charismaticlady
Active member
No, he had already died. But I went to church with friends of his. I moved from the valley to Arizona too. What part? I lived in Pine up the mountain from Payson.
The Discovery of Hidden Mystery Against OSAS
- Thread starter charismaticlady
- Start date
Yuma, but we have RVed all over Ariz. My sister went to pastor Jacks church I went there with her a few times.
Azriel
Well-known member
I love Jack Hayford. They had some really good pastors that came out of that Generation. Billy Graham is one, Ray Stedman, Dr David Jeremiah. And the list goes on.
I have a Jack Hayford spirit filled daily devotion book around here somewhere. I'm actually in the process of cleaning up my bookshelves so I think I'll go look for it right now.
Found it. Here's what it looks like
I have a Jack Hayford spirit filled daily devotion book around here somewhere. I'm actually in the process of cleaning up my bookshelves so I think I'll go look for it right now.
Found it. Here's what it looks like
Living the Spirit Filled Life Paperback – January 1, 1992Living the Spirit-Filled Life is a treasury of insight from Jack W. Hayford and the late Sam Middlebrook that will deepen your spiritual walk. Featuring Bible verses from the New King James Version, each of its 365 daily readings focuses on one of twelve major themes drawn from the Spirit-Filled Life Bible. Topical studies, word studies, and personal application of biblical principles build your faith on a solid foundation.
L.A.M.B.
Active member
I dislike the acronym OSAS, many use it to negate sin and it's consequences.
I do believe in eternal security as long as one remains attached into the vine. John 15:4/5. This is the only way we can be fruit bearing by continuing to receive nourishment from the parent vine.
There are many IF'S in God's word that constitute our viability as believers. Breaking these or rejecting them as not applying to believers make the gift of salvation and our freedom in him, null & void.
1 Corinthians 15:58 - Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye steadfast, unmovable,always abounding in the work of the Lord, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.
We all run in the race but it's the winners that FINISH the race that are rewarded.
I do believe in eternal security as long as one remains attached into the vine. John 15:4/5. This is the only way we can be fruit bearing by continuing to receive nourishment from the parent vine.
There are many IF'S in God's word that constitute our viability as believers. Breaking these or rejecting them as not applying to believers make the gift of salvation and our freedom in him, null & void.
1 Corinthians 15:58 - Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye steadfast, unmovable,always abounding in the work of the Lord, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.
We all run in the race but it's the winners that FINISH the race that are rewarded.
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
How can a person be "unborn"?
The security of the believer is established in the new birth. Children are chastised. Without chastisement (for correction) then we are bastards and not sons. All sons sin. All sons get correction.
The security of the believer is established in the new birth. Children are chastised. Without chastisement (for correction) then we are bastards and not sons. All sons sin. All sons get correction.
Rowan
Active member
Anyone who thinks that a believer’s sins carry no eternal consequences has overlooked a major area of biblical theology. The parable of the Prodigal Son shows what happens when you don't stay connected to the Vine. Things didn't exactly go the way he planned them and he suffered the consequences.
The good news is when he came to his senses he realized he would be better off being a slave and his father's house and feeding the pigs and hoping to find a tasty morsel for himself.
The key is to remain in Christ.
If our salvation hinges on anything but the finished work of Christ on the cross, we are in trouble. Or, at best, we run the risk of being in trouble. If you and I have any part in maintaining our salvation, it will be difficult to live with much assurance. Hope, yes; assurance, no
The good news is when he came to his senses he realized he would be better off being a slave and his father's house and feeding the pigs and hoping to find a tasty morsel for himself.
The key is to remain in Christ.
If our salvation hinges on anything but the finished work of Christ on the cross, we are in trouble. Or, at best, we run the risk of being in trouble. If you and I have any part in maintaining our salvation, it will be difficult to live with much assurance. Hope, yes; assurance, no
Bronson
Active member
If Christ came to seek and to save that which was lost, and yet we can somehow become unsaved—and therefore undo what Christ came to do—would it not be wise for God to take us on to heaven the moment we are saved in order to insure we make it? Isn’t it unnecessarily risky to force us to stay here?
charismaticlady
Active member
No he didn't. But that's what you get when you read Scripture out of context, and are taught doctrines of demons who want you to remain dead in your sins.
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charismaticlady
Active member
Whoever is teaching this heresy is preaching death to you. Jesus takes away our sin, He didn't leave you in it, unless you never received the Spirit of Christ to begin with. Then, yes, you will be sinning everyday. I know I was sinning for the first 30 years of my life in a church that never preached the Spirit. But providentially I met a girl that debated the subject with me and I changed my mind but still didn't receive the Spirit for another 6 years. Once I did I felt a heaviness leave my body, and all desire to sin went with it!
civic
Well-known member
That is the best argument, and it goes hand in hand with Eternal Life promised which must be turned into conditional or temporal life for it to fit into the other system.
charismaticlady
Active member
Here is Romans 7: 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find.
And also the end of 14-25 "So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. (The "law of God" was the Ten Commandments that were kept by the Jews BEFORE Christ.)
Now read the CONTEXT. Read Romans 7:5-6 and see we are no longer "in the flesh." " 5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.
Romans 8:9 9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.
Rockson
Well-known member
But then that would lead us to ask the question on what basis was eternal life given? Did not the unbeliever have to make a quality decision to follow the Lord, and make him just that....the Lord of his life? Did he not have to consider the teaching of Jesus which says continue in him and remain in him....and if not what does it say? It says .
If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned. John 15:7
If something was given and taken back....does that make God unjust? Or is it rather the one who choose to walk away that they were the unjust one? And why should one walking away be the recipient of the salvation blessing when those outside of the Lord don't get any where near that blessing. Wouldn't that be God being a respecter of persons? Then we read this,
If indeed (wouldn't indeed mean for sure they did) If indeed they have escaped the corruption of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, only to be entangled and overcome by it again, their final condition is worse than it was at first. 21It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than to have known it and then to turn away from the holy commandment passed on to them. 2 Pt 2:20
I just can't see any other way then to accept that if they escaped the corruption that would mean they would have had to been saved. And to be now put in a position that it would be better if they had not known the way of righteousness. having turned away from it.....to me at least that translates into one was genuinely saved and then they're not. (to clarify by no means does that mean someone having an occasionally struggle or failing into sin but rather someone who has no chose to go a lot further than that)
civic
Well-known member
Neither side of the argument is bullet proof. Both have valid points.
The new birth, adoption and eternal life are great arguments on the side of salvation being permanent.
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
I believe you're conflating. Paul clearly separates the flesh from the Spirit and the Spirit from the flesh. However, he is not excluding the very real fact that we are still very much in the flesh. There is are resources available to those that are born again that empower them to overcome this world. We are empowered to overcome this flesh. However, we still have a choice to sin and we do. When we do sin, God is faithful to forgive us and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
Rockson
Well-known member
And as I mentioned in another post look if a spouse is asked is it possible for one to divorce their spouse and walk away the might say they don't even think about it for they're committed. And same I think with this....if one is committed to the Lord to remain in him and to continue they never really have to think about this.
As for the new birth I think we can both agree the only reason we have the divine nature is for the reason that Christ is in us. I would think our nature would just resort back to what it initially was without Christ.
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. Rom 8:10,13
I see the above as Christ is in us it's upon us to not do something.....and that is not to be debtors to the flesh for if we do we will die. That's an exhortation...we do A and God will do B. If we don't do A we've pulled away from God doing B. Anyway God Bless!
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
It is my experience that many Christians stay children for a very long time. It doesn't matter if they are 80 years old. Christian maturity is not often relative to age. I've meet teenagers that had more Christian maturity than many senior citizens. That is not a criticism. It is a statement of fact.
There is a target that is never reached until the body of Christ is joined in maturity.
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Lack of maturity affects edification of the "Body of Christ". Which causes issue with the maturity of the body of Christ. While we talk of unity there is currently very little unity and maturity. That doesn't mean that there still not many children in the family of God around.
Aeliana
Well-known member
That's a good one. When you feel a serious case of road rage developing one needs to make sure you take the route of escape. Prior to calling them a bunch of names.
Rockson
Well-known member
And in the same Eph 4 we read,
As a prisoner in the Lord, then, I urge you to walk in a manner worthy of the calling you have received,
(and what is the manner of walk worthy of our calling????
"...with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love, and with diligence to preserve the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace."
Maybe some think of it this way, with all quick to being upset don't worry about being patient or putting up with anyone who rubs you the wrong way and if they want unity they've got to agree with you on everything and in that way there will be peace.
Then there's this,
"....speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into Christ Himself, who is the head." Eph 4: 15
Or someone might say, I grew up in Christ many years ago so not much room for me to do more. I have after all read every theological book you can imagine and really know more than anybody I know. I might even know more than Jesus himself!
(And I guess we can all agree the guy in my last few lines probably skipped reading the lines in his theological books the following verse)
Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, outcry and slander, along with every form of malice. Be kind and tenderhearted to one another, forgiving each other just as in Christ God forgave you. Eph 4:31
And makes me wonder if the such a one might fit the scripture well as one who are absolutely convinced they'll be first....but will find themselves as last. Matt 19:30 Oh God don't let us be that person!
charismaticlady
Active member
According to Peter, man has twisted Paul's words like they do with all the Scriptures.
