Your views on human beings having a sin nature

[TomL]

This teaches that they were given an easy choice; it does not prove that they were able to choose to do right since they might have been given the choice to prove they cannot choose GOD, even when it is sooo easy, so their judgement, their condemnation to damnation already, Jn 3:18, is righteous...

Deuteronomy 30:11–20 (NASB 2020) — 11 “For this commandment which I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it far away. 12 It is not in heaven, that you could say, ‘Who will go up to heaven for us and get it for us, and proclaim it to us, so that we may follow it?’ 13 Nor is it beyond the sea, that you could say, ‘Who will cross the sea for us and get it for us and proclaim it to us, so that we may follow it?’ 14 On the contrary, the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may follow it. 15 “See, I have placed before you today life and happiness, and death and adversity, 16 in that I am commanding you today to love the LORD your God, to walk in His ways and to keep His commandments, His statutes, and His judgments, so that you may live and become numerous, and that the LORD your God may bless you in the land where you are entering to take possession of it. 17 But if your heart turns away and you will not obey, but allow yourself to be led astray and you worship other gods and serve them, 18 I declare to you today that you will certainly perish. You will not prolong your days in the land where you are crossing the Jordan to enter and take possession of it. 19 I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have placed before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants, 20 by loving the LORD your God, by obeying His voice, and by holding close to Him; for this is your life and the length of your days, so that you may live in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them.”

god's word states they could

and concerning the ability to believe

John 12:40 (KJV 1900) — 40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

God blinded men to prevent their belief. Why would God blind someone who had no ability to see?

Why prevent from believing those who had no capacity for belief

Luke notes had men not grown hardened they could have believed

Acts 28:27 (KJV 1900) — 27 For the heart of this people is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed; lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.


unregenerate men are shown to receive the word with joy and believe

Luke 8:13 (KJV 1900) — 13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

This teaches that they were given an easy choice; it does not prove that they were able to choose to do right since they might have been given the choice to prove they cannot choose GOD, even when it is sooo easy, so their judgement, their condemnation to damnation already, Jn 3:18, is righteous...

I believe that is the correct interpretation. Here's more support for that:

Deut 24:2 And Moses calleth unto all Israel, and saith unto them, `Ye -- ye have seen all that which Jehovah hath done before your eyes in the land of Egypt, to Pharaoh, and to all his servants, and to all his land; 3 the great trials which thine eyes have seen, the signs, and those great wonders; 4 and Jehovah hath not given to you a heart to know, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, till this day,

They saw the awesome signs and wonderous miracles of the Lord; the plagues, the passover, the parting of the Red Sea, etc. How easy would it be to believe after experiencing all that? Still they had no faith in God. Many people say there is no God, yet can you imagine if those signs and wonders happened today? This passage says they saw them and still didn't have faith. They didn't believe because God had not yet given them a heart to know, eyes to see, and ears to hear.

 

[TomL]

I believe that is the correct interpretation. Here's more support for that:

Deut 24:2 And Moses calleth unto all Israel, and saith unto them, `Ye -- ye have seen all that which Jehovah hath done before your eyes in the land of Egypt, to Pharaoh, and to all his servants, and to all his land; 3 the great trials which thine eyes have seen, the signs, and those great wonders; 4 and Jehovah hath not given to you a heart to know, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, till this day,

They saw the awesome signs and wonderous miracles of the Lord; the plagues, the passover, the parting of the Red Sea, etc. How easy would it be to believe after experiencing all that? Still they had no faith in God. Many people say there is no God, yet can you imagine if those signs and wonders happened today? This passage says they saw them and still didn't have faith. They didn't believe because God had not yet given them a heart to know, eyes to see, and ears to hear.

You mean Deut 29:2

and your interpretation does not make much sense as next chapter when he tells them

Deuteronomy 30:11–14 (KJV 1900) — 11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. 12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

They had seen all that the LORD did in Egypt, unto Pharaoh, and his army. They saw signs and great miracles. It should have been enough that it fell short was due to their own stubbornness and hardness of heart

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

You mean Deut 29:2

and your interpretation does not make much sense as next chapter when he tells them

Deuteronomy 30:11–14 (KJV 1900) — 11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. 12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

They had seen all that the LORD did in Egypt, unto Pharaoh, and his army. They saw signs and great miracles. It should have been enough that it fell short was due to their own stubbornness and hardness of heart

Like I said before, you can prove your interpretation is correct if you can name one person (other than Jesus) who followed the law as prescribed in Deuteronomy. If it's that easy, surely one person out of billions has done it.

 

[TomL]

Like I said before, you can prove your interpretation is correct if you can name one person (other than Jesus) who followed the law as prescribed in Deuteronomy. If it's that easy, surely one person out of billions has done it.

You mean Deut 29:2

and your interpretation does not make much sense as next chapter when he tells them

Deuteronomy 30:11–14 (KJV 1900) — 11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. 12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

They had seen all that the LORD did in Egypt, unto Pharaoh, and his army. They saw signs and great miracles. It should have been enough that it fell short was due to their own stubbornness and hardness of heart

PS it is not about perfect obedience to law

 

[TedT]

Like I said before, you can prove your interpretation is correct if you can name one person (other than Jesus) who followed the law as prescribed in Deuteronomy. If it's that easy, surely one person out of billions has done it.

It IS easy !! unless you are a sinner and need grace. Only sinners are born into the world and outside of grace it is impossible.

 

[TomL]

It IS easy !! unless you are a sinner and need grace. Only sinners are born into the world and outside of grace it is impossible.

Those with faith are accounted as righteous

 

[TedT]

Those with faith are accounted as righteous

Yes...

Matt 13:24 Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. How are they good when they are obviously sinners? Good cannot be a reference then to their righteousness so that leaves us with good referring to their status as elect, as His sheep gone astray, who are redeemable... Sinners of faith being called righteous implies that righteous does not always denote a moral reality but is rather a word denoting their status as one of HIS legitimate children, one of the sinful people of His kingdom, a believer who is never condemned for his sins due to his faith, John 3:18.

 

[TomL]

Yes...

Matt 13:24 Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. How are they good when they are obviously sinners? Good cannot be a reference then to their righteousness so that leaves us with good referring to their status as elect, as His sheep gone astray, who are redeemable... Sinners of faith being called righteous implies that righteous does not always denote a moral reality but is rather a word denoting their status as one of HIS legitimate children, one of the sinful people of His kingdom, a believer who is never condemned for his sins due to his faith, John 3:18.

Rather their status as believers

Romans 4:1–16 (KJV 1900) — 1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? 2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. 3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. 6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, 7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. 8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. 9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also: 12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised. 13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect: 15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression. 16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,