Excellent Discussion on OSAS

[JLB]

You dont pay attention. What did the lost coin do ? Nothing, it laid there lost, it had to be found and rescued. Lk 15:8-10

What did the prodigal son do? A human being.

What did the lost sheep do? A reference to a human being.


The coin is not a human being.
The coin is to teach us the principle of lost; one can not lose something unless it first belongs to them.




Do the lost need salvation?

 

[synergy]

"Abraham believed the Word/God and it was credited to him as Righteousness"

JESUS Says: these words I speak to to you, they are Spirit and they are LIFE

Therefore God granted regeneration beginning in Genesis to those of Faith in His Word

During OT times, the Holy Spirit had not been poured out yet by Christ so there was no regeneration at that time.

 

[JLB]

During OT times, the Holy Spirit had not been poured out yet by Christ so there was no regeneration at that time.

A person is regenerated by Christ dwelling in them.

Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. Romans 8:9

Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow.
1 Peter 1:10-11

having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, Ephesians 2:20


Who do you believe spoke out of the mouth of the prophets saying “thus says the LORD”?

 

[DavidTree]

During OT times, the Holy Spirit had not been poured out yet by Christ so there was no regeneration at that time.

During OT times, the BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit had not been poured out yet by Christ

The OT Saints who BELIEVED the WORD received the circumcision in their hearts unto regeneration.

"IF you be Christ's Seed then you are Abrahams seed and heirs according to the Promise"

If Abraham was dead in trespasses and sins then how can we be with BELIEVING Abraham in Christ

JESUS Said: "Abraham did SEE My Day and he rejoiced in it"
How did Abraham SEE??? = thru regeneration unto Life


The BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit is Unique to the New Covenant Purchased by the Blood of Christ

Hebrews - "the blood of bulls and goats could never make them perfect/complete"

 

[JLB]

During OT times, the BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit had not been poured out yet by Christ

The OT Saints who BELIEVED the WORD received the circumcision in their hearts unto regeneration.

"IF you be Christ's Seed then you are Abrahams seed and heirs according to the Promise"

If Abraham was dead in trespasses and sins then how can we be with BELIEVING Abraham in Christ

JESUS Said: "Abraham did SEE My Day and he rejoiced in it"
How did Abraham SEE??? thru regeneration unto Life


The BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit is Unique to the New Covenant Purchased by the Blood of Christ

Hebrews - "the blood of bulls and goats could never make them perfect/complete"

And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” Galatians 3:8

 

[DavidTree]

And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” Galatians 3:8

HalleluYAH

 

[Jim]

Not a prophesy but a Promise to all who BELIEVED the WORD that was GOD

JESUS Says that Abraham, Isaac, Jacob are LIVING
This also applies to everyone who received regeneration from God when they believed His WORD

"Abraham believed the Word/God and it was credited to him as Righteousness"

JESUS Says: these words I speak to to you, they are Spirit and they are LIFE

Being credited with righteousness is Justification, not Regeneration.

 

[Jim]

During OT times, the BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit had not been poured out yet by Christ

The OT Saints who BELIEVED the WORD received the circumcision in their hearts unto regeneration.

"IF you be Christ's Seed then you are Abrahams seed and heirs according to the Promise"

If Abraham was dead in trespasses and sins then how can we be with BELIEVING Abraham in Christ

JESUS Said: "Abraham did SEE My Day and he rejoiced in it"
How did Abraham SEE??? = thru regeneration unto Life


The BAPTISM of the Holy Spirit is Unique to the New Covenant Purchased by the Blood of Christ

Hebrews - "the blood of bulls and goats could never make them perfect/complete"

The Baptism of/with/by the Holy Spirit is regeneration.

 

[DavidTree]

Being credited with righteousness is Justification, not Regeneration.

It certainly is

Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they may be saved. For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.
For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God.
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Abraham was Called out of the world and sin by the LORD GOD
Abraham was saved thru faith in the Word that was God
God preached the (saving) Gospel to Abraham and Abraham BELIEVED and was Regenerated unto spiritual life in God.

What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh?
For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
For what does the Scripture say?
“Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”

 

[DavidTree]

The Baptism of/with/by the Holy Spirit is regeneration.

the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is different from regeneration.
Regeneration is being Born-Again by the Spirit thru the Word that was God

Believe JESUS and forget what you learned from religion.

“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He [a]takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.
You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you.

The 120 disciples who were waiting for the Baptism of the Holy Spirit were already Born-Again by the Word of God = CHRIST

PLEASE read Hebrews chapter 11 - thank you

 

[Jim]

It certainly is

Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they may be saved. For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.
For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God.
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Abraham was Called out of the world and sin by the LORD GOD
Abraham was saved thru faith in the Word that was God
God preached the (saving) Gospel to Abraham and Abraham BELIEVED and was Regenerated unto spiritual life in God.

What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh?
For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
For what does the Scripture say?
“Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”

Justification and righteousness are two separate acts of God.

 

[Jim]

The 120 disciples who were waiting for the Baptism of the Holy Spirit were already Born-Again by the Word of God = CHRIST

Says who?

PLEASE read Hebrews chapter 11 - thank you

Hebrews 11 speaks about the actions of those of faith. It doesn't say anything about baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is what Peter declared for the repentant believers who were baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit, He said they would have their sins forgiven and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The gift there is the Holy Spirit. That is regeneration, that is being born again. They were born of water and Spirit as described by Jesus to Nicodemus in John 3.

 

[DavidTree]

Justification and righteousness are two separate acts of God.

Abraham was BOTH justified and declared righteous by God

JESUS Says they are LIVING

JESUS said this way BEFORE HE went to the Cross = all the way back to Exodus chapter 3

 

[DavidTree]

Says who?

Hebrews 11 speaks about the actions of those of faith. It doesn't say anything about baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is what Peter declared for the repentant believers who were baptized in the name of the Holy Spirit, He said they would have their sins forgiven and receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The gift there is the Holy Spirit. That is regeneration, that is being born again. They were born of water and Spirit as described by Jesus to Nicodemus in John 3.

Hebrews 11 speaks about the actions of those of faith. It doesn't say anything about baptism of the Holy Spirit.

CORRECT

the Baptism of the Holy Spirit could not be given until Christ Ascended back to the FATHER

 

[Jim]

Abraham was BOTH justified and declared righteous by God

JESUS Says they are LIVING

JESUS said this way BEFORE HE went to the Cross = all the way back to Exodus chapter 3

I am sorry. I misspoke or misstyped. Justification and righteousness are the same. To be credited with righteousness is Justification. Justification and regeneration are two different actions of God. Abraham was justified.

 

[Jim]

CORRECT

the Baptism of the Holy Spirit could not be given until Christ Ascended back to the FATHER

Correct. Baptism of the Holy Spirit is regeneration.

 

[DavidTree]

I am sorry. I misspoke or misstyped. Justification and righteousness are the same. To be credited with righteousness is Justification. Justification and regeneration are two different actions of God. Abraham was justified.

Abraham was justified the SAME Way we are justified = Believe the Word of God = Christ

The Difference is that the OT Regenerated Saints had to wait for Christ to FINISH the Work of God on the Cross.

At some point AFTER Christ died on the Cross, HE took with Him the souls of the Saints from Paradise into Heaven.

 

[DavidTree]

Correct. Baptism of the Holy Spirit is regeneration.

Born- Again is Regeneration

the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is in ADDITION to Regeneration and is THAT which makes the NT Saints COMPLETE,
whereas the OT Saints who BELIEVED in the WORD were only born-again by the Spirit.

 

[Jim]

Born- Again is Regeneration

Yes. Born again is regeneration is baptism of the Holy Spirit. It is a unique benefit of the New Covenant.

 

[DavidTree]

Yes. Born again is regeneration is baptism of the Holy Spirit. It is a unique benefit of the New Covenant.

Hebrews chapter 11 = "these all died in faith"

Are we not saved thru faith in the Word that was God