The suppression of reason, logic, common sense and morality in Calvinism

How does He uphold and sustain you but not your sin? How does that work logically? 3rd time
Why do you ignore the scriptures posted for the third time?

up·hold





  1. confirm or support (something which has been questioned):
    • maintain (a custom or practice):

    God's creating of the world and all that is necessary to sustain life has nothing at all to do with him supporting sin



    Why would you think a holy God would be the maintainer and support for all sin?
 
No I just have to believe scripture

Scripture showed he is not the cause of all of man's sin

James 1:13 Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God,” for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. 14 But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire.

1John 2:16 For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world.

Jer. 32:35 They built the high places of Baal in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to offer up their sons and daughters to Molech, though I did not command them, nor did it enter into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

Is. 30:1 “Ah, stubborn children,” declares the LORD,
“who carry out a plan, but not mine,
and who make an alliance, but not of my Spirit,
that they may add sin to sin;

Gal. 5:7 You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth? 8 This persuasion is not from him who calls you.

1Cor. 14:33 For God is not a God of confusion but of peace.

1Cor. 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it.

PS no where is it stated he determined Adam's failure
So when He created the garden, placed the tree of good and evil there and the serpent, throw in the creation of Eve, He had no idea what was going to occur?
 
Why do you ignore the scriptures posted for the third time?

up·hold





  1. confirm or support (something which has been questioned):
    • maintain (a custom or practice):

    God's creating of the world and all that is necessary to sustain life has nothing at all to do with him supporting sin



    Why would you think a holy God would be the maintainer and support for all sin?
Three strikes and im out

So God upheld and sustained Hitler, but not the holocaust? He could have stopped it easily.

This is rather silly sir. Your rather desperate to uphold and sustain your illogical position and refuse to address the issue.


Good talking to you, God bless
 
Three strikes and im out

So God upheld and sustained Hitler, but not the holocaust? He could have stopped it easily.

This is rather silly sir. Your rather desperate to uphold and sustain your illogical position and refuse to address the issue.


Good talking to you, God bless
Sustain means to maintain or support

Care to show how God actively supported it?.
 
So when He created the garden, placed the tree of good and evil there and the serpent, throw in the creation of Eve, He had no idea what was going to occur?
I would assume he knew

That however does not translate to he determines all sin.

Do you have a verse which actually affirms that.
 
Not zapping is not the same as actively supporting
Exactly the heresy of regeneration before faith which btw are both zapped unknowingly to the elect. They have no idea it happened. It’s secret .

When scripture is shown to contradict their theology they get to plea “ mystery “ secret will, 2 wills and a bunch of other excuses for God clear revelation of a topic. His will is known and revealed. 66 books filled with it.
 
But when you do obey God is the cause correct?

What is the point of the new heart?
Here is the Biblical answer to your question thats in direct opposition to your beliefs. I'm so glad you asked the question and there is no mystery or secret will in the obvious answer from Jesus and the Apostles/Prophets. Gods will and answers are clear for all to understand below.

Ezekiel 18:30-32
“Therefore, you Israelites, I will judge each of you according to your own ways, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent! Turn away from all your offenses; then sin will not be your downfall. Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!

Notice what comes first

1- Repent , turn away from sin
2- the after you repent you get a new heart/spirit ( calvinism- regeneration, new life)
3- repent then you live, have life- ie new heart, spirit.

John has the same order in in his opening of the gospel and in his purpose statement for writing his gospel.

John 1:12-13
“Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

Same order as above receive, believe, call on Him then the new birth follows.

John 20:31
“But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Once again the order is consistent with the OT- belief/repentance precedes life.


Romans 10:8-13
But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” 12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Again above we see its hearing the gospel, believing the message , confessing then calling upon the Lord results in salvation.

Acts tells us the same order in 11:18- "So then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life.” Repent precedes life.

Paul confirms the order in Ephesians below as well. Hearing and believing precedes the Holy Spirit that we were sealed with not before belief.

Ephesians 1:13
we are not in Christ until we believe- Eph 1:13

12 in order that we, who were the first to put our hope in Christ, might be for the praise of his glory. 13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

notice the biblical order once again.

1- When you heard the gospel
2- When you believed ( the gospel )
3- After which you became in Christ, in Him
4- After hearing/believing came the indwelling Holy Spirit
5- Salvation is the result of the above and are now Gods possession.

James and Peter have the same exact order in James 1:18 , 1 Peter 1:23.

See how scripture is consistent when you do not read your doctrine into it but read it objectively, without bias ?

conclusion: as we read in these SALVIFIC passages there is a consistent order.

1- hearing the word, the gospel
2- believing the gospel
3- receiving the gospel
4- calling upon the Lord
5- confessing Jesus is Lord
6- resulting in the new birth, born of God, regeneration, salvation, eternal life

hope this helps !!!
 
Here is the Biblical answer to your question thats in direct opposition to your beliefs. I'm so glad you asked the question and there is no mystery or secret will in the obvious answer from Jesus and the Apostles/Prophets. Gods will and answers are clear for all to understand below.

Ezekiel 18:30-32
“Therefore, you Israelites, I will judge each of you according to your own ways, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent! Turn away from all your offenses; then sin will not be your downfall. Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, people of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!

Notice what comes first

1- Repent , turn away from sin
2- the after you repent you get a new heart/spirit ( calvinism- regeneration, new life)
3- repent then you live, have life- ie new heart, spirit.

John has the same order in in his opening of the gospel and in his purpose statement for writing his gospel.

John 1:12-13
“Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

Same order as above receive, believe, call on Him then the new birth follows.

John 20:31
“But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Once again the order is consistent with the OT- belief/repentance precedes life.


Romans 10:8-13
But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved. 11 As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.” 12 For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Again above we see its hearing the gospel, believing the message , confessing then calling upon the Lord results in salvation.

Acts tells us the same order in 11:18- "So then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life.” Repent precedes life.

Paul confirms the order in Ephesians below as well. Hearing and believing precedes the Holy Spirit that we were sealed with not before belief.

Ephesians 1:13
we are not in Christ until we believe- Eph 1:13

12 in order that we, who were the first to put our hope in Christ, might be for the praise of his glory. 13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

notice the biblical order once again.

1- When you heard the gospel
2- When you believed ( the gospel )
3- After which you became in Christ, in Him
4- After hearing/believing came the indwelling Holy Spirit
5- Salvation is the result of the above and are now Gods possession.

James and Peter have the same exact order in James 1:18 , 1 Peter 1:23.

See how scripture is consistent when you do not read your doctrine into it but read it objectively, without bias ?

conclusion: as we read in these SALVIFIC passages there is a consistent order.

1- hearing the word, the gospel
2- believing the gospel
3- receiving the gospel
4- calling upon the Lord
5- confessing Jesus is Lord
6- resulting in the new birth, born of God, regeneration, salvation, eternal life

hope this helps !!!
The text is Ezekiel 36 and the new covenant. Stay focused

So there is no Biblical answer on this post.
 
I would assume he knew

That however does not translate to he determines all sin.

Do you have a verse which actually affirms that.
Sure sounds like it given He placed those things there knowing the outcome.
Outcome meaning every last sin that would be committed. He knew the consequences and determined them to occur.
 
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