The Power of the Gospel

[civic]

Matthew 13- The Parable of the Sower


1The same day went Jesus out of the house, and sat by the sea side.
2 And great multitudes were gathered together unto him, so that he went into a ship, and sat; and the whole multitude stood on the shore.
3 And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow;
4 And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:
5 Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:
6 And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.
7 And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them:
8 But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold.
9 Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.


10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.


18 Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.


19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

T- man can choose to hear, see and receive the gospel
U- all can choose to believe and receive as demonstrated in the parable of the 4 soils
L- all soils received the seed without exception
I- 3 soils resisted all but 1 soil remained faithful and did not resist
P- 3/4 soils ( minds/hearts )did not preserver in the faith

1- Only something alive can be choked. You cannot choke the dead. And as we can see they all had life to begin with in each soil.
2- Only something alive can be scorched by the Sun and withered.
3- Only someone alive can receive the word in the heart and have it snatched away
4- Only someone alive can receive the word with Joy and endure for a while

Luke 14:23 And the master said to the servant, ‘Go out to the highways and hedges and compel (αναγκασον) people to come in, that my house may be filled. 24 For I tell you, none of those men who were invited shall taste my banquet.’” @synergy. Remember this from the old forum The Greek word αναγκασον is to urge or compel, not irresistibly draw.

There are 4 major Calvinist pillars that fall with the Parable of the Wedding Feast which is connected to the Parable of the Sower above.

1. Monergism (Total Depravity),
2. Preservation of Saints (many called by God but few chosen by God),
3. Irresistible Grace (many called by God but few chosen by God),
4. and even Limited Atonement because as many as could possibly be found were invited

hope this helps !!!

 

[praise_yeshua]

I'm a Calminian.

In-between or outside.

 

[civic]

The new birth and the gospel.


Born of Water John 3

John 3:1-7. Lets look at the context of Jesus interaction with Nicodemus. All human beings have experienced natural birth on earth, if they expect to go to heaven, they must experience a supernatural spiritual birth from above. Nicodemus was a well educated religious leader who did not understand what the Saviour was talking about. Jesus was speaking about a spiritual birth, but Nicodemus thought of a physical birth.

The situation is no different today When you talk with people about being born again, they often begin to discuss their family's religious heritage, their church membership, religious ceremonies like baptism etc....Jesus being a patient teacher picked up on Nicodemus' words and further explained the new birth. To be "born of water" is to be born physically ("enter a second time into his mother's womb") but to be born again means to be born of the Spirit. Just as there are two parents for physical birth, so there are two for spiritual birth: the Spirit of God (John 3:5) and the Word of God (James 1:18; 1 Peter 1:23-25). The Spirit of God takes the Word of God and, when the sinner believes, imparts the life of God.Jesus was not teaching that the new birth comes through water baptism. In the NT baptism is connected with death, not birth and no amount of physical water can cause a spiritual change in a person.

The emphasis in John 3:14-21 is on believing, because salvation comes through faith. John 1:12-13 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, 13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Understanding Jesus teaching in John 3 on Born Again !

John 3:3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.”

4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”
5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”
9 “How can this be?” Nicodemus asked
10 “You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things?

So lets go through this point by point.

1- to enter the kingdom of God a person must be born again( a 2nd time)
2- flesh gives birth to flesh ( 1st birth )
3- the Spirit gives birth to spirit( 2nd birth )
4- the wind(spirit) blows wherever IT pleases
5- we hear the sound of the wind but do not know where it is coming from or going to
6- the same with the Spirit( we see its effects but not its coming or going)
7- the spirit is the same as the wind- it does as it pleases and we see its effects in both the natural(wind) and supernatural ( spirit)
8- God causes us to be born again
9- the new birth is compared to the physical birth just as the wind is compared to the spirits work
10- in both cases of birth God is the Active One and the one who is birthed is passive in the process.

There can be no other reading into the text but what has been outlined in the 10 points. Those 10 points are directly from the text.

Now The PARALLELS and CONTRASTS Jesus makes in the passage are the following 10 by reading through and observing the passage :

1- the 2 births
2- the wind and the spirit
3- flesh and the spirit
4- water and spirit
5- earthly and heavenly things
6- effects of both the wind and spirit
7- the seen with the unseen
8- the physical with the supernatural
9- knowing and not knowing, understanding and not understanding
10- entering the kingdom and not entering the kingdom

summary- just as flesh gives birth to flesh( 1st birth as a person) so to does the Spirit give birth to the spirit(the new birth- born again)

Ezekiel 18 declares : “a NEW SPIRIT I WILL (future) put WITHIN them…” These predictions mean that even Ezekiel was not regenerated, nor was any man prior to Ezekiel. And Ezekiel lived near the end of the OT time period. Scripture talks about 2 kinds of life. Physical and Spiritual. What other “kind of life” does the Bible talk about other than the life we are given in the flesh when we are born of the flesh, and eternal life which we are given when we are born of the Spirit? There is no other “kind of life” taught about in the Bible. When a man is born of the eternal Spirit, by the eternal Word of God, he is given eternal life. A man is regenerated when He is made alive with Jesus Christ (Eph. 2:5). Can a man be “made alive with Jesus Christ” apart from having Jesus Christ dwelling in him? Also, Paul explicitly states, “You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit IF THE SPIRIT OF GOD DWELL IN YOU. And if any man HAVE NOT THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST HE IS NONE OF HIS.” (Rom. 8:9). We are born again THROUGH THE RESURRECTION OF JESUS CHRIST FROM THE DEAD (1Peter 1:3). Can a man be born again through the resurrection of Jesus Christ before Jesus Christ actually rose again from the dead? No so Jesus in John 3 was not talking about spiritual life in the OT but the promise of the Spirit that would come at Pentecost when His spirit would be poured out upon all who believe in Him and become born again children of God from the preaching of the gospel and receiving Him as Lord.

hope this helps !!!

 

[civic]

Only ONE responded in a biblical manner-yielding fruit. I would reference this with the parable of the ten virgins.

1 Peter 1:3
Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

1 Peter 1:23
For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

James 1:18
He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we would be a kind of firstfruits of His creation.

 

[praise_yeshua]

1 Peter 1:3
Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

1 Peter 1:23
For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

James 1:18
He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we would be a kind of firstfruits of His creation.

Firstfruit..... There is a good subject.

So God's creation wasn't "fruitful" in the purpose of God without Christ.... can I get an Amen...

 

[koberstein]

In-between or outside.

I like some ideas of Calvinism and Arminianism

 

[civic]

I like some ideas of Calvinism and Arminianism

Yes outside of tulip, election, predestination , sovereignty, PSA, original sin and a few others I like Calvinism too just not their above doctrines

 

[TomL]

Yes outside of tulip, election, predestination , sovereignty, PSA, original sin and a few others I like Calvinism too just not their above doctrines

Then you can be an Arminian or a Provisionist

 

[praise_yeshua]

Then you can be an Arminian or a Provisionist

Many Arminians are Provisionists.

 

[brightfame52]

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

 

[TomL]

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

sorry faith precedes regeneration

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

 

[brightfame52]

sorry faith precedes regeneration

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

 

[TomL]

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

You failed to address the fact

sorry faith precedes regeneration

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

 

[brightfame52]

You failed to address the fact

sorry faith precedes regeneration

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

 

[Studyman]

The resident Calvinists here dishonor God with their false claims concerning the Gospel.

The Gospel is Intrinsically POWERFUL.

Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Rom 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Paul is telling us here that the Gospel of Christ is the Law and Prophets. Paul has already told us his relationship with the Law and Prophets after being accused of teaching against them.

Acts 24: 13 Neither can they prove the things whereof they now accuse me.

14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

There was no other Scripture that existed in Jesus or Paul's time, other than the Law and Prophets. God's instruction in Righteousness and God's Wrath against all unrighteousness and ungodliness of men is revealed in the Gospel of Christ where from within it is written "The Just shall live by faith", Hab. 2:4.

The Body of Christ existed, counted the days correctly so as to be gathered in God's Holy Feast Pentecost, and received the Spirit of God that HE gives to all who obey Him from the Wise Men and Zacharias, Simeon and Anna, to the first Church of God under His Prophesied New High Priest. All this existed and continued while Paul was still persecuting the church of God, all before Paul even wrote one letter.

Paul tells Timothy, "And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able "to make thee wise unto salvation through faith" "which is in" Christ Jesus.

I agree with you that the Gospel of Christ that Paul promoted, is powerful. And I also agree that "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord, or that Jesus warned of, "Who come in His Name", teach a different Gospel or as you put it, "with their false claims concerning the Gospel".

But I don't agree that corrupting or making false claims about the gospel is limited to just the Calvinist. It's seems pretty much universal that this world's religious sects and businesses, including Armenians and Calvinists and others, promote a gospel of Christ which is separated from the Law and Prophets. Having rejected the very foundation of the Gospel, just like the Jews did "Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools," they all went their own way, created their own religion, with their own judgments, their own sabbaths, their own righteousness, and have not submitted unto the righteousness of God, a Righteousness which is revealed in the Gospel of Christ, the Law and Prophets.

And as a result, they broke up into different religious sects and businesses all promoting a different gospel, different doctrines, all competing for butts to fill the seats in their manmade shrines of worship. And all having one thing in common with the Pharisees, they all transgress God's commandments by their own religious traditions.

I share your disdain for the Calvinist who promotes a god that created men who cannot love Him or respect Him and honor Him, unless HE forces them to. But I also have disdain for the religion who promotes the philosophy that God granted Jesus powers no other human has ever had access to, so that when the going gets tough, like it does for every human, Jesus was able to overcome by kicking in God Powers no other human was allowed to have.

It's like saying God is a coach whose Son is on the team. And God withholds all performance enhancing drugs from them, but not from His Son who gets to take them. Then when the Son outperforms all the other guys because He is jacked up, God gives Him the trophy. So demeaning, so disrespectful to God and His Son, and yet when the lipstick is removed, this is exactly what "many" who come in Christ's Name preach.

Or the Philosophy that is promoted by most all of this world's religions, that God heard Israel in Egypt, and had compassion on them, and did signs and wonders to convince them HE was God, so they would trust Him and follow Him out of Sin/Egypt. But as soon as they followed Him, He placed on their neck's a Yoke of Bondage, impossible laws, too many and too difficult to keep, then lied to them and told them they could keep them, then slaughtered them by the thousands when they didn't. So His Son had to come and save them, not from sin, but from God's Laws that modern preachers call "Rudiments of this world", "beggarly elements" and Jewish traditions of men. So demeaning, so disrespectful to God and His Son, and yet when the lipstick is removed, this is exactly what "many" who come in Christ's Name preach.

There are plenty of false claims concerning the Gospel of the Christ "of the bible" being promoted by this world's religions. Calvinists promote falsehoods no doubt, but as Jesus said, I'll paraphrase;

"There were present at that season some that told him of the Calvinists, who promoted false claims about the Gospel of Christ.

2 And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that this religious sect were sinners above all the religious sects who promote falsehoods about the gospel of Christ, because they suffered such things?

3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Calvinism removes the power of the Gospel. The power of the Gospel is relative to the speaker, not the hearer.

All of this world's religious sects and businesses remove the power of the Gospel by rejecting the very foundation of the Gospel of Christ, and creating their own gospel. Calvinism is just one of many.

Shall we not align ourselves with the Bible's definition of the Gospel of Christ, which was given to Israel who didn't believe it?

 

[TomL]

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

You did not address these

You failed to address the fact

sorry faith precedes regeneration

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

 

[brightfame52]

You failed to address the fact

sorry faith precedes regeneration

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

Man by nature is darkness when it comes to Spiritual things Eph 5:8

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: Hence by nature we are enslaved by darkness, we love darkness rather than light Jn 3 19

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

So while in darkness of nature,no matter how much the light of the Gospel is presented to us, it finds this result Jn 1:5

And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
2 Cor 4 4,6

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Now the only thing that can prepare the heart for a positive reception of the Gospel, is regeneration, a new nature, which dispels the darkness we are by old adam nature. Then the Gospel light shine unto us into our new heart by regeneration

6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Thats when we believe !

 

[praise_yeshua]

Paul is telling us here that the Gospel of Christ is the Law and Prophets. Paul has already told us his relationship with the Law and Prophets after being accused of teaching against them.

Acts 24: 13 Neither can they prove the things whereof they now accuse me.

14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

There was no other Scripture that existed in Jesus or Paul's time, other than the Law and Prophets. God's instruction in Righteousness and God's Wrath against all unrighteousness and ungodliness of men is revealed in the Gospel of Christ where from within it is written "The Just shall live by faith", Hab. 2:4.

Paul quotes a prophet. The message of God was also passed from generation to generation "faith to faith" long before Hab 2:4 was ever written. It is an appeal to passing the Truth of God throughout human history. Such is found throughout endless cultures. Man took the truth of God and turned it into a lie among the Egyptians, Assyrians and countless other cultures. This is why ancient religion have similar messages about God.

Enoch is generally considered the first prophet that recorded his prophesies. We don't read about him until Moses and later from Jude.

The Body of Christ existed, counted the days correctly so as to be gathered in God's Holy Feast Pentecost, and received the Spirit of God that HE gives to all who obey Him from the Wise Men and Zacharias, Simeon and Anna, to the first Church of God under His Prophesied New High Priest. All this existed and continued while Paul was still persecuting the church of God, all before Paul even wrote one letter.

Paul tells Timothy, "And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able "to make thee wise unto salvation through faith" "which is in" Christ Jesus.

I agree with you that the Gospel of Christ that Paul promoted, is powerful. And I also agree that "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord, or that Jesus warned of, "Who come in His Name", teach a different Gospel or as you put it, "with their false claims concerning the Gospel".

Okay. Thanks

But I don't agree that corrupting or making false claims about the gospel is limited to just the Calvinist. It's seems pretty much universal that this world's religious sects and businesses, including Armenians and Calvinists and others, promote a gospel of Christ which is separated from the Law and Prophets. Having rejected the very foundation of the Gospel, just like the Jews did "Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools," they all went their own way, created their own religion, with their own judgments, their own sabbaths, their own righteousness, and have not submitted unto the righteousness of God, a Righteousness which is revealed in the Gospel of Christ, the Law and Prophets.

And as a result, they broke up into different religious sects and businesses all promoting a different gospel, different doctrines, all competing for butts to fill the seats in their manmade shrines of worship. And all having one thing in common with the Pharisees, they all transgress God's commandments by their own religious traditions.

To be clear, I wasn't trying to limiting it to just Calvinists. I was addressing the nature of the Gospel as method of passing salvation from one generation to the next.

I share your disdain for the Calvinist who promotes a god that created men who cannot love Him or respect Him and honor Him, unless HE forces them to. But I also have disdain for the religion who promotes the philosophy that God granted Jesus powers no other human has ever had access to, so that when the going gets tough, like it does for every human, Jesus was able to overcome by kicking in God Powers no other human was allowed to have.

It's like saying God is a coach whose Son is on the team. And God withholds all performance enhancing drugs from them, but not from His Son who gets to take them. Then when the Son outperforms all the other guys because He is jacked up, God gives Him the trophy. So demeaning, so disrespectful to God and His Son, and yet when the lipstick is removed, this is exactly what "many" who come in Christ's Name preach.

Can you be specific? Who had/has the same power that Jesus Christ had/has? I heard this claim many times in my life. I've never found anyone equal to Christ. If I did, I would abandon the Gospel. The Gospel isn't about God, but God IN CHRIST. The Heir of all things. The heir of Abraham. The ONLY begotten Son of God.

Eph 1:20 that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,
Eph 1:21 far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come.
Eph 1:22 And he put all things under his feet and gave him as head over all things to the church,
Eph 1:23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all.

I'm hoping that I'm misunderstanding you.

Or the Philosophy that is promoted by most all of this world's religions, that God heard Israel in Egypt, and had compassion on them, and did signs and wonders to convince them HE was God, so they would trust Him and follow Him out of Sin/Egypt. But as soon as they followed Him, He placed on their neck's a Yoke of Bondage, impossible laws, too many and too difficult to keep, then lied to them and told them they could keep them, then slaughtered them by the thousands when they didn't. So His Son had to come and save them, not from sin, but from God's Laws that modern preachers call "Rudiments of this world", "beggarly elements" and Jewish traditions of men. So demeaning, so disrespectful to God and His Son, and yet when the lipstick is removed, this is exactly what "many" who come in Christ's Name preach.

The law you reference is Scripturally referenced as "The law of Moses". Have you forgotten this?

Israel rejected God while Moses was on the mount. God asked Israel to draw near to Him and they refused. Your ancestors would have killed Aaron had he not made them a "golden calf". Moses came off the mount to find a people that God sought to destroy.

Deu 9:13 Furthermore the LORD spake unto me, saying, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people:
Deu 9:14 Let me alone, that I may destroy them, and blot out their name from under heaven: and I will make of thee a nation mightier and greater than they.

It is the law of Moses because Moses took responsibility for them and judged them instead of God.

They received a law that sought to make them "self awareness" of their own guilt.

Rom 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

You should look at the law and realize just how sinful you are. You need to become guilty before God.

 

[praise_yeshua]

mistake

 

[Studyman]

Paul quotes a prophet. The message of God was also passed from generation to generation "faith to faith" long before Hab 2:4 was ever written. It is an appeal to passing the Truth of God throughout human history. Such is found throughout endless cultures. Man took the truth of God and turned it into a lie among the Egyptians, Assyrians and countless other cultures. This is why ancient religion have similar messages about God.

Enoch is generally considered the first prophet that recorded his prophesies. We don't read about him until Moses and later from Jude.

I was speaking to the Gospel of the Christ "of the Bible" that was given to Israel that the Wisemen, Zacharias, Simeon and Anna, along with Abraham and Noah and Abel, and Caleb and David etc., all heard and believed.

A Gospel in which men, both Jew and Gentile, are instructed to repent, turn to God and "DO" works worthy of repentance.

Okay. Thanks

To be clear, I wasn't trying to limiting it to just Calvinists. I was addressing the nature of the Gospel as method of passing salvation from one generation to the next.

I was addressing your words. "The resident Calvinists here dishonor God with their false claims concerning the Gospel."

Can you be specific? Who had/has the same power that Jesus Christ had/has? I heard this claim many times in my life. I've never found anyone equal to Christ.

I only pointed out a wicked philosophy being promoted that Jesus wasn't a flesh and blood human being like other men but had access to God powers no other human had ever had access to and it was by this power that HE was able to overcome sin.

It is an evil portrayal of God and His Son, demeaning the Glory of His effort and implying that Jesus risked nothing in His Time on earth.

If I did, I would abandon the Gospel.

If you believe Jesus wasn't the Christ, the Rock of Israel who became a human being like His Brethren, then you have already abandoned the Gospel Paul promoted.

The Gospel isn't about God, but God IN CHRIST. The Heir of all things. The heir of Abraham. The ONLY begotten Son of God.

That is the universal philosophy of Calvinism and Arminianism and the rest. That the Gospel of the Christ "of the Bible" isn't about the the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ". Even though His Son died to reconcile men to this same God. And continues to this day as an advocate between men and this same God, sitting on the Right Hand of this same God.

This is why I posted, to show that Calvinists were not the only ones promoting "false claims concerning the Gospel."

Eph 1:20 that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,
Eph 1:21 far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come.
Eph 1:22 And he put all things under his feet and gave him as head over all things to the church,
Eph 1:23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all.

I'm hoping that I'm misunderstanding you.

Let's look at what Paul actually says. Let's see if he is promoting a gospel that "isn't about God".

16 Cease not to give thanks for you, making mention of you in my prayers;

17 That the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ", the Father of glory, "may give unto you" the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") calling, and what the riches of the glory of his ( the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") inheritance in the saints,

19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") mighty power,

20 Which he (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") wrought in Christ, when he (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") raised him (our Lord Jesus Christ) from the dead, and set him (our Lord Jesus Christ) at his (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") own right hand in the heavenly places,

Clearly Paul wasn't promoting a gospel that "isn't about God". And neither did the Jesus "of the Bible".

John 17: 3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee "the only true God", and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

This is why I posted to your thread, because there is a gospel being promoted by this world's religions, that "isn't about God" and has been separated from the Law and Prophets.

But the Gospel of the Christ "of the bible" is all about God, just as the Jesus "of the bible" tells us.

"But Seek Ye First the Kingdon of (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") and HIS (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ") Righteousness.

And where is the Righteousness of this God revealed to those who believe in the Lord's Christ?

The Law and Prophets, or as Paul calls them, "The Gospel of Christ".

The law you reference is Scripturally referenced as "The law of Moses". Have you forgotten this?

Of course not. But it is true that Moses never created even one Law, and that every "LAW of Moses" is actually Laws of (the God "of our Lord Jesus Christ")

Have you forgotten that the Gospel of Christ was given to Israel by Moses?

Israel rejected God while Moses was on the mount. God asked Israel to draw near to Him and they refused. Your ancestors would have killed Aaron had he not made them a "golden calf". Moses came off the mount to find a people that God sought to destroy.

Neither Caleb nor Joshua rejected God while Moses was on the mount. These are my ancestors.

Deu 9:13 Furthermore the LORD spake unto me, saying, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people:
Deu 9:14 Let me alone, that I may destroy them, and blot out their name from under heaven: and I will make of thee a nation mightier and greater than they.

It is the law of Moses because Moses took responsibility for them and judged them instead of God.

LOL, So in your religion, these Laws were God's Laws until Israel rejected them, and then they became Moses Laws?

So what did God do? Did he not instruct Moses to go back up the mountain?

Ex. 34: 1 And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables "the words that were in the first tables", which thou brakest.


So by your own logic, didn't these Law become God's Laws again?

They received a law that sought to make them "self awareness" of their own guilt.

No, that isn't true. They rejected God's Law which showed them their sin. Caleb didn't, Joshua didn't, Zacharias didn't, but as Paul teaches in 1 Cor. 10, "Many" did, and they fell in the Wilderness. Paul said God had these Holy scriptures written as examples so that we wouldn't Lust after disobedience to God as they also lusted.

I believe Him.

Rom 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Of course not. If I kill someone, I am guilty. I could never kill another soul again the rest of my life. Would these lawful "Deeds" justify me of murder? How silly.

You should look at the law and realize just how sinful you are. You need to become guilty before God.

I have already done that. Now I follow what Paul teaches both Jew and Gentile.

Rom. 6: 15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. (That means NO! PJ) 16 Know ye not, that to whom "ye yield yourselves" servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? 17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. 18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

So if you "Yield yourself" a servant to obey Calvinist doctrine, or Armenian doctrine, or Catholic doctrine, you are a servant to whom you obey. I advocate becoming a servant of God's Righteousness, as Jesus and the entire Bible teaches.