Acts 22:16 Paul's salvation

[praise_yeshua]

Amen, this is new testament gospel folks.

James made it simple to understand that faith is dead without obedience,

James 2:20,
- but do you want to know O foolish man that faith without works is dead

Anyone who claims Abraham was justified without obedience is teaching Abraham was justified with a dead faith.

There is no reconciling what Paul teaches about faith and what "James" teaches concerning faith. They are incompatible. There are many good things written in "James" but they are rudimentary and devoid of the revelation once again brought to light through the teachings of the apostles.

Have you stopped to consider that if what James said is true, then Abraham wasn't justified for many many years after abandoning his life for God?

"James" appeals to the offering of Isaac as justification when Abraham believed God and it was counted unto as righteousness. I mean why did Abraham even leave Mesopotamia?

Act 7:2 And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory appeared unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia

Act 7:4 Then came he out of the land of the Chaldaeans

"when his father was dead, he removed him into this land, wherein ye now dwell."

Abraham's journey began much sooner than most anyone realizes. Abraham was "chasing God" before his father even died. That is the work of faith. Faithful men follow God.... even when men like this "James" refuse to recognize it.

Don't get me wrong. Not all men are at the same place of faith that others are.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Paul was told by Jesus on the road to Damascus in Acts 9 that Ananias would teach him the gospel.
This is why Paul did not receive the Holy Spirit until Ananias came to him.

The faith onlyist always claim Paul was saved on the road to Damascus.
If that is true he was saved without receiving the Holy Spirit gift.

Acts 2:38,
- then Peter said to them, repent and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins and you will recieve the gift of the Holy Spirit


Acts 22:16,
- and now why are you waiting, arise and baptized and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Ananias preached the same water baptism to Paul as Peter's gospel in Acts 2.

Same gospel, same forgiveness of sins.

Notice Ananias said Arise be baptized and wash away your sins calling on the name of the Lord

Annaians knew Paul had not had his sins washed away on the road to Damascus.
Baptists and other faith onlyist need to accept what the Bible says not what their sect's theology teaches.

There is no scenario wherein a person expresses faith in God that doesn't lead to salvation. The smallest seed of faith GROWS.......

Paul was broken when Stephen gave his life for God that Paul might live.......

 

[Doug Brents]

There is no reconciling what Paul teaches about faith and what "James" teaches concerning faith. They are incompatible. There are many good things written in "James" but they are rudimentary and devoid of the revelation once again brought to light through the teachings of the apostles.

James is Scripture, just as Paul's letters are. They are both equally the Word of God, and so cannot be contradictory. Please remember that Paul is not talking about just any works, but "works of the LAW" (the Law of Moses).

Have you stopped to consider that if what James said is true, then Abraham wasn't justified for many many years after abandoning his life for God?

Abraham's faith began when he left Ur at God's direction. He was not justified years later. He was justified by his faith when God said he was back in Gen 15.

"James" appeals to the offering of Isaac as justification when Abraham believed God and it was counted unto as righteousness. I mean why did Abraham even leave Mesopotamia?

Abraham's sacrifice of Isaac was the biggest demonstration of his faith that he made. But it was not the first. So James, through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, points back to this event as a demonstration of his faith.

Act 7:2 And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory appeared unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia

Act 7:4 Then came he out of the land of the Chaldaeans

"when his father was dead, he removed him into this land, wherein ye now dwell."

Abraham's journey began much sooner than most anyone realizes. Abraham was "chasing God" before his father even died. That is the work of faith. Faithful men follow God.... even when men like this "James" refuse to recognize it.

Don't get me wrong. Not all men are at the same place of faith that others are.

No one I know of disputes that Abraham's faith journey began when God called him out of Ur. And leaving Ur is an example of his faith that Paul uses, but James chose to use his sacrifice of Isaac to show that again the earlier Scripture was fulfilled that he was declared righteous because of his faith.

 

[Doug Brents]

Paul was broken when Stephen gave his life for God that Paul might live.......

Where do you get that nonsense? Paul was not broken when he approved of Stephen's execution. He was proud of what those men had done, and he went on to further persecute believers in Jesus. He would have gone to his grave believing he was right and proper in his persecution if Jesus had not shown Himself to Saul on the Road to Damascus. That is where he was broken, and then his sins were forgiven when he was baptized three days later, and then he was taught the Gospel by God, and then he began teaching the Gospel.

 

[Titus]

There is no reconciling what Paul teaches about faith and what "James" teaches concerning faith. They are incompatible. There are many good things written in "James" but they are rudimentary and devoid of the revelation once again brought to light through the teachings of the apostles.

Have you stopped to consider that if what James said is true, then Abraham wasn't justified for many many years after abandoning his life for God?

"James" appeals to the offering of Isaac as justification when Abraham believed God and it was counted unto as righteousness. I mean why did Abraham even leave Mesopotamia?

Act 7:2 And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory appeared unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia

Act 7:4 Then came he out of the land of the Chaldaeans

"when his father was dead, he removed him into this land, wherein ye now dwell."

Abraham's journey began much sooner than most anyone realizes. Abraham was "chasing God" before his father even died. That is the work of faith. Faithful men follow God.... even when men like this "James" refuse to recognize it.

Don't get me wrong. Not all men are at the same place of faith that others are.

Was James epistle from God, 1Peter 4:11 or from men?

 

[praise_yeshua]

Was James epistle from God, 1Peter 4:11 or from men?

I feel no obligation to accept the choices of men made in the 4th century concerning what "writing" is canonical and what writings are not. Quick.... tell me what canonical council established your canon FOR YOU.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Was James epistle from God, 1Peter 4:11 or from men?

Since you prefer Peter.....BTW... Did Peter always speaking the truth? What about Paul's need to withstand the hypocrisy of Peter relative to refusing to accept Gentiles?

 

[praise_yeshua]

Where do you get that nonsense? Paul was not broken when he approved of Stephen's execution.

Really..... Paul repeatedly said....

Gal 1:13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:

He was proud of what those men had done, and he went on to further persecute believers in Jesus. He would have gone to his grave believing he was right and proper in his persecution if Jesus had not shown Himself to Saul on the Road to Damascus. That is where he was broken, and then his sins were forgiven when he was baptized three days later, and then he was taught the Gospel by God, and then he began teaching the Gospel.

Jesus referenced "kicking against the pricks".....

Act 9:4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?
Act 9:5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

Do you know what that means? Go for it.

 

[praise_yeshua]

James is Scripture, just as Paul's letters are. They are both equally the Word of God, and so cannot be contradictory. Please remember that Paul is not talking about just any works, but "works of the LAW" (the Law of Moses).

You don't need to tell me what is being "talked about". I can read it myself. The only reason you believe James is "inspired" is because someone insisted that you believe it. You beliefs were set by others. I know the subject well. I set my own beliefs. Every man shall face God alone. I don't trust men enough to let them do the believing for me. I do my own work. Most people are too lazy to do that. They go to "church" every Sunday and let others believe for them.

Abraham's faith began when he left Ur at God's direction. He was not justified years later. He was justified by his faith when God said he was back in Gen 15.

So you don't believe words found in Acts 7? If you don't then don't pretend you actually believe in the "sacred" canon.

Abraham's sacrifice of Isaac was the biggest demonstration of his faith that he made. But it was not the first. So James, through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, points back to this event as a demonstration of his faith.

No. James makes such a "display" mandatory. I don't have to accept "James's" argument. It is rather ridiculous at "face value". Abraham did many mighty works long before offering up "His only son".

So tell me.... What "mighty work" have you performed? Have you had your "Isaac" moment? You pale in comparison to Abraham. You're no Abraham yourself.

No one I know of disputes that Abraham's faith journey began when God called him out of Ur. And leaving Ur is an example of his faith that Paul uses, but James chose to use his sacrifice of Isaac to show that again the earlier Scripture was fulfilled that he was declared righteous because of his faith..

He believed for the birth of Isaac even when Sarah was barren and unable to have children because she had passed the age of child barring. Abraham was a 100 years old and Sarah was 90 years old when they had Isaac.

 

[mailmandan]

"Believed" here comes from "pistis" meaning faith. Faith is not real unless it is completed/made perfect through action. Faith without action is completely meaningless, dead, worthless, and ineffectual.

An act of faith is part of what faith is. Without the act of faith, faith isn't real, it is dead. James 2:23 says that the Scripture was fulfilled. What does that mean? It means that Abraham was justified (accounted as, made righteous, declared not guilty) by God in Gen 15:5, and he was again justified in Gen 22. He continually demonstrated his faith through what he did, and what he did was credited to him as righteousness because he did it in trust that God would do what He said He would do, even if he killed the son through whom God said He would fulfill His promise (Rom 4:19-21).

Actions/works are the fruit, by product and demonstrate evidence of authentic faith, but not the very essence of faith and also not the basis or means by which we obtain salvation. You error by infusing or conjoining faith and works together then simply calling it faith. Prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church, I made that same error.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Actions/works are the fruit, by product and demonstrate evidence of authentic faith, but not the very essence of faith and also not the basis or means by which we obtain salvation. You error by infusing or conjoining faith and works together then simply calling it faith. Prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church, I made that same error.

Every single canonical council were based upon Roman Catholic doctrine. Every single one of them. Just making the point.

I studied the canon very early in my Christian life. That study has been one of the most fruitful endeavors I've ever undertaken to know God. It made me realize just how I was endlessly influenced by the choices of other men.

Don't get me wrong. Some of that influence is good. Some of it is very bad. We must study and seek God to know the difference.

 

[Titus]

I feel no obligation to accept the choices of men made in the 4th century concerning what "writing" is canonical and what writings are not. Quick.... tell me what canonical council established your canon FOR YOU.

Alright, you admit you are a Bible denier not a Bible believer.
You have zero credibility as far as your teaching of the Bible. YOU DON'T BELIEVE IT.

You are calling God a liar!!!!

Psalm 12:7,
- you shall keep them O Lord thou shalt preserve them from this generation  forever

God keeps His promises, Hebrews 6:13-15.

You know a man cannot have the truth when he denies the truth,
John 17:17,
- sanctify them by your truth, your word is truth

 

[praise_yeshua]

Alright, you admit you are a Bible denier not a Bible believer.
You have zero credibility as far as your teaching of the Bible. YOU DON'T BELIEVE IT.

Name calling means nothing to me. You're lying. I accept the vast majority of the Protestant Canon. The word "Bible" means nothing more than "book". A collection of writings.

You are calling God a liar!!!!

Psalm 12:7,
- you shall keep them O Lord thou shalt preserve them from this generation  forever

Yeah. KJVOism rots the brain. I know. I was once a KJVOist myself.

Did the apostles use your KJV? Poor apostles......

Your king died in the 1600s.... You know "James". Irony alert......

My King is Jesus. I don't care what King James decided to include or not include/translate. He isn't my king. We cast off the oppression of the "crown" of England a long time ago and rejected the Anglican church of England. I see that you're still there in spirit.

God keeps His promises, Hebrews 6:13-15.

You know a man cannot have the truth when he denies the truth,
John 17:17,
- sanctify them by your truth, your word is truth

I actually try to listen to Jesus. He still speaks. You can keep going to "King James" if you want. That is often a poor choice to make.

I will say that the King James does largely get Acts 9 right. Christ was "driving" Paul to confession through the death of Stephen. "Kick against the pricks" should be included in all bibles.

 

[Titus]

When a person does not believe entire books of the Bible that makes them a Bible denier.
There is no other description for them that is as accurate.

Name calling means nothing to me. You're lying

No lie Sir, you told me you don't believe the book of James is from God.

You are a waste of time until you believe the Scriptures.
It's no different than teaching the Bible to an atheist.
The don't believe it so its futile to expect them to except it as the truth.
You're in the same boat as you can be given book, chapter and verse and it means nothing to you.

No point in debating Bible with someone who rejects it as infallible.

 

[dwight92070]

He has said that those who believe the Gospel and are baptized will be saved (Mark 16:16).
Dwight - I believe that. But He does NOT say that those who believe and are NOT baptized will be lost, which is what YOU say.

He has said that baptism saves us (1 Pet 3:21)
Dwight - That's a false interpretation.

He has said that it is in baptism that we die to sin and are united to Christ's death and resurrection (Rom 6:1-7).
Dwight - A false interpretation.

He has said that it is in baptism that our sin is cut from us by the Holy Spirit and we are united to Christ's death and resurrection (Col 2:11-14)
Dwight - These verses DO NOT say that.

He has said that it is in baptism that only those reborn through water and the Spirit will enter the Kingdom of God (John 3:5).
Dwight - John 3:5 has nothing to do with baptism.

He has said that it is in baptism that we are sanctified and made pure, spotless, and without blemish by the washing of water by the Word (Eph 5:26-27).
Dwight - You reject the blood of Christ, which is the only thing that cleanses us from our sins, not water baptism.

He has said that it is in baptism that we are made sons and daughters and are clothed with Christ through baptism (Gal 3:26-27).
Dwight - NO, not true, we must be sons of God BEFORE we get baptized. Salvation DOES NOT occur at baptism, it always must occur BEFORE baptism. There is no place in scripture where salvation occurred after baptism, or during baptism.

 

[Titus]

Name calling means nothing to me. You're lying. I accept the vast majority of the Protestant Canon. The word "Bible" means nothing more than "book". A collection of writings.



Yeah. KJVOism rots the brain. I know. I was once a KJVOist myself.

Did the apostles use your KJV? Poor apostles......

Your king died in the 1600s.... You know "James". Irony alert......

My King is Jesus. I don't care what King James decided to include or not include/translate. He isn't my king. We cast off the oppression of the "crown" of England a long time ago and rejected the Anglican church of England. I see that you're still there in spirit.



I actually try to listen to Jesus. He still speaks. You can keep going to "King James" if you want. That is often a poor choice to make.

I will say that the King James does largely get Acts 9 right. Christ was "driving" Paul to confession through the death of Stephen. "Kick against the pricks" should be included in all bibles.

Also, the Catholics claim they chose the books of the Bible.
That is a lie from the catholic church that you bought into.

All the church fathers letters have the entire Bible quoted from the new testament.
As early as the first and second century we have Christian's written letters that include quotes from the book of James.

James is Jesus' brother who Paul himself rights about as a pillar in the church.
So not only do you deny James as Inspired you also deny the writing's of Paul as Inspired.

 

[Grace ambassador]

op: Paul was saved in Acts 22:16?:
Hardly:

All Ananias knew was the gospel of the kingdom, with:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved..." (Mark 16:16 AV):​

prophecy / Covenants / law

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ!” (online):

Mystery / Grace:

When God Opened the Current ( Parenthetical Dispensation of Grace ), With His New
And Different Gospel Of Grace, Paul Was Immediately Saved on the road to Damascus,
not later, By God's Grace And Mercy ( Excluding All 'works' - yes, even water baptism ):

Full study:

Three Things Happened On The Road...​

Amen.

 

[dwight92070]

Dispensationalists can't even tell you what rightly divided word of truth means.

 

[Titus]

Dispensationalists can't even tell you what rightly divided word of truth means.

Amen

 

[Titus]

op: Paul was saved in Acts 22:16?:
Hardly:

All Ananias knew was the gospel of the kingdom, with:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved..." (Mark 16:16 AV):​

prophecy / Covenants / law

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ!” (online):

Mystery / Grace:

When God Opened the Current ( Parenthetical Dispensation of Grace ), With His New
And Different Gospel Of Grace, Paul Was Immediately Saved on the road to Damascus,
not later, By God's Grace And Mercy ( Excluding All 'works' - yes, even water baptism ):

Full study:

Three Things Happened On The Road...​

Amen.

Jesus told Ananias to go to Paul and it was told to Ananias what to say to Paul.

So when anybody like Grace ambassador says Ananias ONLY KNEW Mark 16:16.

You remember it was Jesus directly guiding Ananias to preach water baptism, Mark 16:16 to Paul.

Grace Ambassador proves he doesn't believe Jesus knew what to preach to Paul through Ananias.

Grace Ambassador says Paul's sins were washed away on the road to Damascus.

Paul,himself in Acts 22:16 said his sins were washed away when Ananias came to him as instructed by Jesus and told him, and now why are you waiting, arise and be baptized and wash away your sins calling on the name of the Lord.

I'll believe What Paul said saved him over what Grace Ambassador said when he was saved.