn't and He says He didn't.

9 I pray for them [Israel]: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
John 17:8–9.

You must do something about this Holy of Holies prayer by Jesus. He clearly states that His offering of Himself is NOT for the world, NOT for Gentiles, NOT.

 

[101G]

here is no covenant between God and Gentiles.

also to, @armylngst. jeremiah1five, this is the most IGNORANT answer as can be. this jew and gentile mess is over, .... Please get out of IGNORANCE. God made a covenant with people who are of faith. and being jew or gentile is irrelevant, which shows those who subscribe to this jew or gentile is still in the flesh and still in their sins. for God made all nations from ONE BLOOD. Acts 17:26 "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;" .

that should put an IGNORANT end to that IGNORANT nonsense about jews and gentiles. there is NO NATIONALITY IN GOD.

this puts the nail in the coffin. LISTEN and LEARN, Romans 2:28 "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:" Romans 2:29 "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

NOW THE COVENANT OF FAITH,
Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law." Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.", (READ THAT AGAIN J5). Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed." Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster." Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ." Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:29 "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

BINGO, "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

Abram became a father of ... "MANY NATIONS" ... by FAITH, hence the name change. Genesis 17:4 "As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations." Genesis 17:5 "Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee."

NOW GET THIS J5, Genesis 17:7 "And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee."

seed, one and not MANY as in seed(s) with the s at the end, only ONE "SEED". supportive scripture, Galatians 3:16 "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ." BINGO, "seed", one seed ... Christ, for it is by FAITH, and NOT by, NATIONALTY, GENDER, or RACE, the promise is made to those who BELIEVE in God through Jesus the Christ. so the covenant is Spiritually by Faith.

101G

 

[Jim]

@101G, You must know by now that @jeremiah1five rejects the NT as being the word of God.

 

[101G]

@101G, You must know by now that @jeremiah1five rejects the NT as being the word of God.

Greeting my brother in Christ, Yes, but even the most rebellious must hear the truth.

peace,

101G.

 

[Jim]

Greeting my brother in Christ, Yes, but even the most rebellious must hear the truth.

peace,

101G.

Yes, but he has heard the truth and rejected it. Or in the words of the Bible, he cannot hear. With such a one, it is not that they do not believe, rather it is that they have disbelieved, perhaps a very subtle difference.

 

[101G]

Yes, but he has heard the truth and rejected it. Or in the words of the Bible, he cannot hear.

true, but as with the apostle Paul, 2 Corinthians 5:11 "Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences."

understand, 101G was once bull-headed .... just like J5, and strongly believe in 101G's heart that what 101G's teachers taught 101G was true. and it took years before God himself intervein in my life to show 101G the true meaning of his Word of LIFE is all about. but 101G need to know the error of his doctrine that was taught him, in order to clearly understand his doctrine the truth. so, as the apostle Paul, LET THEM HEAR the TRUTH until God intervenes while they yet are in the flesh in this LIFE.

hope that helps 101G's positions for you to understand why 101G still engage with the most hard-hearts.

be blessed,

101G.

 

[Jim]

true, but as with the apostle Paul, 2 Corinthians 5:11 "Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences."

understand, 101G was once bull-headed .... just like J5, and strongly believe in 101G's heart that what 101G's teachers taught 101G was true. and it took years before God himself intervein in my life to show 101G the true meaning of his Word of LIFE is all about. but 101G need to know the error of his doctrine that was taught him, in order to clearly understand his doctrine the truth. so, as the apostle Paul, LET THEM HEAR the TRUTH until God intervenes while they yet are in the flesh in this LIFE.

hope that helps 101G's positions for you to understand why 101G still engage with the most hard-hearts.

be blessed,

101G.

Did the true meaning you came to result from another's teaching or from your own studies?

 

[101G]

Did the true meaning you came to result from another's teaching or from your own studies?

From the Lord God almighty himself, JESUS.

101G.

 

[jeremiah1five]

also to, @armylngst. jeremiah1five, this is the most IGNORANT answer as can be. this jew and gentile mess is over, .... Please get out of IGNORANCE. God made a covenant with people who are of faith. and being jew or gentile is irrelevant, which shows those who subscribe to this jew or gentile is still in the flesh and still in their sins. for God made all nations from ONE BLOOD. Acts 17:26 "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;" .

that should put an IGNORANT end to that IGNORANT nonsense about jews and gentiles. there is NO NATIONALITY IN GOD.

this puts the nail in the coffin. LISTEN and LEARN, Romans 2:28 "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:" Romans 2:29 "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

NOW THE COVENANT OF FAITH,
Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law." Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.", (READ THAT AGAIN J5). Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed." Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster." Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ." Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:29 "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

BINGO, "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

Abram became a father of ... "MANY NATIONS" ... by FAITH, hence the name change. Genesis 17:4 "As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations." Genesis 17:5 "Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee."

NOW GET THIS J5, Genesis 17:7 "And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee."

seed, one and not MANY as in seed(s) with the s at the end, only ONE "SEED". supportive scripture, Galatians 3:16 "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ." BINGO, "seed", one seed ... Christ, for it is by FAITH, and NOT by, NATIONALTY, GENDER, or RACE, the promise is made to those who BELIEVE in God through Jesus the Christ. so the covenant is Spiritually by Faith.

101G

The three Hebrew covenants are recorded and described in the Old Testament. Use those original texts when and where the covenants are recorded to show me whether Gentiles are included in these three Hebrew covenants. Using letters from Saul is NOT any covenant. But he only discusses the covenants he doesn't establish any covenant. He studied the Old Testament and he makes commentary in his letters as to his understanding of these covenants. So, if you want to discuss what's in these covenants go to where in the Old Testament these covenants are established by God and the terms of them.
I've already looked at the three Hebrew covenants - Abraham, Mosaic, and New) and according to the text and terms of these covenants there are NO GENTILES included in the three HEBREW covenants.
Sorry.

 

[jeremiah1five]

@101G, You must know by now that @jeremiah1five rejects the NT as being the word of God.

I reject those that elevate general letters and personal letters of these apostles to that of Israel's prophets who were commanded to write their prophecies in a "book."
Saul, Peter, James, etc., wrote letters to their fellow Jews and Jewish Christians. Their purpose was to discuss Israel and her relationship with God not to make a bible. There's a big difference. Besides this, Gentiles gathered these scrolls in the fourth century and without permission from God decided to make a bible ("book") of their letters and make a bible (book.)
God never told them to do this. Nor did the apostles know someone three hundred years later was going to use their letters to make a bible. They are only letters. They are not prophetic utterances from authorized command of God to make a bible. The Old Testament prophets were authorized and commanded to write down their prophecies they gave to Israel.

They were letters. Do you even understand the difference between personal letters that someone - GENTILES - would gather with other letters and to make a book as opposed to actual prophets sent by God to Israel and Judah for a specific purpose according to God's command and will? The bottom line is these men wrote letters to Jews and Jewish Christians living in Gentile lands to discuss their understanding of the New Covenant era Israel found herself in after the Holy Spirit of Promise PROMISED TO ISRAEL - had come as promised by Christ. The Gentiles that gathered their letters did not have authorized permission by God to do such a thing and then claim it is on equal footing as the prophets of God. The prophets who prophesied were also commanded to write their histories and prophecies and Israel was to maintain their keeping, to copy them for each generation of Jews or when the originals became torn and tattered.
Gentiles who were left in charge of the Church Christ was building because Jews were defeated by Rome and scattered across the Roman Empire who passed laws prohibiting Jews from returning to their land. Had there been no Roman destruction of Israel and her Temple there would be no Gentile bible which Gentiles tried to pass off as equal in authority to Israel's prophets.

And with that a new religion was born.
What it was actually was Gentile's stealing Israel's birthright and their inheritance to make it their own.
Stealing is a sin.

 

[armylngst]

There is no covenant between God and Gentiles.

How many times have I told you that that doesn't matter. What did God tell Abraham? He promised Abraham that in His seed, which the author of Hebrews said is Jesus Christ, the nations of the WORLD would be blessed. Why do you make God a liar? The nations of the world benefit from the obedience Abraham showed before God. They are blessed by the faith Abraham showed, when they come to Christ in faith. There is no mention of any covenant in any of that, but you REFUSE to recognize that.

Under the Law the animal sacrifice was commanded slain by God for the yearly temporary atonement of the children of Israel. At one point the high priest sprinkled the blood of the animal upon the people. Christ said He came to fulfill the Law, NOT end it. And fulfill it He did. Just as the animal sacrifice was slain to atone for the children of Israel, so too, did Jesus Christ die to atone for the sins of the children of Israel. He obeyed the Law perfectly. His blood was shed to atone for the sins of the children of Israel. To claim Jesus died for Gentiles when there is no Scripture that says this, and to teach Jesus died for all men is to make Jesus change the Law which is to destroy the Law. So, either Jesus changed the Law thereby destroying the Law or your interpretation of Scripture is wrong.
Your interpretation of Scripture is wrong. Jesus did not change the Law to add Gentiles for Gentiles were never under the Law to begin with. Gentiles were never included in the covenants between God and Israel.

Your interpretation is in error.
God did not change the Law to include Gentiles. If He did then show me the Scripture from the Old Testament that says God did.
In fact, God says what He means, and He means what He says. Not even God can change the Mosaic Covenant - or any covenant - because God's Word is as the say, written on stone. To change the Law requires a stonecutter with hammer to chisel the change of the Law thereby destroying the tablets upon which the Law was written by the finger of God.

The Law is the standard by which sin exists. If the Gentiles are not covered by it, then Gentiles, by definition, cannot sin. If they are covered by it, then they can sin, because the Law points out their sin. However, the Law I speak about here is the 10 commandments. While given to the Jews, I believe God holds the whole world responsible and accountable. Hence we can sin. The civic laws, and ritual laws do not cover the Gentiles, nor do they sentence people to death. They make people unclean, and in a way, considering diseases carried by dead animals and other such things, they really are unclean. There is nothing in the 10 commandments that state that this is for the Jews only. It is not there. Perhaps an 11th commandment?

Your interpretation is wrong. Jesus died in accordance with the Law and in doing so fulfilled the Law. Any change would destroy the Law. If God wanted to save Gentiles, then Jesus as High Priest would have prayed Gentiles in but Jesus does not pray for Gentiles, nor are they included in His offering for sin. Gentiles are not included in any covenants between God and Israel.
That is that.

So you put Jesus UNDER the Law, even though Jesus is God. I got it. And, apparently you have no clue what Jesus meant when He said that He came to fulfill the Law and not to abolish it. To abolish it is to absolve everyone of sin without doing anything. If there is no law, if there is no standard, then there is no sin. Jesus did not come to do that. He came to fulfill the Law. So, what does that mean? If you break the law, what does it take to fulfill it? Better worded, if you break the law, what is the sentence given to fulfill the law? Death. So the fulfillment of the Law is death. Why? For all have sinned. That is, for all have broken God's commandments. So the penalty that fulfills God's Law and God's justice is death. For without the shedding of blood, there is no remission of sin. Without... death. Jesus fulfilled the Law for all who would believe by dying in their place. He took their penalty, which is death, upon Himself. So, He didn't abolish the Law by removing all responsibility and accountability, wiping the slate clean. He fulfilled the Law by dying in the place of His elect. He took their penalty, and paid it in His death on the cross. If you still don't get it, you are beyond hope.

 

[Jim]

I reject those that elevate general letters and personal letters of these apostles to that of Israel's prophets who were commanded to write their prophecies in a "book."

Of course you do. They tell you just how little you learned from those prophets of Israel.

 

[armylngst]

also to, @armylngst. jeremiah1five, this is the most IGNORANT answer as can be. this jew and gentile mess is over, .... Please get out of IGNORANCE. God made a covenant with people who are of faith. and being jew or gentile is irrelevant, which shows those who subscribe to this jew or gentile is still in the flesh and still in their sins. for God made all nations from ONE BLOOD. Acts 17:26 "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;" .

Jeremiah5 is correct. God only has a covenant with the Jews. However, the Bible is clear that it is not a covenant by which we are saved, but faith.

that should put an IGNORANT end to that IGNORANT nonsense about jews and gentiles. there is NO NATIONALITY IN GOD.

However there is. You aren't looking at the full picture. There is the church, within which there is no distinction. All are a part of the body of Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, and down the list in that verse. Everyone is equal. However, OUTSIDE the church, that is not the case. There is very much a distinction. The Jews are the chosen people of God, and the Gentiles are not. That is not going to change this side of eternity, the new heavens and new Earth. Revelation 21 shows the change. When a Jew or a Gentile gets saved, they are no longer outside the church, so don't even go there. There are elect out there who are not saved yet. For them, the distinction remains until they get saved.

This distinction Gentiles/Jews, the church/the nation of Israel, will continue until God completes His reconciliation with His children. (the elect). However, for the promises made to Abraham, the blessings for Israel will continue until the end of the Millennial kingdom, and the consummation of this side of eternity. God will rule over the world from Israel for the millennium. After that, He will dwell among men, and all men will be His people, and He will be their God. (Revelation 21.)

this puts the nail in the coffin. LISTEN and LEARN, Romans 2:28 "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:" Romans 2:29 "But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

NOW THE COVENANT OF FAITH,
Galatians 3:21 "Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law." Galatians 3:22 "But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.", (READ THAT AGAIN J5).

Scripture does mark the difference between promise and covenant. The promise came first.

Galatians 3:23 "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed." Galatians 3:24 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith." Galatians 3:25 "But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster." Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ." Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:29 "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

According to the promise, not covenant. We are not bound in covenant with God. Even Peter questioned why the church would force the covenant upon the Gentiles, a yoke that not even the Jews could bear.

BINGO, "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

This speaks of the church, the body of Christ. So this is only true for believers in Christ. For them, in the body of Christ there is equality. There is no distinction.

Abram became a father of ... "MANY NATIONS" ... by FAITH, hence the name change. Genesis 17:4 "As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations." Genesis 17:5 "Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee."

NOW GET THIS J5, Genesis 17:7 "And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee."

seed, one and not MANY as in seed(s) with the s at the end, only ONE "SEED". supportive scripture, Galatians 3:16 "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ." BINGO, "seed", one seed ... Christ, for it is by FAITH, and NOT by, NATIONALTY, GENDER, or RACE, the promise is made to those who BELIEVE in God through Jesus the Christ. so the covenant is Spiritually by Faith.

101G

There is no covenant for the Gentiles, however, the Bible is pretty clear that there is no need for a covenant. We are saved by faith, not by covenant. The Jews were God's chosen people by covenant, not faith. And they failed miserably in keeping the covenant. They violated it within 40 or so years. God said they would violate/break his covenant soon aftering entering the promised land. He didn't say they might. He made it clear that they would absolutely and without fail chase after idols and violate the covenant they made with God.

The reason Jeremiah5 says there is no covenant with the Gentiles is to say that all Gentiles (non Jewish) are damned to hell with no hope of salvation. However, the Bible is clear that salvation comes to all by faith, not by the Law, and not by covenant. In Genesis 22, God tells Abraham that all the nations of the world will be blessed in His seed, Jesus Christ. Not that they will become a partaker or a part of some covenant. They would benefit from Abraham's faith. They would be blessed through Abraham's faith.

Gentiles do not have a covenant, but they don't have any need for a covenant. They are saved by faith.

 

[armylngst]

Of course you do. They tell you just how little you learned from those prophets of Israel.

Of course he does because he elevates the Old Testament prophets above God Himself. If the Bible is God breathed, then it is God writing through people, using their personalities. It is still God's message. How dare we elevate God's words above the prophets.

 

[Olde Tymer]

.
FAQ: The Bible says the wages of sin is death (Rom 6:23) Well then: shouldn't Eve
have contracted death before Adam seeing as how she tasted the forbidden fruit
before he did?

REPLY: A comprehensive discussion of that passage would involve the introduction
of dispensations; which I am not adequately trained to do. So all I can really say for
now is that Rom 6:23 didn't apply to Eve in the beginning because according to
Rom 5:12-21, the wages of sin didn't become a consequence until Adam tasted the fruit.
_

 

[101G]

God only has a covenant with the Jews.

did you not read? the covenant is with Abraham and his "SEED", and not seeds. as in many, listen, Genesis 17:7 "And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee." the seed is Christ, and Christ is not Jewish.

However there is. You aren't looking at the full picture. There is the church, within which there is no distinction. All are a part of the body of Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, and down the list in that verse. Everyone is equal. However, OUTSIDE the church, that is not the case. There is very much a distinction. The Jews are the chosen people of God, and the Gentiles are not. That is not going to change this side of eternity, the new heavens and new Earth. Revelation 21 shows the change. When a Jew or a Gentile gets saved, they are no longer outside the church, so don't even go there. There are elect out there who are not saved yet. For them, the distinction remains until they get saved.

ERROR on your part. A. the church is neither Jew nor gentile. and B. no, the Jews are not the chosen people of God only. NOW THINK, another word for chosen is "ELECT" so only Jews are the elect? no. my God people are you reading your bibles.

This distinction Gentiles/Jews, the church/the nation of Israel, will continue until God completes His reconciliation with His children. (the elect). However, for the promises made to Abraham, the blessings for Israel will continue until the end of the Millennial kingdom, and the consummation of this side of eternity. God will rule over the world from Israel for the millennium. After that, He will dwell among men, and all men will be His people, and He will be their God. (Revelation 21.)

did you hear what you said? "This distinction Gentiles/Jews, the church/the nation of Israel, will continue until God completes His reconciliation with His children. (the elect)." well, who do you think the elect are? Oh my God.

According to the promise, not covenant. We are not bound in covenant with God. Even Peter questioned why the church would force the covenant upon the Gentiles, a yoke that not even the Jews could bear.

Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:" (HOUSE and not TRIBE). Jeremiah 31:32 "Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:" Jeremiah 31:33 "But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people." Jeremiah 31:34 "And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more." Jeremiah 31:35 "Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:"

There is no covenant for the Gentiles, however, the Bible is pretty clear that there is no need for a covenant. We are saved by faith, not by covenant.

LISTEN CAREFULLY, Hebrews 8:13 "In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away." ..... Hebrews 9:15 "And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance." A. a testament is a covenant. B. those who are called are the elect. My God how Hard is it?

did not God say that he would ... "ESTABLISH" his COVENANT with Abraham SEED? understand, he God ... "Made" a covenant with Abraham and his seed in their generation, (Genesis 17:7 "And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee." ), God "ESTABLISH" his COVENANT with Abraham "SEED", which is Christ. now armylngst is Christ Jewish? no.

understand, 101G see your ERROR, making a covenant is one thing, but "ESTABLISHING" that covenant is another. this is where you and jeremiah1five make your mistake at. KNOW the difference between in MAKING a Covenant, and in ESTABLISHING a Covenant.

101G.

 

[101G]

The three Hebrew covenants are recorded and described in the Old Testament. Use those original texts when and where the covenants are recorded to show me whether Gentiles are included in these three Hebrew covenants. Using letters from Saul is NOT any covenant. But he only discusses the covenants he doesn't establish any covenant. He studied the Old Testament and he makes commentary in his letters as to his understanding of these covenants. So, if you want to discuss what's in these covenants go to where in the Old Testament these covenants are established by God and the terms of them.
I've already looked at the three Hebrew covenants - Abraham, Mosaic, and New) and according to the text and terms of these covenants there are NO GENTILES included in the three HEBREW covenants.
Sorry.

see post above, #57

101G.

 

[101G]

I reject those that elevate general letters and personal letters of these apostles to that of Israel's prophets who were commanded to write their prophecies in a "book."
Saul, Peter, James, etc., wrote letters to their fellow Jews and Jewish Christians. Their purpose was to discuss Israel and her relationship with God not to make a bible. There's a big difference. Besides this, Gentiles gathered these scrolls in the fourth century and without permission from God decided to make a bible ("book") of their letters and make a bible (book.)
God never told them to do this. Nor did the apostles know someone three hundred years later was going to use their letters to make a bible. They are only letters. They are not prophetic utterances from authorized command of God to make a bible. The Old Testament prophets were authorized and commanded to write down their prophecies they gave to Israel.

They were letters. Do you even understand the difference between personal letters that someone - GENTILES - would gather with other letters and to make a book as opposed to actual prophets sent by God to Israel and Judah for a specific purpose according to God's command and will? The bottom line is these men wrote letters to Jews and Jewish Christians living in Gentile lands to discuss their understanding of the New Covenant era Israel found herself in after the Holy Spirit of Promise PROMISED TO ISRAEL - had come as promised by Christ. The Gentiles that gathered their letters did not have authorized permission by God to do such a thing and then claim it is on equal footing as the prophets of God. The prophets who prophesied were also commanded to write their histories and prophecies and Israel was to maintain their keeping, to copy them for each generation of Jews or when the originals became torn and tattered.
Gentiles who were left in charge of the Church Christ was building because Jews were defeated by Rome and scattered across the Roman Empire who passed laws prohibiting Jews from returning to their land. Had there been no Roman destruction of Israel and her Temple there would be no Gentile bible which Gentiles tried to pass off as equal in authority to Israel's prophets.

And with that a new religion was born.
What it was actually was Gentile's stealing Israel's birthright and their inheritance to make it their own.
Stealing is a sin.

see post above, #57

101G.

 

[armylngst]

.
FAQ: The Bible says the wages of sin is death (Rom 6:23) Well then: shouldn't Eve
have contracted death before Adam seeing as how she tasted the forbidden fruit
before he did?

REPLY: A comprehensive discussion of that passage would involve the introduction
of dispensations; which I am not adequately trained to do. So all I can really say for
now is that Rom 6:23 didn't apply to Eve in the beginning because according to
Rom 5:12-21, the wages of sin didn't become a consequence until Adam tasted the fruit.
_

I don't think it was mentioned because of the narrative style employed. Since Adam had been determined by God to sin, and would sin, the story waited until Adam sinned. If Adam had never sinned, the best understanding is that Eve would have either been banished, or destroyed, with destruction being highly probable. Adam would have received a new companion. Adam, apparently, didn't want a new companion, and only wanted Eve.