Jesus taught Provisional Atonement

TomL said:
God workmanship is in those who believed and were saved in case you did not understand

Their good behavior is the result of that workmanship
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Do you believe unregenerate dead in sin man contributed to Gods Creation/Workmanship ? A Believer is the result of Gods workmanship
 
TomL said:
A regenerated believer's good works are the result of God workmanship
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Do you believe unregenerate dead in sin man contributed to Gods Creation/Workmanship ? A Believer is the result of Gods workmanship. Isa 437

Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.
Isa 43:7

Even every one that is called by my name[A Christian/Believer]: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

This is speaking of every single true believer that has been redeemed in Christ and the true believer is called by the name of God as belonging to the family of God. Then we read an expression of the power and grace of God. Every true believer has been created anew. Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. (2 Corinthians 5:17) Then the true believer has Christ formed within them. My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you, (Galatians 4:19) Then the LORD states that he was the one who made the true believer. We did not attain this by good works or even keeping the law but it was God himself who chose us and placed us into Christ long before we were even born.



3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: 4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, (Ephesians 1:3-5) https://www.scionofzion.com/isaiah_43_1_14.html
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brightfame52 said:
Do you believe unregenerate dead in sin man contributed to Gods Creation/Workmanship ? A Believer is the result of Gods workmanship. Isa 437

Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.
Isa 43:7

Even every one that is called by my name[A Christian/Believer]: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.
Click to expand...
Isaiah 43:7 (LEB) — 7 everyone who is called by my name, and whom I created for my glory, whom I formed, indeed whom I made.”

it does not state God created him to make him a believer
 
TomL said:
Isaiah 43:7 (LEB) — 7 everyone who is called by my name, and whom I created for my glory, whom I formed, indeed whom I made.”

it does not state God created him to make him a believer
Click to expand...
A Believer was made so by the power of Gods Grace, the totality of a sinner saved by Grace through Faith is the workmanship of Gods Grace. Does a sinner contribute to their creation ? If so, they take someof the Glory from God. Isa 43:7

7 Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

Paul wrote in Eph 1:12 that Trusting in Christ was to the Glory of God

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.
 
brightfame52 said:
A Believer was made so by the power of Gods Grace, the totality of a sinner saved by Grace through Faith is the workmanship of Gods Grace. Does a sinner contribute to their creation ? If so, they take someof the Glory from God. Isa 43:7

7 Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.

Paul wrote in Eph 1:12 that Trusting in Christ was to the Glory of God

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.
Click to expand...
Isaiah 43:7 (LEB) — 7 everyone who is called by my name, and whom I created for my glory, whom I formed, indeed whom I made.”

it does not state God created him to make him a believer
 
TomL said:
Isaiah 43:7 (LEB) — 7 everyone who is called by my name, and whom I created for my glory, whom I formed, indeed whom I made.”

it does not state God created him to make him a believer
Click to expand...
A Believer was made so by the power of Gods Grace, the totality of a sinner saved by Grace through Faith is the workmanship of Gods Grace. Does a sinner contribute to their creation ? If so, they take someof the Glory from God. Isa 43:7 Gill writes and I agree

7 Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have
made him.
Even everyone that is called by my name,.... That is called by the name of God, a son or daughter of his; or by the name of Christ, a Christian; whoever belongs to the Lord, whom he calls by his name; and who, being called by his grace, call upon his name, make a profession of his name, and serve and worship him:
for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him, yea, I have made him; all which is expressive of the power and grace of God, in the regeneration and conversion of his people; which is a creation, a formation, a making them for himself, for the glory of his grace, and to show forth his praise; and therefore he will gather them in, and bring them into a body together, into a church state, that this end may be answered.
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Paul wrote in Eph 1:12 that Trusting in Christ was to the Glory of God

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.
 
Presby02 said:
Nope. Do you make that choice without God or because of God?
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Because of God’s speaking to us through the gospel. The Holy Spirit’s conviction of sin- which is His job (John 16:8)- is necessary to allow for choice. We cannot operate in a vacuum of knowledge. We cannot choose something that is not an option; God has to make an offer before we can choose to accept or reject.


Doug
 
TibiasDad said:
Because of God’s speaking to us through the gospel. The Holy Spirit’s conviction of sin- which is His job (John 16:8)- is necessary to allow for choice. We cannot operate in a vacuum of knowledge. We cannot choose something that is not an option; God has to make an offer before we can choose to accept or reject.


Doug
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The Holy Spirits role is to quicken, regenerate them for whom Christ died and Justified them, that's what Jn 16:8-10 is about. Has nothing to do with men making choices lol, you reading that into the text. He is bringing the Justified person to Faith/belief in Christ.
 
brightfame52 said:
The Holy Spirits role is to quicken, regenerate them for whom Christ died and Justified them, that's what Jn 16:8-10 is about. Has nothing to do with men making choices lol, you reading that into the text. He is bringing the Justified person to Faith/belief in Christ.
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When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment: John 16:8

Where is salvation mentioned? The primary verb is ἐλέγχω, which means “To convict, to reprove, to expose, to refute, to correct.” (Strong)

Nothing about saving!


Doug
 
TibiasDad said:
When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment: John 16:8

Where is salvation mentioned? The primary verb is ἐλέγχω, which means “To convict, to reprove, to expose, to refute, to correct.” (Strong)

Nothing about saving!


Doug
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It doesnt have to be mentioned, its understood. Nevertheless His Role is being described here, nothing man must do, choose, no offers being made And in regeneration He does convict, reprove. He brings them to the light Jn 3:20,21

For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
 

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