Hebrews 2- Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might break the power of him who holds the power of death—that is, the devil—
15and free those who all their lives were held in slavery by their fear of death.
16For surely it is not angels he helps, but Abraham’s descendants.
17For this reason he had to be made like them,
k fully human in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people.
18Because he himself suffered when he was tempted, he is able to help those who are being tempted.
Above we see the Son through the Incarnation became sarx( flesh). Hebrews 2 says He shared that same flesh we have and was like us in every way.
So if Jesus came in the flesh ( John 1:1, 1 John 4:2, 2 John 1:7) then His humanity disproves the sin nature misnomer many teach and believe or one must admit Jesus was born with a fallen corrupt sinful nature and thus born a sinner like all men are born sinners according to the doctrine of Original Sin and TD. ( Total Depravity )
You see man in not born a sinner just like Jesus was not born a sinner. Jesus never sinned yet was born innocent like all men. We become sinners when we sin and become guilty of sin. This is why babies are innocent , not guilty until they sin.
hope this helps !!!
PART 1:
I kind of agree with you in one way, and yet, I do not agree with you. I agree with you in the sense that if human flesh is corrupted, and Jesus put on human flesh, then Jesus put on fallen corrupted sinful flesh.
Where I disagree, is with the present state of human flesh (and interpretation of Heb. 2:14).
It is our bodies that are also the problem:
Rom 6:12 Let not sin [Feminine
] therefore reign in your mortal body [Neuter
], to make you obey its ["
its" (Neuter) referring back to "
body" (Neuter), referring to the body's..
] passions [bodies are living, and have their own desires, as the corrupt animal kingdom, that follow their own natural bodies desires, and humans do the same. Ever have a thought pop into your head; if you did not initiate the thought, then where did it come from? Your body produces thoughts, and even picture shows while sleeping! Ever get a craving for something. Our bodies do their own things without even asking us
].
Rom 7:15 For I do not understand my own actions. For I do not do what I want, but I do the very thing I hate.
Rom 7:16 Now if I do what I do not want, I agree with the law, that it is good.
Rom 7:17 So now it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me [showing, somehow, separation of sin from the person, yet, we are still responsible for our sins, because, or if, we listen to our bodies desires
].
Rom 7:18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh [nothing good in his body of flesh
]. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out [he does not find a way to resist his bodies desires, very difficult
].
Rom 7:19 For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing [he is talking about repeated sins, struggling with, which he finds no way out of
].
Rom 7:20 Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me [in his body, not him the person
].
Rom 7:21 So I find it to be a law that when I want to do right, evil lies close at hand.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being [his person
],
Rom 7:23 but I see in my members [of his body
] another law waging war against the law of my mind [his bodies desires war against his mind
] and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members [sin dwells in the members of his body, making the person a slave to sin
].
Rom 7:24 Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death [his body's desires is the problem that plagues his mind
]?
Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life [the power of the spirit needs to remain in us, by remaining in fellowship; staying in Christ doctrine (living and walking in, mind and action); we fall if we don't. Obeying from the heart, not the law. If we love someone, then we will want to please them from the heart, not because of a law
] has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death [from our bodies desires
].
Rom 8:3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do [weak flesh is a major problem
]. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh [not in sinful flesh/body, but
in the likeness of sinful flesh
] and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh [sin is in the flesh
],
Rom 8:4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh [the body's cravings
] but according to the Spirit [the power of God. If we guard our mind from what enters, which can be done if God's spirit is in us, and remains in us, cause the spirit can be put out. So if one is struggling, need to get right with God
].
Rom 8:5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh [on what the body desires and craves, if sensual, they think on those things, not able to push them out, not without the spirit, or if quenched (or smoldering)
], but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on [always on guard, shutting the door to the kingdom of their minds to those godless earthy thoughts and ways, but turn and open to that which is pleasing to God. They have this power by remaining in the spirit, Christ's spirit! Who overcame all things!
] the things of the Spirit [always having ones mind set in fellowship with God, as much as is possible, which should be in everything
].
We are tempted by our flesh, our bodies have their own desires. And can put thoughts into our minds, but we choose whether we dwell on them or not. Dwelling on them leads to sin.
PART 2:
Heb 2:14, How it reads in the k.Greek "he similarly partook of the same things" He is saying in a similar way he partook of flesh and blood. It does not read that he partook of the same flesh and blood as them, it is not written that way.
Heb 2:14 Forasmuch
G1893 then
G3767 as the
G3588 children
G3813 are partakers
G2841 of flesh
G4561 and
G2532 blood,
G129 heG846 alsoG2532 himself likewiseG3898 took partG3348 of theG3588 same;G846 that
G2443 through
G1223 death
G2288 he might destroy
G2673 him that had
G2192 the
G3588 power
G2904 of death,
G2288 that is,
G5123 the
G3588 devil;
G1228
Heb 2:14 επει
G1893 CONJ ουν
G3767 CONJ τα
G3588 T-NPN παιδια
G3813 N-NPN κεκοινωνηκεν
G2841 V-RAI-3S αιματος
G129 N-GSN και
G2532 CONJ σαρκος
G4561 N-GSF και
G2532 CONJ αυτοςG846 P-NSM παραπλησιωςG3898 ADV μετεσχενG3348 V-2AAI-3S τωνG3588 T-GPN αυτωνG846 P-GPN ινα
G2443 CONJ δια
G1223 PREP του
G3588 T-GSM θανατου
G2288 N-GSM καταργηση
G2673 V-AAS-3S τον
G3588 T-ASM το
G3588 T-ASN κρατος
G2904 N-ASN εχοντα
G2192 V-PAP-ASM του
G3588 T-GSM θανατου
G2288 N-GSM τουτ
G3778 D-NSN εστιν
G1510 V-PAI-3S τον
G3588 T-ASM διαβολον
G1228 A-ASM
αυτοςG846 P-NSM παραπλησιωςG3898 ADV μετεσχενG3348 V-2AAI-3S τωνG3588 T-GPN αυτωνG846 P-GPN
he................................similarly...........................partook...............................of the....................same things
He
similarly partook, but not 100% exactly the same..
3898. paraplésiós
Strong's Concordance
paraplésiós: in like manner
Original Word: παραπλησίως
Part of Speech: Adverb
Definition: in like manner
Usage: similarly, in like manner, likewise.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin: adverb from paraplésios
Definition: in like manner
3897. paraplésios
Strong's Concordance
paraplésios: coming near, nearly resembling
Original Word: παραπλήσιον
Part of Speech: Adverb
Definition: coming near, nearly resembling
Usage: near to, nearly.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin: from a comp. of para and the same as plésion
Definition: coming near, nearly resembling
Then when added with verses like Jn 1:14; 6:51, it is clear Jesus did not take on sinful flesh.
These bodies are corrupted. They ate the fruit that went into their bodies, they (both body and person) have the knowledge of both good and evil. Christ's resurrection brought new life to our minds by the spirit, now we just have to put off these bodies, for new spiritual ones, uncorrupted.
In one sense we are sinners' from birth, cause we were in a no win situation. It's not that we actually sin at birth, but because of our fleshes/body's desires, and also even laws, we will sin, for we are powerless against the sinful flesh/body, and the law is powerless against sin. That's why it is imperative to live and walk in the spirit.
