Comparing Calvinism, Arminianism, and Molinism

Wrong. I've illustrated this by asking for people to choose to believe that their left sock will bring them fame and riches. You can't do it, because it's not a choice. You can't choose to believe in something you know is not true.

Faith is based on a revealed truth, and the only way you can recognize the Gospel is truth is if God opens your eyes to it. Faith comes by hearing and hearing [comes by] the word of God/Christ. In other words, if you don't have true hearing, then hearing the Gospel won't enable you to believe it.
We can freely choose to reject Christ or not
We can freely choose to obey Christ or not
We can freely choose to sin or not
We can freely choose to love others or not
We can freely choose to hate or not
We can freely choose to commit adultery or not
We can freely choose to obey the gospel or not
We can freely choose to follow Christ or not

and the list goes on and on and on.

hope this helps !!!
 
We can freely choose to reject Christ or not
We can freely choose to obey Christ or not
We can freely choose to sin or not
We can freely choose to love others or not
We can freely choose to hate or not
We can freely choose to commit adultery or not
We can freely choose to obey the gospel or not
We can freely choose to follow Christ or not

and the list goes on and on and on.

hope this helps !!!
So you also don't believe in eternal security right?
 
Natural ability not the moral ability. Man is a morally fallen creature. Hence, "no one understands, no one seeks after God."
If man is totally depraved, cannot seek God, cannot think a right though about God, cannot know truth as calvinists falsely claim, then why did God have to say 3 times He had to give these unbelieving reprobates over ?

Also how can these reprobates suppress the truth since they are dead and incapable of knowing the truth ?

See the oxymorons with such a the calvinists systematic and presuppositions ?

Romans 1
The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.

Several reasons why the doctrine of TD is not true

1-they suppressed the truth- one has to know the truth to suppress the truth
2-they knew God, He was self evident to them
3-God was understood to them
4-they exchanged the truth
5-they did not retain the knowledge of God, it was not worthwhile for them
6- Therefor from all the above facts God declares 3 times that He gave them over
7- God doesn't need to give anyone over who is already completely unable, enable, completely and totally depraved with no ability's to do otherwise

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

Totally Depraved would imply that one is never able to do what is right and lawful; scripture states that man naturally can keep the law.

the Calvinist Barnes below .

Who hold the truth - Who "keep back," or "restrain" the truth. The word translated "hold" here, sometimes means to "maintain," to "keep," to "observe" 1 Corinthians 7:30; 2 Corinthians 6:12; but it also means to "hold back, to detain, to hinder." Luke 4:42, "the people sought him (Jesus), and came to him, and stayed him." (Greek, the same as here.) Plm 1:13, "whom I would have "retained" with me," etc.; 2 Thessalonians 2:6, "and now ye know what "withholdeth," etc. In this place it means also that they held back, or restrained the truth, by their wickedness.

The truth - The truth of God, in whatever way made known, and particularly, as the apostle goes on to say, what is made known by the light of nature. The truth pertaining to his perfections, his Law, etc. They hold it back. or restrain its influence

hope this helps !!!
 
Natural ability not the moral ability. Man is a morally fallen creature. Hence, "no one understands, no one seeks after God."
The real question is can they respond to a God who seeks them

However

Acts‬ 17:26-27: From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out to him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us.‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Isaiah‬ 55:6-7: Seek the LORD while He may be found; call upon Him while He is near. Let the wicked forsake his way And the unrighteous man his thoughts; And let him return to the LORD, And He will have compassion on him, And to our God, for He will abundantly pardon.



Zephaniah‬ 2:3: Seek the LORD, all you humble of the land, you who do what he commands. Seek righteousness, seek humility; perhaps you will be sheltered on the day of the LORD’S anger. ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Psalms‬ 83:16: Fill their faces with dishonor, That they may seek Your name, O LORD.



‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬ ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬2 Chronicles‬ 20:3‬: Jehoshaphat was afraid and turned his attention to seek the LORD, and proclaimed a fast throughout all Judah. ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬ ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Luke‬ 12:30-31: For all these things the nations of the world eagerly seek; but your Father knows that you need these things. But seek His kingdom, and these things will be added to you. ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Hosea 5:15 (KJV) — 15 I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me early.



Isaiah 45:19–20 (NASB 2020) — 19 “I have not spoken in secret, In some dark land; I did not say to the offspring of Jacob, ‘Seek Me in a wasteland’; I, the LORD, speak righteousness, Declaring things that are right. 20 “Gather yourselves and come; Come together, you survivors of the nations! They have no knowledge, Who carry around their wooden idol And pray to a god who cannot save.



Jeremiah 29:12–14 (NASB 2020) — 12 Then you will call upon Me and come and pray to Me, and I will listen to you. 13 And you will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart. 14 I will let Myself be found by you,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will restore your fortunes and gather you from all the nations and all the places where I have driven you,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will bring you back to the place from where I sent you into exile.’


Deuteronomy 4:29 (ESV) — 29 But from there you will seek the LORD your God and you will find him, if you search after him with all your heart and with all your soul.

2 Chronicles 11:16 (ESV) — 16 And those who had set their hearts to seek the LORD God of Israel came after them from all the tribes of Israel to Jerusalem to sacrifice to the LORD, the God of their fathers.

2 Chronicles 19:3 (ESV) — 3 Nevertheless, some good is found in you, for you destroyed the Asheroth out of the land, and have set your heart to seek God.”

2 Chronicles 20:3 (ESV) — 3 Then Jehoshaphat was afraid and set his face to seek the LORD, and proclaimed a fast throughout all Judah.

2 Chronicles 20:4 (ESV) — 4 And Judah assembled to seek help from the LORD; from all the cities of Judah they came to seek the LORD.

2 Chronicles 34:3 (ESV) — 3 For in the eighth year of his reign, while he was yet a boy, he began to seek the God of David his father, and in the twelfth year he began to purge Judah and Jerusalem of the high places, the Asherim, and the carved and the metal images.

Isaiah 58:2 (ESV) — 2 Yet they seek me daily and delight to know my ways, as if they were a nation that did righteousness and did not forsake the judgment of their God; they ask of me righteous judgments; they delight to draw near to God.
 
Wrong. I've illustrated this by asking for people to choose to believe that their left sock will bring them fame and riches.

Your ask is a lie. The Gospel is not a lie.

You can't do it, because it's not a choice. You can't choose to believe in something you know is not true.

Correct. Your ask is a lie. The Gospel is not a lie. It is based upon the very words of God. It is impossible for God to lie. You lie.

Act 1:3 To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs

Faith is based on a revealed truth, and the only way you can recognize the Gospel is truth is if God opens your eyes to it. Faith comes by hearing and hearing [comes by] the word of God/Christ. In other words, if you don't have true hearing, then hearing the Gospel won't enable you to believe it.

Good way to discount the "Word of God" for your own benefit.

The Gospel is plainly preached with many infallible proofs that can recognized in nature.
 
The real question is can they respond to a God who seeks them

However

Acts‬ 17:26-27: From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out to him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us.‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Isaiah‬ 55:6-7: Seek the LORD while He may be found; call upon Him while He is near. Let the wicked forsake his way And the unrighteous man his thoughts; And let him return to the LORD, And He will have compassion on him, And to our God, for He will abundantly pardon.



Zephaniah‬ 2:3: Seek the LORD, all you humble of the land, you who do what he commands. Seek righteousness, seek humility; perhaps you will be sheltered on the day of the LORD’S anger. ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Psalms‬ 83:16: Fill their faces with dishonor, That they may seek Your name, O LORD.



‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬ ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬2 Chronicles‬ 20:3‬: Jehoshaphat was afraid and turned his attention to seek the LORD, and proclaimed a fast throughout all Judah. ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬ ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Luke‬ 12:30-31: For all these things the nations of the world eagerly seek; but your Father knows that you need these things. But seek His kingdom, and these things will be added to you. ‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬‬



Hosea 5:15 (KJV) — 15 I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me early.



Isaiah 45:19–20 (NASB 2020) — 19 “I have not spoken in secret, In some dark land; I did not say to the offspring of Jacob, ‘Seek Me in a wasteland’; I, the LORD, speak righteousness, Declaring things that are right. 20 “Gather yourselves and come; Come together, you survivors of the nations! They have no knowledge, Who carry around their wooden idol And pray to a god who cannot save.



Jeremiah 29:12–14 (NASB 2020) — 12 Then you will call upon Me and come and pray to Me, and I will listen to you. 13 And you will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart. 14 I will let Myself be found by you,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will restore your fortunes and gather you from all the nations and all the places where I have driven you,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will bring you back to the place from where I sent you into exile.’


Deuteronomy 4:29 (ESV) — 29 But from there you will seek the LORD your God and you will find him, if you search after him with all your heart and with all your soul.

2 Chronicles 11:16 (ESV) — 16 And those who had set their hearts to seek the LORD God of Israel came after them from all the tribes of Israel to Jerusalem to sacrifice to the LORD, the God of their fathers.

2 Chronicles 19:3 (ESV) — 3 Nevertheless, some good is found in you, for you destroyed the Asheroth out of the land, and have set your heart to seek God.”

2 Chronicles 20:3 (ESV) — 3 Then Jehoshaphat was afraid and set his face to seek the LORD, and proclaimed a fast throughout all Judah.

2 Chronicles 20:4 (ESV) — 4 And Judah assembled to seek help from the LORD; from all the cities of Judah they came to seek the LORD.

2 Chronicles 34:3 (ESV) — 3 For in the eighth year of his reign, while he was yet a boy, he began to seek the God of David his father, and in the twelfth year he began to purge Judah and Jerusalem of the high places, the Asherim, and the carved and the metal images.

Isaiah 58:2 (ESV) — 2 Yet they seek me daily and delight to know my ways, as if they were a nation that did righteousness and did not forsake the judgment of their God; they ask of me righteous judgments; they delight to draw near to God.
Naturally they can, morally they cannot because they don't want to.
 
Naturally they can, morally they cannot because they don't want to.

So death doesn't motivate a person to seek God? Is death natural?

I wish I could have a five minute conversation with you. You're abandon this malarky you're spreading. It stinks. It only benefits YOU.
 
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