An Article on free will

[GodsGrace]

When did God choose His sheep?

God chose His sheep one at a time.
When we decided to listen to God, hear God, and obey God.

John 3:16
16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.


When we decide to believe In Him...we will be saved.


Acts 16:31
31 They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."


1 John 1:3
3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.


The gospel is proclamed...
When we believe it...we are saved.

 

[Selah]

Before the foundation of world, He chose them in Christ their Shepard Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

You got this part right.

 

[Selah]

God chose His sheep one at a time.
When we decided to listen to God, hear God, and obey God.

John 3:16
16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.


When we decide to believe In Him...we will be saved.


Acts 16:31
31 They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."


1 John 1:3
3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.


The gospel is proclamed...
When we believe it...we are saved.

We never belonged to that ol’ dragon.

 

[brightfame52]

We never belonged to that ol’ dragon.

Yes even though Gods elect were born enslaved by and under the power of the devil, the power of darkness, they never belonged to him, but to God, and because theyre Gods little children, Christ their elder Brother redeems them from the devils captivity.

 

[civic]

Since I directly quoted what Paul claimed in his letter to the Ephesians, I am pretty sure that it IS TRUE.

If you think Paul got it wrong, then tell God.
Revising Scripture is above my pay grade.

Did you read the 1 John passages I quoted

 

[Donald]

Free will and Gods sovereignty go hand and hand. The sovereignty of God is just as strong, if not stronger, in a world where human beings have the power of choice between alternatives. One reason for saying this is that God is the one who freely—sovereignly—decided to give this power to those he created to bear his image.

Another is the fact that God is marvelously able to govern the world, and achieve his ends—for every individual and the world and human race as a whole—in spite of the fact that the persons he made exercise the freedom to choose.

Whatever the Lord pleases, that has He done in the heavens and on earth, in the seas and all deeps
Psalm 135:6.

 

[atpollard]

Did you read the 1 John passages I quoted

If John thinks that Paul got it wrong then he should tell God because rewriting Ephesians 2 is still above my pay grade. I just quoted what Paul said.

 

[civic]

If John thinks that Paul got it wrong then he should tell God because rewriting Ephesians 2 is still above my pay grade. I just quoted what Paul said.

No you are pitting them against each other which is not necessary and John expands on the teaching. All unbelievers ( which every believer was at one time ) were children of the devil and Paul calls these same ones children of wrath.

1 John 3:7-10
Dear children, do not let anyone lead you astray. The one who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous. 8;The one who does what is sinful is of the devil,because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil’s work. 9No one who is born of God will continue to sin,because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. 10;This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

 

[brightfame52]

No you are pitting them against each other which is not necessary and John expands on the teaching. All unbelievers ( which every believer was at one time ) were children of the devil and Paul calls these same ones children of wrath.

1 John 3:7-10
Dear children, do not let anyone lead you astray. The one who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous. 8;The one who does what is sinful is of the devil,because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil’s work. 9No one who is born of God will continue to sin,because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. 10;This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

Dont Gods children need chastening at times for doing wrong ? Are they children of devil when they sin, or maybe live in sin for a while being struggling with lust and stuff

 

[GodsGrace]

If John thinks that Paul got it wrong then he should tell God because rewriting Ephesians 2 is still above my pay grade. I just quoted what Paul said.

You quote.
But you do not exegete.
You bring your preconceived beliefs to the scripture.

NOWHERE in the NT does it state that God picks and chooses.

God is a just God and will give to each man what he deserves:


John 5:28-29
28 "Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,
29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.
Romans 2:5-8
5 But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,
6 who WILL RENDER TO EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS:
7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
8 but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation.


God will render to each man according to his deeds....
to those who do good....honor and immortality.

To those who do not obey the truth...wrath and indignation.

God even tells us HOW we will be judged.

 

[Donald]

Dont Gods children need chastening at times for doing wrong ? Are they children of devil when they sin, or maybe live in sin for a while being struggling with lust and stuff

I think God has taken all of us to the "wood shed" a time or two.

 

[brightfame52]

I think God has taken all of us to the "wood shed" a time or two.

Does that mean the children of God turned into the children of the devil for a while ?

 

[Donald]

Does that mean the children of God turned into the children of the devil for a while ?

No that can never happen. It means God corrects His children. Have you ever experienced the Fathers discipline?

 

[atpollard]

This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child, nor is anyone who does not love their brother and sister.

John is describing TWO distinct groups (like Sheep and Goats, or Wheat and Tares). Each child is (and remains) a child of their father. Children of God were NEVER children of the devil (as wheat were never tares and sheep were never goats). Children of the devil will never become children of God (as tares can never become wheat and goats can never become sheep). Children of God were prisoners of the devil, but being enslaved does not make you a child … it makes you a slave until freed.

 

[Selah]

Does that mean the children of God turned into the children of the devil for a while ?

Nope, because children of God will repent and God in His mercy will forgive.

 

[ProDeo]

@Kermos

Hi Kermos,,,
I've been asking this of the Reformed/Calvinist believers for some time now.

In my post to you, no. 9467, I also asked YOU:

Could you reply please?

Here it is:

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Post 9467


Could you reply to the following please?:

If God is sovereign....in the way that you understand sovereignty....
and God desires that all men be saved:


1 Timothy 2:4
3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.


Then WHY aren't all men saved?

Is the NT lying?
Is God unable to save everyone?

Excellent question.

May your post be unanswered by our Calvinist / Reformed friends, allow me THE answer.

God certainly can, by taken away His creatures free will (or more simply their will) making them robots always pleasing Him.

With fake love as a result.

 

[ProDeo]

Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.

Maybe the following is farfetched, yet it could be very important, John says :

The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.

It suggests a different order of what I (speaking for myself) what I always believed, that destroying the works of the devil was a sort of (great) byproduct of Jesus coming, but not the main point, such as reconciliation, forgiveness, salvation.

It seems that John is saying that the order is : destroy the works of the devil, reconciliation, forgiveness, salvation.

for the devil has been sinning from the beginning - John points us directly to the Garden -- Genesis 3

 

[ProDeo]

Before the foundation of world, He chose them in Christ their Shepard Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Correct, by His foreknowledge He knows the names in the book of life, your name, my name, even before we were born. And yet He wants it played out, we running the race. A good question would be, if He knows all the outcome of every soul born, knows all the names in the book of life, then why does God said -

Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth.

Estimated +100 billions are born since the Flood, why did God want that if He knew every outcome on beforehand ?

 

[GodsGrace]

Excellent question.

May your post be unanswered by our Calvinist / Reformed friends, allow me THE answer.

God certainly can, by taken away His creatures free will (or more simply their will) making them robots always pleasing Him.

With fake love as a result.

OR
Man has a part in accepting God's gift of salvation.

Yes. The question has never been answered.
And never will.
!

 

[GodsGrace]

Nope, because children of God will repent and God in His mercy will forgive.

Selah,,,,you've been sounding very Calvinist lately....
so I have a question for you regarding the above statement....

You say that children of God will repent and God in His mercy will forgive.

1. You stated that we are NEVER children of satan.
So WHY would we have to repent??
Do you realize what REPENT means??

2. Why would God "in His mercy" have to forgive us?
IF we were NEVER children of satan...
WHAT is God forgiving us of?


One of our Calvinist friends reading along might want to reply to.