brightfame52
Well-known member
Right believing is the result of redemption from iniquity.
Redeemed from unbelief !
- Thread starter brightfame52
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Pancho Frijoles
Well-known member
I think both @brightfame52 and @TomL are right, as it is hard to distinguish the time when we "wanted to believe" from the time we "believed".
God seeds in our hearts the desire to believe, and we may approach God with a very tiny, fragile, faith.... so tiny and fragile, that it is even difficult to even call it "faith". Then, after witnessing God's power, our faith gets robust each day, and it is fully identifiable as "faith".
Take the conversion of Paul as an example.
How did Paul get the forgiveness of his sins?
Did Paul have faith in Christ BEFORE the supernatural experience he had in the way to Damascus?
Did Paul believe BECAUSE of the supernatural experience he had? Was that faith?
If so, why doesn't Christ appear to everyone, so that we cannot do anything but believe and be redeemed?
Acts 22:16 (KJV 1900) — 16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Yes unbelief is a iniquity redeemed from, hence believing results. Believing is the evidence of being redeemed
Pancho Frijoles
Well-known member
Sure, but the emphasis of Paul's storytelling is pointing to God's will and sovereignty as the source of his conversion.
Ananias tells him:
‘The God of our fathers has appointed you to know His will and to see the Just One and to hear His voice, for you will be His witness to all men of what you have seen and heard. And now why do you wait? Rise, be baptized and wash away your sins, and call on the name of the Lord.’
All our faith, and even our desire to have faith when we don't have it, comes from God. He chooses us due to his Mercy and Knowledge that spans before the foundation of the world.
Those who believe are then redeemed
brightfame52
Well-known member
unbelief is a iniquity redeemed from, hence believing results. Believing is the evidence of being redeemed. Christs death takes away the sin of unbelief Rom 11 :26-27
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer[Jesus], and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
After they believe
Acts 10:43 (KJV 1900) — 43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
It seems to me you assume that and that faith is unilaterally produced by God
As Jesus applauded great faith and castigated little faith that appears contrary to Jesus' response to the presense or absence of faith
Pancho Frijoles
Well-known member
I believe in free will, my friend.
I just say that the origin of our faith... as the origin of every single capability of our soul, mind or body, comes from God.
He is the originator of our faith and even of our desire to have faith. Praise be to Him!
What kind of free will? Even determinist Calvinist claim to believe in free will
brightfame52
Well-known member
See before redemption men are in the prison of darkness and unbelief. So if any believes its an evidence of having been redeemed from all iniquity.
not according to scripture
After they believe
Acts 10:43 (KJV 1900) — 43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
brightfame52
Well-known member
See before redemption men are in the prison of darkness and unbelief. So if any believes its an evidence of having been redeemed from all iniquity.
not according to scripture
After they believe
Acts 10:43 (KJV 1900) — 43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
brightfame52
Well-known member
See before redemption men are in the prison of darkness and unbelief. So if any believes its an evidence of having been redeemed from all iniquity.
Forgiveness of sins comes from redemption so the redeemed shall receive the knowledge of it to believe Eph 1:7
In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
One cannot receive and believe something unless it exists already.
civic
Well-known member
the word "unbelief " is not in the text- you added it.
brightfame52
Well-known member
The specific word unbelief doesnt have to be in the text, yet I know unbelief is a sin, iniquity, a disobedience redeemed from, among other things Titus 3:3
For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
Sorry remission of sin requires one first believe
After they believe
Acts 10:43 (KJV 1900) — 43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
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