Dizerner
Active Member
I'm pretty sure they didn't all monitor Mary every time she was alone, lol.
Mary was the only soul that knew it for a fact.
The 5 Articles of Remonstrance (Arminianism)
- Thread starter atpollard
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I'm pretty sure they didn't all monitor Mary every time she was alone, lol.
Mary was the only soul that knew it for a fact.
Dizerner
Active Member
I'm seen 30 year olds say they never sinned, lol.
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
All I have to do is go to Mary,
Her seed was not touched by man.
Yes. But sin passed from adam the man, not the woman
yes.
Jesus father was the HS (see the difference)
then moses would have worked also.
If mary's parents can birth her free from sin, so could have Joseph and mary
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
GodsGrace
Active Member
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
we were dead
the wage of sin is death
Yes. But God put us in adam, so he could put us in christ.
the mystery of the gospel
I try not to judge who will go to hell.
will God allow a child who he knows even if they lived to 100 would never recieve him? I can't answer that because scripture is not clear
Did Jesus pay for sin on the cross?
In Adam all die. in christ shall all be made alive (have the ability)
he who believes is not condemned, he who does not believe is condemned already
so who goes to heaven and who goes to hell?
GodsGrace
Active Member
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
some of us trust the word of God. Like @civic said, even the OT said it would happen.
we do not need proof. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word
Dizerner
Active Member
You're missing my point, but okay. I'm glad. I do too.
GodsGrace
Active Member
So what you're saying is that it wasn't NECESSARY for Mary to be declared as not having the sin nature by God?
BUT
All of mankind was affected by Adam's sin...
All....including women.
We were discussing Mary's father.
HE birthed her.
HE had the sin nature.
HE passed it on to Mary....
EXCEPT God declared her free of it.
No EG. It only happened in this one case so Jesus could be birthed by a "clean" woman.
A woman that had no sin in her,,,either personally commited or any stain passed on by her father which was the result of Adam sinning.
No. It doesn't mean Mary's parents birthed her free from sin...
It means that Mary was conceived immaculately....without any sin of any kind.
But this happened by a miracle of God...NOT because her parents did this.
That's why I asked HOW FAR BACK YOU WANNA GO....
It BEGINS and ENDS with Mary's conception.
There's even debate in Catholicism as to WHEN she became immaculate.
Was it at conception...at birth....
Most will say at conception.
GodsGrace
Active Member
We get your point D....
we just can't agree that it would even be necessary.
We can believe even though she wasn't monitored every minute.
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
do you?
The bible tells us he will be born of a virgin. It tells us she was a virgin,
yet you say we have no proof so we can not know if she really was one or not.
GodsGrace
Active Member
We're starting to go around in a circle...
OK. I just don't think saying that God put us in Adam is a good way to describe this.
Or you could clarify.
I asked you if you believed a 3 year old could go to hell.
My answer would be No.
I guess we're really going to have to discuss this....
It sounds like you believe they might.
Scripture is clear that we are not responsible for the sins of others.
The one that believes goes to heaven.Did Jesus pay for sin on the cross?
In Adam all die. in christ shall all be made alive (have the ability)
he who believes is not condemned, he who does not believe is condemned already
so who goes to heaven and who goes to hell?
So can a child truly understand believing in God?
Are they even taught who God is nowadays?
Here are some verse: Could a child understand this?
Deuteronomy 30:15-20
15 "See, I have set before you today life and prosperity, and death and adversity;
16 in that I command you today to love the LORD your God, to walk in His ways and to keep His commandments and His statutes and His judgments, that you may live and multiply, and that the LORD your God may bless you in the land where * you are entering to possess it.
17 "But if your heart turns away and you will not obey, but are drawn away and worship other gods and serve them,
18 I declare to you today that you shall surely perish. You will not prolong your days in the land where * you are crossing the Jordan to enter and possess it.
19 "I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants,
20 by loving the LORD your God, by obeying His voice, and by holding fast to Him; for this is your life and the length of your days, that you may live in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them."
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
No, Mary had a sin nature I am not sure who in history came up with the idea she did not. or why? (unless it was so she could be called the queen of heaven?
But,
Maries sin was not touched by man, So it goes to reason God kept the egg free of the ability to pass on origional sin
No he did not.. That is not true sis. God did not declare her free of sin.. If she was. she would have been saved and not needed a savior
He was born of a clean woman, A child of God.. who like abraham was given the righteousness of christ, so technically, while she had sin, she was innocent. Just like you claim to be
That was not mary
if it was mary, she could have died
This is not found in scripture
Christ was immaculately conceived by the HS. Mary was not. She was conceived by Adam's son (her father)
No it begins and ends with Christs conception (of the HS)
Well that is the problem.
Look to the word. not a pagan church
Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
I keep coming back to scripture
the wage of sin is death
in adam all die
hence by defenition. we are as guilty of adams sin as he was.
But God had a reason for it.. Again, The hidden wisdom of God
Show me this in scripture
God decides not me
I can not answer that question. because it is not thoroughly proved in scripture
again, what sin did jesus not pay for on the cross??
I think you are misunderstanding, because maybe you do not understand what jesus did on the cross.
again, God knows.. You and I do not..
again, God knows
God knows if that person lived to 100. if they would recieve his offer or not.
Does God use this to determine who goes to heaven as a baby?
i do not know.. It is just a guess. because the word is not clear..
Lets not use private interpretations. lets use what can be verified in scripture. as peter did in 2 peter 1
Dizerner
Active Member
No, you really don't.
If you keep telling yourself you already "got" my point you'll never go back and see what my point actually was.
Which is a shame, and also not very respectful.
Why would you insinuate I'm a liar, what is the point of doing that.
I don't come here to lie.
That's your deduction, not mine.
I said it was not a visible miracle because it was symbolic.
I do not think we need logical proofs to know things, so you should not assume that.
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Eternally-Grateful
Active Member
Actions speak louder than words.
Your actions state we can not know
so you must not trust scripture or you would never even question it
why would you even bring it up?
lol..
atpollard
Active Member
The other miracles were given for UNBELIEVERS, in order that they might "believe" ... but the "Virgin Birth" is a miracle given by God that is only of value to those that already believe that Jesus is the Son of God.
For unbelievers, the miracle makes us "fools" for believing such a story.
For believers, the miracle means God cared about US more than we could possibly imagine.
Philippians 2:1-11 [ESV]
So if there is any encouragement in Christ, any comfort from love, any participation in the Spirit, any affection and sympathy, complete my joy by being of the same mind, having the same love, being in full accord and of one mind. Do nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves. Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others. Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Dizerner
Active Member
Absolutely.
And I think it ties in with Federal Headship, Adam's authority, and Original Sin.
Jesus was grafted into the vine supernaturally apart from the sin nature.
GodsGrace
Active Member
D,
I was replying to your post no. 101 in which you said the following:
"I'm pretty sure they didn't all monitor Mary every time she was alone, lol.
Mary was the only soul that knew it for a fact."
I believe my replies to you were respectful and also to the point...
which you made in post 101 about Mary being monitored.
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