Mark 16:16~"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

[Doug Brents]

Says a whole lot that you have to depend upon uninspired writings to support your heresy.

Fred, Mark 16:16 is not the whole and sum total of all that Scripture says about baptism being required to receive salvation. It may be that it was added at a later date. And it may be that it was removed or excluded from some manuscripts. We don't know.

But what we do know is that:
Matt 28:19 says that baptism is an act that man must do, and that all who believe in Jesus will be baptized.
Acts 2:38 says that repentance and baptism are both done in order to receive forgiveness of sins.
1 Pet 3:21 says that baptism, in water like the Flood, now saves us.
Col 2:11-14 says that during baptism the Holy Spirit cuts our sins from us and unites us with Jesus resurrection.
Rom 6:1-7 says that in baptism we die to sin and are made new creations.
John 3:5 says that we can only enter the Kingdom of God by being born of water and the Spirit.
Eph 5:25-26 says that we are made pure, holy, and blameless by being washed in water with the Word.

 

[Fred]

Rom 6:1-7 says that in baptism we die to sin and are made new creations.

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/all-believers-are-baptized-into-the-body-of-christ.507/#post-10542

 

[Doug Brents]

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/all-believers-are-baptized-into-the-body-of-christ.507/#post-10542

The renewal our our spirit (dead to sin and alive in Christ) is through the action of the Holy Spirit which occurs during water baptism.

 

[Fred]

The renewal our our spirit (dead to sin and alive in Christ) is through the action of the Holy Spirit which occurs during water baptism.

It took place before water baptism for those in Acts 10.

In terms of water baptism being necessary for their salvation you are seeing a mirage.

 

[Truther]

Says a whole lot that you have to depend upon uninspired writings to support your heresy.

Who dictates to you what is uninspired?

 

[Fred]

Who dictates to you what is uninspired?

Ask this to yourself.

 

[Doug Brents]

It took place before water baptism for those in Acts 10.

Not according to Acts 2:38, 1 Pet 3:21, and many other passages.

In terms of water baptism being necessary for their salvation you are seeing a mirage.

You think it is a mirage, and that is why you refuse the Lord. But His Word is perfect, and it clearly says that we receive His forgiveness, His salvation, His adoption through water baptism. I am sorry for you that you cannot see it yet, but I continually pray that your eyes will be opened to His truth.

 

[360watt]

Believing is the qualifier for baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. Believing doesn’t replace baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. Christendom really goofed it up.

Again, being baptised 'for' the remission of sins is like having something 'for' an illness. The illness is already happened.

So with eternal salvation... the believing and receiving has already happened. Baptism is 'for' this in the sense of showing what has already happened in the believers soul.

I took paracetamol for a cold. The paracetamol didn't give me the cold!

I got baptised for salvation. The water baptism didn't give me salvation.

End.

 

[Fred]

Not according to Acts 2:38,

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/eli-insurance-policy.589/page-3#post-25287

 

[Doug Brents]

I took paracetamol for a cold. The paracetamol didn't give me the cold!

I got baptised for salvation. The water baptism didn't give me salvation.

Baptism is done "in order to receive" salvation. NOT "because it has already been received".
This is born out in that repentance and baptism are both equally "for" salvation in Acts 2:38, and in Acts 3:19 we are told in no uncertain terms that repentance is done "in order to receive" salvation. Thus, both repentance and baptism are "in order to receive" salvation.

 

[Doug Brents]

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/eli-insurance-policy.589/page-3#post-25287

You are still stuck on that falsehood. Salvation/forgiveness of sin is received when one is baptized in water which is when the Holy Spirit cuts our sin from us, unites us with Jesus' death and resurrection, and adds us to the Church. It did not happen for Cornelius when the Holy Spirit gave him miraculous tongues.

 

[Fred]

You are still stuck on that falsehood.

You are still stuck in playing make believe which runs counter with how the words of the Bible are properly defined.

It did not happen for Cornelius when the Holy Spirit gave him miraculous tongues.

I have a passage from the New Covenant that says tongues are for those "in the church" (1 Corinthians 12:28).

You have your world of make believe that teaches otherwise.

 

[Doug Brents]

You are still stuck in playing make believe which runs counter with how the words of the Bible are properly defined.




I have a passage from the New Covenant that says tongues are for those "in the church" (1 Corinthians 12:28).

You have your world of make believe that teaches otherwise.

That passage does not say that ONLY those in the Church can possess the gift of tongues. It says that is one of the gifts that the Holy Spirit can bestow.

 

[Fred]

That passage does not say that ONLY those in the Church can possess the gift of tongues. It says that is one of the gifts that the Holy Spirit can bestow.

You have zero passages from the New Covenant that refute my assertion. Perhaps one day you can stop playing make believe.

Tongues is listed as a gift for those in the church.
Cornelius had the gift of tongues before he was water baptized.
Therefore, Cornelius was in the church before he was water baptized.

 

[Truther]

Ask this to yourself.

I accept that the King James version, including Mark 16 is inspired by God, by faith. Do you believe that any version is inspired by God?

 

[Fred]

I accept that the King James version, including Mark 16 is inspired by God, by faith. Do you believe that any version is inspired by God?

The originals.

 

[Truther]

Again, being baptised 'for' the remission of sins is like having something 'for' an illness. The illness is already happened.

So with eternal salvation... the believing and receiving has already happened. Baptism is 'for' this in the sense of showing what has already happened in the believers soul.

I took paracetamol for a cold. The paracetamol didn't give me the cold!

I got baptised for salvation. The water baptism didn't give me salvation.

End.

You have too much explanation for Acts 2:38. It looks like you’re trying to talk yourself out of something. Acts 2:38 tells us that they were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ specifically for the remission of their sins. Sometimes it’s not good to overthink, but just obey.

 

[Truther]

The originals.

The originals disintegrated about 1500 years ago. Try again.

 

[Fred]

The originals disintegrated about 1500 years ago. Try again.

I already gave my response.

Your weak and pitiful position is highly dependent upon words that are not even part of the Bible.

 

[TomL]

I read that he that believeth will obviously be baptized. He that believeth not will obviously not be. Jesus gets it too.

Generally so but what do you do with a deathbed confession of Christ? Will you say he is not saved because he was not water baptized?