An Article on free will

[civic]

Oh brother talk about self-righteous. That is so childish.

Father forgive them for they know not what they speaketh.

 

[TedT]

Not if you allow scripture to interpret itself

No such condition applies...we need the Holy Spirit to interpret the word, not the word itself.

 

[brightfame52]

You'll see me right here.

See you at the Judgment as well

 

[brightfame52]

Then you need to see an optometrist.

Here's Tom's post And there's nothing in it about being justified by the law



Your response two he post above:



Can you see what I'm talking about. There's no there there. And as far as this day of judgment you keep harping on, Here's what you sound like.

I know what i posted

 

[TedT]

Not only was judas chosen for perdition, all the non elect were.

Why though???

I contend it was NOT UNconditional but as a response to their free will decision to rebuke YHWH as a false god and a liar....

 

[TedT]

Not only was judas chosen for perdition, all the non elect were.

Agreed ! but only because all the non-elect rebuked HIM as their god and Saviour thinking HIM to be a liar and therefore a false god.

 

[TedT]

Totally unbiblical made up nonsense.

What then does 'condemned already' mean in John 3:18???

Do you not think that the act of condemnation = being chosen, slated, fitted for perdition??

 

[brightfame52]

Why though???

I contend it was NOT UNconditional but as a response to their free will decision to rebuke YHWH as a false god and a liar....

Because it pleased God

 

[TomL]

No such condition applies...we need the Holy Spirit to interpret the word, not the word itself.

Scripture interprets scripture

 

[TomL]

Law keeping wont save you friend.

Still afraid to read the text and report?


If you can read can you post what the enlarged red highlighted text states


Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified

What excuse can you offer for not doing so?

 

[Clifford]

See you at the Judgment as well

see ya

 

[Clifford]

I know what i posted

Exactly you may know It's the rest of this that can't figure out what you're talking about. Just like the video above. It's the same nonsensical stuff over and over. Yeah I know catch you at the judgment. Be there or be square.

 

[Theophilus]

@Theophilus



False accusation

See you at the judgment and we can talk about it. How bow dah?

 

[Richard]

FREEWILL AS TAUGHT IN SCRIPTURE​

by Brian H. Wagner, Ph.D., instructor of church history, theology and biblical languages at Virginia Baptist College

How often have I read in various Facebook theological discussions the declaration of a Calvinist – “Freewill is not taught in Scriptures”? Of course, the freedom of will to go against one’s nature, even for God, is not possible. It is impossible for God to lie or to deny Himself (Titus 1:2, Heb 6:18, 2 Tim 2:13). And it is impossible for me to y by just apping my arms. But the ability to freely make decisions commensurate with the limits of one’s nature and with the opportunities provided for such decision making is logically part of God’s and man’s nature and experience. The exercise of that ability by God and by man is also well documented in Scripture. And I can y… if I decide to get on an airplane and allow its power to transport me through the air!

The following is an attempt at a rather thorough study of words used in the OT and NT that teach aspects and examples of the exercise of freewill. The reader will hopefully become convinced, contrary to Calvinistic dramatic false statements in opposition, that freewill is clearly taught in the Scriptures –

The Hebrew word [verb] נדב naw-dab’ is a primitive root that means – to impel; hence, to volunteer (as a soldier), to present spontaneously…primarily translated as an adverb “willingly” which indicates free motivation or voluntary decision. It is used 17 times in 15 verses throughout OT Scripture [also 3 times in 3 verses using the same root in Aramaic – Ezra 7:13, 15, 16]. (Most of definitions for this paper are adapted from Strong’s Concordance lexical definitions.)

Here are all the verses that translate this word, נדב naw-dab’, with the translation of it underlined. The ESV translation for each verse was chosen to accommodate Calvinist readers, so they won’t have to keep running back to their favorite translation, which is deterministically flavored.

Exod 25:2 ESV “… From every man whose heart moves him you shall receive the contribution for me.

Exod 35:21 ESV And they came, everyone whose heart stirred him, and everyone whose spirit moved him….

Exod 35:29 ESV All the men and women, the people of Israel, whose heart moved them to bring anything for the work that the LORD had commanded by Moses to be done brought it as a freewill offering to the LORD.

Judg 5:2 ESV …that the leaders took the lead in Israel, that the people offered themselves willingly, bless the LORD!

Ezr 7:13 ESV – 13 I make a decree that anyone of the people of Israel or their priests or Levites in my kingdom, who freely offers to go to Jerusalem, may go with you.

—-[The verbal form in this last verse is a participle, on the Hithpael stem, which is reflexive in meaning, thus the word “themselves” should be added. This Hithpael verbal stem is used 17 times in the same reflexive way – Jg 5:2, 9; 1Ch 29:5, 6, 9(2x), 14, 17(2x); 2Ch 17:16; Ezr 1:6, 2:68, 3:5, 7:13, 15, 16; Neh 11:2]. The reflexive action only helps to emphasize the non-compulsory action of the person’s will in the decision made in each context—-

The noun נדבה ned-aw-baw’ is used 26 times in 25 verses, mostly in connection with a voluntary – “freewill” – offering to God. With all these verses one cannot help but ask “How can you have a freewill offering without a freewill?” Calvinists reject its normal meaning, but the Bible literally uses the word 26 times. Even the Calvinist translators of the KJV and ESV freely chose “freewill” as a suitable translation. Their translation choice is telling of what they believed this original word meant.

Here are the verses in which this noun is used:

Exod 35:29 ESV All the men and women, the people of Israel, whose heart moved them to bring anything for the work that the LORD had commanded by Moses to be done brought it as a freewill offering to the LORD. —-[The idea in this verse of a sacri ce made as a free-will offering, one not commanded as an obligation, is also found in – Ex 36:3; Le 7:16; 22:18, 21, 23; 23:38; Nu 15:3; 29:39; De 12:6, 17; 16:10; 2Ch 31:14; Ezr 1:4; 3:5; 8:28; Ps 54:6; 119:108; Eze 46:12(2x); Am 4:5]

Deut 23:23 ESV You shall be careful to do what has passed your lips, for you have voluntarily vowed to the LORD your God what you have promised with your mouth.

2Ch 35:8 ESV And his of cials contributed willingly to the people, to the priests, and to the Levites….

Ps 68:9 ESV Rain in abundance, O God, you shed abroad; you restored your inheritance as it languished;

Ps 110:3 ESV Your people will offer themselves freely on the day of your power, in holy garments; from the womb of the morning, the dew of your youth will be yours.

Hos 14:4 ESV I will heal their apostasy; I will love them freely, for my anger has turned from them.

—All these OT verses clearly confirm that man, even an unregenerate man, can exercise a free-will in a manner pleasing to God. Even God is said to exercise His freewill in Hos 14:4. The translation in Ps 68:9 was obviously determined with some subjectivity. It could easily be translated – “A shower of freewill gifts, O God, you have shed abroad…”

Here are some NT words and verses to consider that also speak to the issue of the freedom of the will. A Calvinist may try to attribute all of the following examples as a result of regeneration, but that does not seem to t this rst example –

Acts 17:11-12 ESV Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessalonica; they received the word with all eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see if these things were so. Many of them therefore believed, with not a few Greek women of high standing as well as men.

—-[from προθυμια proth-oo-mee’-ah, meaning predisposition. See also – 2Co 8:11, 12, 19, 9:2;] The Calvinist may endeavor to suggest this willing predisposition of the Bereans was a result of regeneration, which they think is before faith is expressed. It is very difficult to convince them otherwise when their loyalty to Calvinism is so strong that they refuse to see the gospel of John clearly teaches light is freely received before faith which is before new birth life is given. See John 1:4-13, 12:35-36, 20:30-31.

Other NT verses to consider that speak to the issue of freewill are these –

1Cor 7:37 ESV But whoever is firmly established in his heart, being under no necessity but having his desire under control, and has determined this in his heart, to keep her as his betrothed, he will do well. —-from μη ἔχων ἀνάγκην , literally – “not having a necessity”, which would be impossible if everything was predetermined eternally and immutably, making every event a necessary result of God’s decree. Notice also the verse says this man “having his desire under control, and has determined this in his heart.”

1Cor 9:17 ESV For if I do this of my own will, I have a reward, but if not of my own will, I am still entrusted with a stewardship. —- from εχων hek-own’ meaning willingly.

2Cor 8:3 ESV For they gave according to their means, as I can testify, and beyond their means, of their own accord, and 2Cor 8:17 ESV For he not only accepted our appeal, but being himself very earnest he is going to you of his own accord. —-from αυθαιρετος owthah’-ee-ret-os – meaning self-chosen, and by implication – voluntary.

2Cor 9:7 ESV Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. —- from προαιρεομαι pro-ahee-reh’-om-ahee – meaning to choose for oneself before another thing, to prefer and by implication, to intend.

Phlm 1:14 ESV but I preferred to do nothing without your consent in order that your goodness might not be by compulsion but of your own accord. —- from εκουσιος hek-oo’see-on – meaning willingness.

1Pet 5:2 ESV shepherd the ock of God that is among you, exercising oversight, not under compulsion, but willingly, as God would have you; not for shameful gain, but eagerly; —-from εκουσιον hek-oo-see’-ose – meaning willingly.

The existence of a free will, even post regeneration, runs counter to the idea of an eternally immutable divine will that had completely determined everything forever into the future before creation began. Calvinism is based upon that philosophical premise, making the exercise of any free-will for God or man impossible, before creation and especially after it. That premise makes a falsehood out of these clear Scriptures shared here. These Scriptures and many others clearly show that free will does exist and is being exercised by God and man.

Nice OP.

Scripture portrays humans as having minds and wills of their own. They are, in a real (though limited) sense, creators of their own behavior and determiners of their own destinies—whether this behavior and destiny is in line with God’s will or not. This fundamental assumption is demonstrated in a variety of ways throughout Scripture. It is clearly expressed in Deuteronomy when Yahweh tells the children of Israel:

Surely, this commandment that I am commanding you today is not too hard for you, nor is it too far away…See, I have set before you today life and prosperity, death and adversity. If you obey the commandments of the Lord your God that I am commanding you today, by loving the Lord your God, walking in his ways, and observing his commandments, decrees, and ordinances, then you shall live and become numerous, and the Lord your God will bless you in the land that you are entering to possess. But if your heart turns away and you do not hear, but are led astray to bow down to other gods and serve them, I declare to you today that you shall perish…I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Choose life so that you and your descendants may live…. (Deut. 30:11–19)

Whether the children of Israel are blessed or cursed depends on what they choose to do. God set before them the possibilities of life and death, but they decide which possibilities they shall actualize.

Beginning in the Garden of Eden in which God creates Adam and Eve with the ability to obey or disobey him, and continuing on throughout the Bible through the New Testament where life and death are portrayed as depending on peoples’ acceptance or rejection of the Savior, the Bible portrays people as generating their own activity and creating their own destinies by the decisions they make.

 

[Kokomo]

Nice OP.

Scripture portrays humans as having minds and wills of their own. They are, in a real (though limited) sense, creators of their own behavior and determiners of their own destinies—whether this behavior and destiny is in line with God’s will or not. This fundamental assumption is demonstrated in a variety of ways throughout Scripture. It is clearly expressed in Deuteronomy when Yahweh tells the children of Israel:


Whether the children of Israel are blessed or cursed depends on what they choose to do. God set before them the possibilities of life and death, but they decide which possibilities they shall actualize.

Beginning in the Garden of Eden in which God creates Adam and Eve with the ability to obey or disobey him, and continuing on throughout the Bible through the New Testament where life and death are portrayed as depending on peoples’ acceptance or rejection of the Savior, the Bible portrays people as generating their own activity and creating their own destinies by the decisions they make.

I wholeheartedly agree. We know that God does not change who He is which in turn means that the character of God is not different between the old and new testaments. In the old testament, God makes it clear to the nation of Israel that they have two options in front of them.

Those options are to choose life or death.

Here is another example, in the Garden of Eden, the devil had to make Eve choose to rebel against what God had commanded her and Adam to do. Adam and Eve in the garden had free will as you pointed out.

We are told in scripture that we cannot please God without having faith.

We are also told that God wants none of us to perish and that the gospel is now available to all men through Jesus’ death and resurrection

Nevertheless, do not let this one fact escape you, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord does not delay and is not tardy or slow about what He promises, according to some people’s conception of slowness, but He is long-suffering (extraordinarily patient) toward you, not desiring that any should perish, but that all should turn to repentance.
2 Peter 3:8–9

I'll go with the truth of what the Bible says rather than the Twisted Scripture found in Calvinism.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Scripture portrays humans as having minds and wills of their own. They are, in a real (though limited) sense, creators of their own behavior and determiners of their own destinies—whether this behavior and destiny is in line with God’s will or not. This fundamental assumption is demonstrated in a variety of ways throughout Scripture. It is clearly expressed in Deuteronomy when Yahweh tells the children of Israel:

A man’s heart plans his way,
But the Lord directs his steps.

As for Deuteronomy, God tells them to choose either blessing or a curse. Then He tells them He's going to curse them. Why? God says He has not yet given them eyes to see or ears to hear. I think that has something to do with the fact that God knows they're going to choose the curse. He first has to teach them they can't obey the law and must trust in God instead. But fear not, God said that sometime in the future He will write his laws upon their hearts so that they can love God and live.

None of that sounds to me like men being determiners of their own destiny.

 

[brightfame52]

Still afraid to read the text and report?


If you can read can you post what the enlarged red highlighted text states


Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified

What excuse can you offer for not doing so?

You know keeping the law and keeping requirements to get saved are the same.

 

[brightfame52]

Exactly you may know It's the rest of this that can't figure out what you're talking about. Just like the video above. It's the same nonsensical stuff over and over. Yeah I know catch you at the judgment. Be there or be square.

Then it's over your head

 

[Clifford]

Then it's over your head

Seriously, as far as you posts go we're talking like the dark side of the Moon.

 

[Clifford]

You know keeping the law and keeping requirements to get saved are the same.

Yes I must admit you're misinterpretation of the Bible is way over my head.

Like this one...You got to be kidding me, you actually think that keeping the law is the same as what Jesus taught about salvation?

Okay let's do salvation 101.

Jesus taught that salvation is by grace through faith. It is through faith in him that we are reconciled with God. Hebrews 10:1–4, “The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves.

Galatians 3:10, “For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.’”

Galatians 5:4, “You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.”

Even Abraham was justified by faith, not the law.

Salvation is found solely in the name of Jesus.
"And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.” Acts 4:12