All Claims of The Son's Deity

[dwight92070]

In Luke 6:33-44, Jesus feeds the 5,000 men with five loaves and two fish. We have read and heard the story so many times that it essentially goes in one ear and out the other. But when you meditate on this miracle, the reality of it is astounding. If each man had a wife, or even most of them had a wife - and each family had just one child, which is highly unlikely - it's more likely that each family had several children, then this miracle suddenly appears ENORMOUS:

5,000 men
4,000 wives (a conservative guess)
12,000 children (3 children for 4000 couples) again a conservative guess - they had large families back then

21,000 total persons fed with five loaves and two fish

Obviously, the popularity of Jesus was HUGE. He had healed so many people and performed so many miracles. A large percentage of the men most likely worked with the land - farming and livestock, etc. So it was very possible for them to spend some time away from their work, to see who Jesus was. Many of them may have come to be healed as well. No doubt even many owners of the land, which many of them were, wanted to see and hear Jesus.

In all of history, there has never been a man or woman - besides Jesus - who has performed such an awesome miracle.
I've heard some who deny that Jesus is God say: That's no big deal. Even Jesus' apostles raised the dead, cleansed lepers, healed the sick, etc. Even some prophets did miracles. Just as the Holy Spirit worked through them to perform miracles, even so the Holy Spirit gave Jesus the power to work this miracle. In other words they say many others have done the same miracles.

NOT LIKE THIS! Yes, Jesus may have done this miracle by the power given Him by the Holy Spirit, but don't you see the difference? The sheer "volume" of power given to Jesus for this miracle is INFINITELY BEYOND that power that was EVER given to any other man or woman in all of history.

So even if Jesus were not God - and of course I believe He is - He would have to be "SUPERMAN" or an extremely EXALTED MAN to be given the privilege and the gift of SUCH AWESOME POWER.

There's no other explanation, is there?

Yes, I believe He was HIGHLY EXALTED, EVEN TO SIT ON THE THRONE OF GOD:

"He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne. Revelation 3:21

No one EVER sits on the Father's throne, unless He is God. Please show me an exception to this.

Apparently, sitting at the right hand of God -Colossians 3:1, IS SITTING ON GOD'S THRONE.

Look at Revelation 22:1 and 3:

"Then he showed me a river of the water of life, clear as crystal, COMING DOWN FROM THE THRONE OF GOD AND OF THE LAMB," Did you notice? It's ONE THRONE!

Verse 3: "There will no longer be any curse; AND THE THRONE OF GOD AND OF THE LAMB will be in it, and HIS (SINGULAR) bond-servants will serve Him (SINGULAR)". Do you see it? The Father and the Son ARE GOD - and of course the Holy Spirit.

"Unless you believe that I AM, you will die in your sins." John 8:24

 

[Peterlag]

I still did not see the word "my" in Psa 45:6 and Heb 1:8.

I just wonder, you post the correct verses but explain the opposite. "Your throne is God," is a translation from Hebrew to Greek and not an exact quotation of the Tanakh Psa 45:6, you've presented it correctly above. Bear in mind, you again described "God as a throne." Yes, Jesus had gotten back His glory which He had with the Father before the world existed.

Your explanation of Heb 1:8, is in contrast to the Bible text you posted, I colored it red above. Does it mean we have eyes but cannot see? I have to prove Jesus Godship yet, next will be the Trinity.

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, [God's throne] O God, [O God means God] is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, [which is still God's throne] O God, [O God is still God] is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

 

[Pancho Frijoles]

A major component of Jewish Monotheism was (and is) the fact that only God is the proper recipient of worship.

In defining "Monotheism" the Jewish Encyclopedia (1901) affirms that it entails the "worshipers of the one God and of Him alone." (See the first paragraph)
https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/tje/m/monotheism.html

Since the Bible teaches the Lord Jesus is the proper recipient of worship proves He is God.

Thanks for mentioning "the heart of the matter."

If it were true that…
1) worshiping only God (a “Him”, a singular person, as per the definition of the Jewish Encyclopedia) is essential to Jewish monotheism, and
2) Jesus and his disciples never demanded anyone to abandon Jewish monotheism, but confirmed and supported Jewish monotheism and
3) Jesus is a proper recipient of worship

The only possible conclusion would be that the God of Israel is Jesus, and that’s why Jesus is a proper recipient of worship. But then, who is The Father?

 

[Fred]

If it were true that…
1) worshiping only God (a “Him”, a singular person, as per the definition of the Jewish Encyclopedia) is essential to Jewish monotheism, and
2) Jesus and his disciples never demanded anyone to abandon Jewish monotheism, but confirmed and supported Jewish monotheism and
3) Jesus is a proper recipient of worship

The only possible conclusion would be that the God of Israel is Jesus, and that’s why Jesus is a proper recipient of worship. But then, who is The Father?

Thus, it is absurd to deny the Lord Jesus is God.

 

[Peterlag]

The most damage the trinity does is that it takes Jesus right out of the picture...

Jesus is the son of God, the Messiah to Israel, and the now resurrected Lord Christ to the Christian who sits at the right hand of God as second in command and is the head of the Church that is called the body of Christ.

You don't have the Lord Christ if you make him God.

 

[Capbook]

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, [God's throne] O God, [O God means God] is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, [which is still God's throne] O God, [O God is still God] is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

You just made God the Father had a God. Your interpretation will be corrected by the next verse.

Ps 45:7
7 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated wickedness;
Therefore God, Thy God, has anointed Thee
With the oil of joy above Thy fellows.
NASB

 

[MTMattie]

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, [God's throne] O God, [O God means God] is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, [which is still God's throne] O God, [O God is still God] is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

How??????????????/ Is it possible that even you can not see the truth. Have you studied these in depth? Have you a file on these of comparisons?

The psalmist is directly addressing the King as “God” ( elohim). he writes, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever.” Furthermore, he seems to show diversity within God’s nature. He writes, “God, Your God, has anointed You” (Ps. 45:6-7). How can a human king carry the title “God”? And how can one “God” speak to another “God”? One Hebrew scholar tells this anecdote, regarding Psalm 45:

An Israeli rabbi, to translated the words kis’aka ‘elohim ‘olam wa’ed. He replied immediately, ‘Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,’ explaining, ‘These are praises to the Almighty.’ But once he read the rest of the psalm, clearly addressed to the king, his face dropped. How could this earthly king be called ‘elohim?

Obviously this is the most natural and obvious meaning of the Hebrew, and no one would have questioned such a rendering had the entire psalm been addressed to God.

The rabbi repeated... ''Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,’ explaining, '' This is the most natural and obvious meaning of the Hebrew, and no one would have questioned such a rendering had the entire psalm been addressed to God.

Consider now how this text fits Jesus. While we have the psalmist referring to an earthly king being called “God” (elohim) and ruling on a throne “forever and ever.” Deny, if you can that Jesus fits this passage beautifully: He is both human and divine, and he will rule on Earth “forever and ever.”

Are you concerned about the marriage end of things????? Silly one.

We are the bride of Christ. I see this as Verses 10-15 focusing on the bride, urging her to leave her past and embrace her new identity. Listen, O daughter, consider and incline your ear: Forget your people and your father’s house (Psalm 45:10). This symbolizes the Church's call to leave behind worldly ties and fully commit to Christ. Just as we are called to embrace our new identity in Christ, leaving behind our old ways.

No explanation needed for Hebrew 1-8

But unto the son (JESUS) he (the Father) saith, Thy (referring to Jesus) throne (which is still God's throne) O God.... ( is still the Father talking to the Son.)( And the Father IS calling the Son, God.)

You don't have the Lord Christ if you make him God.

And if He id not God, you would not be here.

 

[Peterlag]

How??????????????/ Is it possible that even you can not see the truth. Have you studied these in depth? Have you a file on these of comparisons?

The psalmist is directly addressing the King as “God” ( elohim). he writes, “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever.” Furthermore, he seems to show diversity within God’s nature. He writes, “God, Your God, has anointed You” (Ps. 45:6-7). How can a human king carry the title “God”? And how can one “God” speak to another “God”? One Hebrew scholar tells this anecdote, regarding Psalm 45:

An Israeli rabbi, to translated the words kis’aka ‘elohim ‘olam wa’ed. He replied immediately, ‘Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,’ explaining, ‘These are praises to the Almighty.’ But once he read the rest of the psalm, clearly addressed to the king, his face dropped. How could this earthly king be called ‘elohim?

Obviously this is the most natural and obvious meaning of the Hebrew, and no one would have questioned such a rendering had the entire psalm been addressed to God.

The rabbi repeated... ''Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,’ explaining, '' This is the most natural and obvious meaning of the Hebrew, and no one would have questioned such a rendering had the entire psalm been addressed to God.

Consider now how this text fits Jesus. While we have the psalmist referring to an earthly king being called “God” (elohim) and ruling on a throne “forever and ever.” Deny, if you can that Jesus fits this passage beautifully: He is both human and divine, and he will rule on Earth “forever and ever.”

Are you concerned about the marriage end of things????? Silly one.

We are the bride of Christ. I see this as Verses 10-15 focusing on the bride, urging her to leave her past and embrace her new identity. Listen, O daughter, consider and incline your ear: Forget your people and your father’s house (Psalm 45:10). This symbolizes the Church's call to leave behind worldly ties and fully commit to Christ. Just as we are called to embrace our new identity in Christ, leaving behind our old ways.

No explanation needed for Hebrew 1-8

But unto the son (JESUS) he (the Father) saith, Thy (referring to Jesus) throne (which is still God's throne) O God.... ( is still the Father talking to the Son.)( And the Father IS calling the Son, God.)


And if He id not God, you would not be here.

I like the translation of the Coverdale Bible of 1535. It does not see 2 Gods. The translation with that manuscript is God (which is thy God)...

Coverdale Bible of 1535
Thou hast loued rightuousnesse, & hated iniquite: wherfore God (which is thy God) hath anoynted the with the oyle of gladnes aboue thy felowes.

 

[MTMattie]

I like the translation of the Coverdale Bible of 1535. It does not see 2 Gods. The translation with that manuscript is God (which is thy God)...

Coverdale Bible of 1535
Thou hast loued rightuousnesse, & hated iniquite: wherfore God (which is thy God) hath anoynted the with the oyle of gladnes aboue thy felowes.

Of course you do.

Whatever

 

[Capbook]

I like the translation of the Coverdale Bible of 1535. It does not see 2 Gods. The translation with that manuscript is God (which is thy God)...

Coverdale Bible of 1535
Thou hast loued rightuousnesse, & hated iniquite: wherfore God (which is thy God) hath anoynted the with the oyle of gladnes aboue thy felowes.

Coverdale Bible is a paraphrase translation that changed Bible words and cannot be look upon its definition through Bible lexicons. That is why Arians ran to thought for thought translations just support their belief. I believe you've mentioned to me that you are a KJV fellow, why not use it?

The Hebrew Bible render Psa 45:7,(8 in the Tanakh) compare to KJV through Strong Numbers and that proves the"therefore God, thy God" we can read two word "God" in both Hebrew and English. The first "God" refer to Jesus and the second "God" refer to the Father.


Psa 45:8 אהבת H157  צדק H6664  ותשׂנא H8130  רשׁע H7562  על H5921  כן H3651  משׁחך H4886  אלהים H430  אלהיך H430  שׁמן H8081  שׂשׂון H8342  מחבריך׃ H2270 

Psa 45:7 Thou lovest H157  righteousness, H6664  and hatest H8130  wickedness: H7562  therefore H5921 H3651  God, H430  thy God, H430  hath anointed H4886  thee with the oil H8081  of gladness H8342  above thy fellows. H4480H2270