Who was the Book of John Addressed to?

[dwight92070]

John 20:8 "So the other disciple who had first come to the tomb (John) then also entered, and he saw and believed."

Wait, I thought John was already a believer. He was, but now he believed that Jesus rose from the dead!

Verse 9 "For as yet they did not understand the Scripture, the He must rise again from the dead.

So who did Jesus first appear to, after His resurrection? A nonbeliever? No, to Mary, who was already a believer. See John 20:15-16

And He tells Mary to go find all her unsaved family and friends and tell them that Jesus is alive? NO, he tells her to report this good news to "My brethren", His disciples.

So who does Jesus appear to next? All the nonbelievers in Jerusalem? No, He goes directly to the room where the disciples had locked themselves in, probably for fear that they could also be crucified. He presents Himself alive just to them.

But Thomas didn't happen to be there at that time. In fact, he didn't even believe the other disciples had actually seen Jesus alive. So, eight days later, Jesus appears again to His disciples. This time Thomas is there. Jesus gently rebukes Him, "Do not be unbelieving, but believing."

Thomas responds: "My Lord and my God!" Jesus tells him (while the other disciples were listening), "Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed." (That would be US!)

Then the next verse (verse 30) begins with "Therefore," . In other words, what I'm about to say has been written because of the information that I have given you earlier in this chapter and in this book. "Therefore, many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; BUT THESE ARE WRITTEN THAT YOU MAY BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS THE CHRIST, THE SON OF GOD; AND THAT BELIEVING YOU MAY HAVE LIFE IN HIS NAME."

Who is John addressing this to? PRIMARILY BELIEVERS! FOLLOWERS AND DISCIPLES OF JESUS THROUGHOUT THE CENTURIES! (Although John probably did not know that millions would be reading his book over the centuries) Sure, it's great that nonbelievers read his book, but his primary concern is to strengthen the faith of other Christians, that they may have full assurance that what they have already believed, is in fact, true!

Just as Jesus was NOT appearing to non-Christians, but purposely appeared to those who already believed in Him, so the book of John was purposely written to strengthen the faith of all believers everywhere.

In fact, is there ANY book in the entire Bible specifically addressed to nonbelievers? I don't think so.

This may be why many non-Christians say that they have read the gospels, for example, and yet they appear to be unaffected by it. Why? Maybe because it was not written for them or to them. And yet, it is the gospel that has the power to save, isn't it? So the Father has to draw them to Himself and to Jesus, and if they don't resist that drawing, the gospel message can powerfully save them.

 

[mikesw]

You ask a reasonable question about the writer's intended audience. Each of the gospels has an apparent target group and caters its topics and format for its intended group. The synoptic gospels show more of the evidence of Jesus' history, from lineage to death on the cross. Those gospels showed more of how he was seen publicly in unique fashion from all other people.
The fourth gospel is more of the insider detail about Jesus. The disciples got more intimate knowledge of Christ Jesus. However, your examples seem to speak of the belief of his resurrection. They were told of that resurrection but did not understand what Jesus meant. It is reasonable to find that gospel as supporting the faith of Christians. God works through multiple avenues to strengthen Christian faith -- the OT prophecies, the amazing details of Christ's life, the great display of love through the cross, the NT writings, and the body of Christ. (Many other ways could be listed.) I however do not see it written only to Christians. The caveat is that the gospels would predominantly be shared among Christian groups. So each gospel would initially be known by Christians but then could be used as material in support of evangelism.

 

[civic]

John 20:8 "So the other disciple who had first come to the tomb (John) then also entered, and he saw and believed."

Wait, I thought John was already a believer. He was, but now he believed that Jesus rose from the dead!

Verse 9 "For as yet they did not understand the Scripture, the He must rise again from the dead.

So who did Jesus first appear to, after His resurrection? A nonbeliever? No, to Mary, who was already a believer. See John 20:15-16

And He tells Mary to go find all her unsaved family and friends and tell them that Jesus is alive? NO, he tells her to report this good news to "My brethren", His disciples.

So who does Jesus appear to next? All the nonbelievers in Jerusalem? No, He goes directly to the room where the disciples had locked themselves in, probably for fear that they could also be crucified. He presents Himself alive just to them.

But Thomas didn't happen to be there at that time. In fact, he didn't even believe the other disciples had actually seen Jesus alive. So, eight days later, Jesus appears again to His disciples. This time Thomas is there. Jesus gently rebukes Him, "Do not be unbelieving, but believing."

Thomas responds: "My Lord and my God!" Jesus tells him (while the other disciples were listening), "Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed." (That would be US!)

Then the next verse (verse 30) begins with "Therefore," . In other words, what I'm about to say has been written because of the information that I have given you earlier in this chapter and in this book. "Therefore, many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; BUT THESE ARE WRITTEN THAT YOU MAY BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS THE CHRIST, THE SON OF GOD; AND THAT BELIEVING YOU MAY HAVE LIFE IN HIS NAME."

Who is John addressing this to? PRIMARILY BELIEVERS! FOLLOWERS AND DISCIPLES OF JESUS THROUGHOUT THE CENTURIES! (Although John probably did not know that millions would be reading his book over the centuries) Sure, it's great that nonbelievers read his book, but his primary concern is to strengthen the faith of other Christians, that they may have full assurance that what they have already believed, is in fact, true!

Just as Jesus was NOT appearing to non-Christians, but purposely appeared to those who already believed in Him, so the book of John was purposely written to strengthen the faith of all believers everywhere.

In fact, is there ANY book in the entire Bible specifically addressed to nonbelievers? I don't think so.

This may be why many non-Christians say that they have read the gospels, for example, and yet they appear to be unaffected by it. Why? Maybe because it was not written for them or to them. And yet, it is the gospel that has the power to save, isn't it? So the Father has to draw them to Himself and to Jesus, and if they don't resist that drawing, the gospel message can powerfully save them.

I think its both believers to strengthen their faith and that those who do not believe might come to faith in Christ and have life as we read in Johns purpose statement below.

John 20:31
But these have been written, that ye might believe that Jesus is Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life in his name.

 

[civic]

I like how Barnes puts it below

Barnes' Notes on the Bible
These are written - Those recorded in this gospel.
That ye might believe ... - This is a clue to the design which John had in view in writing this gospel. The whole scope or end of the book is to accomplish two objects:

1. To prove that Jesus was the Messiah; and,

2. That they who looked at the proof might be convinced and have eternal life.

This design is kept in view throughout the book. The miracles, facts, arguments, instructions, and conversations of our Lord all tend to this. This point had not been kept in view so directly by either of the other evangelists, and it was reserved for the last of the apostles to collect those arguments, and make out a connected demonstration that Jesus was the Messiah. If this design of John is kept steadily in view, it will throw much light on the book, and the argument is unanswerable, framed after the strictest rules of reasoning, infinitely beyond the skill of man, and having throughout the clearest evidence of demonstration.

 

[civic]

This is also a good point below:

The Purpose of John’s Gospel​

Someone who is studying resurrection truth will probably use 1 Corinthians 15 at some point. Someone who is studying love will probably turn to 1 Corinthians 13. Someone studying prophecy will more than likely look to the books of Revelation, Ezekiel, or Daniel. The reason is simple: those books and passages deal with those particular topics. And when it comes to the question, “What must a person do to be born again?” we should look to the Gospel of John. Is this because the answer to this question can’t be found elsewhere? No. There are other books of the Bible that contain the message of life (e.g. Acts 16:31; Rom 3:28; Gal 2:16; Eph 2:8-9; 1 Tim 1:16; 1 John 5:1; etc.). However, while other books of the Bible answer this question, there is only one book that was written specifically to answer this question. To put it another way, in the entire canon of Scripture there is only book whose aim and purpose is evangelistic: the Gospel of John. We know this because, in 20:30-31, John clearly stated his purpose for writing:

And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

No other book of the Bible says what John says here, because no other book of the Bible was written for this specific purpose. Therefore, if a person wants to know how to have eternal life, he or she need read no further than the Gospel of John. If further revelation is needed beyond John’s Gospel, then we must concede that John failed to achieve his purpose. doug potgeter

hope this helps !!!

​

 

[dwight92070]

It's clearly John's purpose to get people to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing we may have life in His name. But even that sentence reveals two scenarios: 1. To believe now and 2. To continue "believing". So his book is much more than just a tool for evangelism. In fact, I see a real problem with that belief. One could easily say, "Well, since I'm already saved, I will concentrate on other books and use that one for nonbelievers, when the need arises."

In fact, no other book so powerfully and so directly lifts up Jesus to His rightful position as God in the flesh. Okay, maybe Hebrews as well. Just a few verses earlier in John 20:28, Thomas said, "My Lord and my God!"
There's NO WAY that Jesus would let that slide if Thomas was speaking heresy! Instead, Jesus acknowledged his statement as being the truth by saying: "Because you have seen Me, HAVE YOU BELIEVED?"
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." ... "And the Word became flesh ..."
Everywhere you look in John, Jesus is elevated and glorified and magnified as being God's equal!

I don't know about you, but that put's a FIRE in my bones and supercharges my faith to see His glory revealed!!!

John not only had his focus on believing in Jesus but on WHO IN PARTICULAR should believe in Him - His disciples - and WHAT IN PARTICULAR they should believe about Him - that HE IS THE MESSIAH, THE SON OF GOD. and in that believing WE MAY HAVE LIFE IN HIS NAME.

 

[mikesw]

I like how Barnes puts it below

Barnes' Notes on the Bible
These are written - Those recorded in this gospel.
That ye might believe ... - This is a clue to the design which John had in view in writing this gospel. The whole scope or end of the book is to accomplish two objects:

1. To prove that Jesus was the Messiah; and,

2. That they who looked at the proof might be convinced and have eternal life.

This design is kept in view throughout the book. The miracles, facts, arguments, instructions, and conversations of our Lord all tend to this. This point had not been kept in view so directly by either of the other evangelists, and it was reserved for the last of the apostles to collect those arguments, and make out a connected demonstration that Jesus was the Messiah. If this design of John is kept steadily in view, it will throw much light on the book, and the argument is unanswerable, framed after the strictest rules of reasoning, infinitely beyond the skill of man, and having throughout the clearest evidence of demonstration.

I couldn't find whey he hear from Barnes but not Nobel . Underlying my earlier post is that the synoptic gospels point predominant to public details of the incarnate Jesus. These would tend to be evangelistic focused -- of eyewitness testimony. The fourth gospel provides the deeper understanding of Christ that Christians need to know. For example John 1 goes into the way the disciples personally beheld him -- or saw in him -- his divine nature as a human among them.
{Oops. I forgot to press the Post Reply button awhile ago.}

 

[Pancho Frijoles]

It's clearly John's purpose to get people to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing we may have life in His name. But even that sentence reveals two scenarios: 1. To believe now and 2. To continue "believing". So his book is much more than just a tool for evangelism. In fact, I see a real problem with that belief. One could easily say, "Well, since I'm already saved, I will concentrate on other books and use that one for nonbelievers, when the need arises."

In fact, no other book so powerfully and so directly lifts up Jesus to His rightful position as God in the flesh.

In fact, in no other book Jesus speaks so powerfully and so directly about his status as a Messenger of God, and points out to the Father as His God and the Only and True God.
I can quote the verses if necessary. The Gospel of John is FULL of them... and I am not talking about a poem written to refer to a third person, but to the words of Jesus Himself.

 

[101G]

ADDRESSING the OP.
1 John 5:13 "These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God."

who are the YOU that John is writing to? 1 John 5:1 "Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him." 1 John 5:2 "By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments."

John 13:19 "Now I tell you before it come, that, when it is come to pass, ye may believe that I am he." John 13:20 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me."

that's very straight forward.

101G.

 

[mikesw]

It's clearly John's purpose to get people to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing we may have life in His name. But even that sentence reveals two scenarios: 1. To believe now and 2. To continue "believing". So his book is much more than just a tool for evangelism. In fact, I see a real problem with that belief. One could easily say, "Well, since I'm already saved, I will concentrate on other books and use that one for nonbelievers, when the need arises."

In fact, no other book so powerfully and so directly lifts up Jesus to His rightful position as God in the flesh. Okay, maybe Hebrews as well. Just a few verses earlier in John 20:28, Thomas said, "My Lord and my God!"
There's NO WAY that Jesus would let that slide if Thomas was speaking heresy! Instead, Jesus acknowledged his statement as being the truth by saying: "Because you have seen Me, HAVE YOU BELIEVED?"
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." ... "And the Word became flesh ..."
Everywhere you look in John, Jesus is elevated and glorified and magnified as being God's equal!

I don't know about you, but that put's a FIRE in my bones and supercharges my faith to see His glory revealed!!!

John not only had his focus on believing in Jesus but on WHO IN PARTICULAR should believe in Him - His disciples - and WHAT IN PARTICULAR they should believe about Him - that HE IS THE MESSIAH, THE SON OF GOD. and in that believing WE MAY HAVE LIFE IN HIS NAME.

I would think the fourth gospel was written primarily for the future Christian church. The deeper details, the spiritual aspects (beyond the synoptic gospels), needed to be recorded, especially due to the turbulence and persecution that the Church would be facing. Even then, much information would be lost within a century of Christ's resurrection.
I also say it was for the Church primarily since it is the Church (the Christian people) who needed most to be informed and prepared as the branch to which other people could join to Christ. We could add that the scriptures were not originally circulated much beyond the churches.

 

[dwight92070]

In fact, in no other book Jesus speaks so powerfully and so directly about his status as a Messenger of God, and points out to the Father as His God and the Only and True God.
I can quote the verses if necessary. The Gospel of John is FULL of them... and I am not talking about a poem written to refer to a third person, but to the words of Jesus Himself.

I quoted 26 verses/passages to you, A through Z, that show that Jesus is God, and there are tons more. Not one of your quoted verses proves that Jesus is not God. In fact, we were going to go through the entire New Testament together, but you backed out, probably because you were taken off guard as to how many verses actually show that Jesus is God.

 

[Doug Brents]

John 20:8 "So the other disciple who had first come to the tomb (John) then also entered, and he saw and believed."

Wait, I thought John was already a believer. He was, but now he believed that Jesus rose from the dead!

Verse 9 "For as yet they did not understand the Scripture, the He must rise again from the dead.

So who did Jesus first appear to, after His resurrection? A nonbeliever? No, to Mary, who was already a believer. See John 20:15-16

And He tells Mary to go find all her unsaved family and friends and tell them that Jesus is alive? NO, he tells her to report this good news to "My brethren", His disciples.

So who does Jesus appear to next? All the nonbelievers in Jerusalem? No, He goes directly to the room where the disciples had locked themselves in, probably for fear that they could also be crucified. He presents Himself alive just to them.

But Thomas didn't happen to be there at that time. In fact, he didn't even believe the other disciples had actually seen Jesus alive. So, eight days later, Jesus appears again to His disciples. This time Thomas is there. Jesus gently rebukes Him, "Do not be unbelieving, but believing."

Thomas responds: "My Lord and my God!" Jesus tells him (while the other disciples were listening), "Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed." (That would be US!)

Then the next verse (verse 30) begins with "Therefore," . In other words, what I'm about to say has been written because of the information that I have given you earlier in this chapter and in this book. "Therefore, many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book; BUT THESE ARE WRITTEN THAT YOU MAY BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS THE CHRIST, THE SON OF GOD; AND THAT BELIEVING YOU MAY HAVE LIFE IN HIS NAME."

Who is John addressing this to? PRIMARILY BELIEVERS! FOLLOWERS AND DISCIPLES OF JESUS THROUGHOUT THE CENTURIES! (Although John probably did not know that millions would be reading his book over the centuries) Sure, it's great that nonbelievers read his book, but his primary concern is to strengthen the faith of other Christians, that they may have full assurance that what they have already believed, is in fact, true!

Just as Jesus was NOT appearing to non-Christians, but purposely appeared to those who already believed in Him, so the book of John was purposely written to strengthen the faith of all believers everywhere.

In fact, is there ANY book in the entire Bible specifically addressed to nonbelievers? I don't think so.

This may be why many non-Christians say that they have read the gospels, for example, and yet they appear to be unaffected by it. Why? Maybe because it was not written for them or to them. And yet, it is the gospel that has the power to save, isn't it? So the Father has to draw them to Himself and to Jesus, and if they don't resist that drawing, the gospel message can powerfully save them.

You make a good point here, and I could pick at it some but I won't.
What I will say is that the Scriptures were written to those who believe (as you say) to give them the tools to reach those who are still lost (with the Holy Spirit's support, guidance, and direct working in the heart of the listener). As Rom 10:14-15 says, "And how are they to hear without a preacher? 15 But how are they to preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written: 'How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news of good things!'"

 

[dwight92070]

You make a good point here, and I could pick at it some but I won't.
What I will say is that the Scriptures were written to those who believe (as you say) to give them the tools to reach those who are still lost (with the Holy Spirit's support, guidance, and direct working in the heart of the listener). As Rom 10:14-15 says, "And how are they to hear without a preacher? 15 But how are they to preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written: 'How beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news of good things!'"

And for teaching, reproof, correction, and training in righteousness - for believers. 2 Timothy 3:16

 

[Red Baker]

No other book of the Bible says what John says here, because no other book of the Bible was written for this specific purpose. Therefore, if a person wants to know how to have eternal life, he or she need read no further than the Gospel of John. If further revelation is needed beyond John’s Gospel, then we must concede that John failed to achieve his purpose. doug potgeter

While I whole heartily agree as to why John's gospel was written, Mr. Potgeter made a serious error. It is in the red highlight above.

John 20:31​

“But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.”

God's testimony concerning his Son that he has recorded for us in the holy scriptures are given that we might believe (only those men who have been given the power/authority/gift to believe can believe ~ John 1:12; 10:26; Philippians 1:28,29; etc.) and that believing ye might have life (that is, have "the KNOWELEDGE that WE have life," by the very fact we believe, the greatest evidence one can have for them to know that they have eternal life, if they truly believe the record that God has given concerning his Son, Jesus Christ, sent to be a surety for God's elect) through his name, by what he has done for us, that we could not do for ourselves!

Faith indeed comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. But, the power to do so, is in the new man, not the old Adamic nature that is at enmity against the God of heaven ~ regeneration must first occur, before the power to believe can be excise by the sinner who has been quickened from being dead in trespasses and sins ~ "once" this occurs, then the power is there for the quickened sinner to hear, see, and understand. We learn these blessed truths by these things that are written!

 

[Johann]

regeneration must first occur, before the power to believe can be excise by the sinner who has been quickened from being dead in trespasses and sins ~ "once" this occurs, then the power is there for the quickened sinner to hear, see, and understand. We learn these blessed truths by these things that are written!

Scripture Consistently Places Faith Before Regeneration
The claim states that a person must be "quickened" (made spiritually alive) before they can believe, yet numerous passages of Scripture indicate that faith is the condition for receiving new life.

John 1:12-13 – "But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

Here, believing ("received Him") precedes becoming a child of God. The passage explicitly states that faith is the criterion for being granted the status of divine sonship.

John 3:16 – "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

For so (houtōs gar). This use of gar is quite in John’s style in introducing his comments (Jhn_2:25; Jhn_4:8; Jhn_5:13, etc.). This “Little Gospel” as it is often called, this “comfortable word” (the Anglican Liturgy), while not a quotation from Jesus is a just and marvellous interpretation of the mission and message of our Lord. In Jhn_3:16-21John recapitulates in summary fashion the teaching of Jesus to Nicodemus.
Loved (ēgapēsen). First aorist active indicative of agapaō, the noble word so common in the Gospels for the highest form of love, used here as often in John (Jhn_14:23; Jhn_17:23; 1Jn_3:1; 1Jn_4:10) of God’s love for man (cf. 2Th_2:16; Rom_5:8; Eph_2:4). In Jhn_21:15 John presents a distinction between agapaō and phileō. Agapaō is used also for love of men for men (Jhn_13:34), for Jesus (Jhn_8:42), for God (1Jn_4:10).
The world (ton kosmon). The whole cosmos of men, including Gentiles, the whole human race. This universal aspect of God’s love appears also in 2Co_5:19; Rom_5:8.
That he gave (hōste edōken). The usual classical construction with hōste and the indicative (first aorist active) practical result, the only example in the N.T. save that in Gal_2:13. Elsewhere hōste with the infinitive occurs for actual result (Mat_13:32) as well as purpose (Mat_10:1), though even this is rare.
His only begotten Son (ton huion ton monogenē). “The Son the only begotten.” For this word see note on Jhn_1:14, note on Jhn_1:18; and Jhn_3:18. The rest of the sentence, the purpose clause with hina-echēi precisely reproduces the close of Jhn_3:15 save that eis auton takes the place of en autōi (see Jhn_1:12) and goes certainly with pisteuōn (not with echēi as en autōi in Jhn_3:15) and the added clause “should not perish but” (mē apolētai alla, second aorist middle subjunctive, intransitive, of apollumi, to destroy). The same contrast between “perish” and “eternal life” (for this world and the next) appears also in Jhn_10:28. On “perish” see also Jhn_17:12.
RWP.


Eternal life is granted to those who believe. If regeneration had to occur first, the structure of this statement would be reversed.
John 20:31 – "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through His name."

The clear sequence here is (1) belief and then (2) receiving life. If the Calvinistic framework were correct, this verse would need to state that people are first made alive and then believe.
Ephesians 1:13 – "In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise."

The reception of the Holy Spirit comes after belief, not before. This contradicts the notion that regeneration must precede faith.
Acts 16:31 – "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved."

If regeneration were required before faith, this would be misleading; rather, faith is the condition for salvation.

2. Regeneration and Being Made Alive Are the Results of Faith
Calvinists often cite Ephesians 2:1 ("And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins") to argue that spiritually dead individuals cannot believe unless first regenerated. However, being "dead" in sin does not mean being incapable of belief.

Colossians 2:12-13 – "Buried with Him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with Him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised Him from the dead. And you, being dead in your sins... hath He quickened together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses."

Quickening occurs through faith. Faith is the means by which one is raised with Christ, showing that faith precedes regeneration.
Galatians 3:26 – "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus."

Sonship (which entails new spiritual life) comes through faith, not before it.

If one must be regenerated before faith, this means:

An unbeliever is already spiritually alive before trusting Christ.

Salvation is given apart from faith, contradicting Ephesians 2:8 ("For by grace are ye saved through faith").

Faith would become an automatic response of the regenerated person, reducing personal responsibility in believing the gospel.
The biblical model, however, presents faith as the means by which a person is made spiritually alive.

Regeneration is not the cause of faith but rather its effect.

J.

 

[Red Baker]

Scripture Consistently Places Faith Before Regeneration

Greetings Johann,

Let us test your teachings with the word of God ~ pretty sure you will be found guilty of not rightly dividing the word of truth.

1st John 4:1​

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.”

The claim states that a person must be "quickened" (made spiritually alive) before they can believe, yet numerous passages of Scripture indicate that faith is the condition for receiving new life.

No condition on man's part, Adam already proved that's impossible, with flesh nature free of indwelling sin! The only faith and obedience that is a perquisite for one's justification is Jesus Christ's faith and obedience which he secured for God's elect acting as their surety before the law of God, and he provided it perfectly for those given to him by his Father to redeem. John 17:2-9;

Hebrews 7:22​

“By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.”

John 1:12-13 – "But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

Here, believing ("received Him") precedes becoming a child of God. The passage explicitly states that faith is the criterion for being granted the status of divine sonship.

You Johann, are not reading the verse correctly. The verse starts out by revealing to us "why" those received Christ , when most did not. As many as received him ....to them gave he the power to become the sons of God! Are you truly hearing the voice of John speaking to you through the Spirit, I think not. The power is given, then one believes, and receives what he is hearing, if the power is given. To prove what I'm saying is true, the Spirit gives to us His own commentary for verse 12, in John 1:13, which clearly said:

John 1:13​

“Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”

The new birth is not of blood, meaning it does not run from family to family, even though often it does, but that is not the means thereof. Nor is it of the flesh, or, by our own will and power, works that flow from us, for the flesh is at enmity against God, not just an enemy, which is bad enough, but is at constant war against God, truth, godliness, etc. Nor of the will of man ~ meaning that no one who also is flesh and blood bringing a message of gospel has any power/means within himself to get folks born again, impossible, the best he/she can do is bring to light where there is life that God has already spiritually resurrected from being dead in trespasses and sin to life in Jesus Christ. But of God ~ meaning the Spirit of God is the only one actively working in causing one to be born again. Maybe more on this later.

John 3:16 – "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

Again, you are not hearing what Jesus is teaching Nicodemus. First, he would not go against what he has already said here:

John 3:3​

“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

Meaning the new birth "MUST" proceed being able to see spiritually! A truth you are rejecting.

How do and should we understand the true sense of John 3:16? It is very simple ~ John 3:16 is "a declaration of a biblical truth," that whosoever believeth in Jesus Christ shall not perish, but they shall have everlasting life......in possess of it now, and shall continue for ever ~ using other scriptures of course, to make this statement. Such as John 11:25,26, etc.

Keep this from being too long of a post, I'm coming back to finish answering your post, I much prefer shorter post so one can think and ponder them better, without over taxing their flesh and wearing them down from even considering its context.

 

[Jim]

Red, your interpretation of John 1:12 is grossly in error. You rewrite it in your mind to make it compatible with your own reformed thinking. There can be no misunderstanding that the ones He (Jesus) gave the right to become children of God, were "all who received him and believed in his name". Verse 13 then describes how those who received him and believed in his name became children of God.

 

[Johann]

Let us test your teachings with the word of God ~ pretty sure you will be found guilty of not rightly dividing the word of truth.

I am pretty sure YOU are not rightly cutting straight the word of God and in your "system" there is no hope for the non-elect. @Red Baker


Calvinism, with its emphasis on predestination and limited atonement, often sparks theological debates. While many believers find comfort in its teachings, others argue that the Bible supports a more inclusive and grace-filled perspective on God’s plan of salvation. Below are key topics that present scriptural evidence against Calvinism, offering insights into God’s universal love and the free will granted to humanity.

Also Read: Bible Verses About False Doctrine

God’s Desire for All to Be Saved

Calvinism asserts that salvation is limited to the elect, but the Bible consistently reveals God’s heart for all people to be saved. The Scriptures affirm God’s universal offer of grace and the invitation to everyone to respond in faith.

1 Timothy 2:4
“He wants everyone to be saved and to understand the truth.”

2 Peter 3:9
“The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent.”

Ezekiel 18:23
“Do you think that I like to see wicked people die? says the Sovereign Lord. Of course not! I want them to turn from their wicked ways and live.”



John 3:16
“For this is how God loved the world: He gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life.”

Titus 2:11
“For the grace of God has been revealed, bringing salvation to all people.”

The Free Will of Humanity
Calvinism often downplays the role of human free will, emphasizing divine sovereignty instead. However, Scripture frequently highlights the importance of personal choice and the responsibility to respond to God’s calling.

Deuteronomy 30:19
“Today I have given you the choice between life and death, between blessings and curses. Now I call on heaven and earth to witness the choice you make. Oh, that you would choose life, so that you and your descendants might live!”

Joshua 24:15
“But if you refuse to serve the Lord, then choose today whom you will serve. Would you prefer the gods your ancestors served beyond the Euphrates, or will it be the gods of the Amorites in whose land you now live? But as for me and my family, we will serve the Lord.”

Matthew 23:37
“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones God’s messengers! How often I have wanted to gather your children together as a hen protects her chicks beneath her wings, but you wouldn’t let me.”

Revelation 22:17
“The Spirit and the bride say, ‘Come.’ Let anyone who hears this say, ‘Come.’ Let anyone who is thirsty come. Let anyone who desires drink freely from the water of life.”

Proverbs 1:29-31
“For they hated knowledge and chose not to fear the Lord. They rejected my advice and paid no attention when I corrected them. Therefore, they must eat the bitter fruit of living their own way, choking on their own schemes.”

Christ Died for All
Calvinism teaches limited atonement, suggesting Christ died only for the elect. However, the Bible repeatedly emphasizes the universal scope of Christ’s sacrifice, which is sufficient for all humanity.

1 John 2:2
“He himself is the sacrifice that atones for our sins—and not only our sins but the sins of all the world.”

Hebrews 2:9
“What we do see is Jesus, who for a little while was given a position ‘a little lower than the angels’; and because he suffered death for us, he is now ‘crowned with glory and honor.’ Yes, by God’s grace, Jesus tasted death for everyone.”

John 1:29
“The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, ‘Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!’”

Romans 5:18
“Yes, Adam’s one sin brings condemnation for everyone, but Christ’s one act of righteousness brings a right relationship with God and new life for everyone.”



2 Corinthians 5:14-15
“Since we believe that Christ died for all, we also believe that we have all died to our old life. He died for everyone so that those who receive his new life will no longer live for themselves. Instead, they will live for Christ, who died and was raised for them.”

God’s Impartiality
Calvinism implies favoritism through unconditional election, but the Bible declares that God does not show partiality. His grace and judgment are applied fairly to all people.

Romans 2:11
“For God does not show favoritism.”

Acts 10:34-35
“Then Peter replied, ‘I see very clearly that God shows no favoritism. In every nation he accepts those who fear him and do what is right.’”

James 2:1
“My dear brothers and sisters, how can you claim to have faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ if you favor some people over others?”

Colossians 3:25
“But if you do what is wrong, you will be paid back for the wrong you have done. For God has no favorites.”

Deuteronomy 10:17
“For the Lord your God is the God of gods and Lord of lords. He is the great God, the mighty and awesome God, who shows no partiality and cannot be bribed.”



God’s Conditional Promises
Calvinism often emphasizes the sovereignty of God over human responsibility, but Scripture repeatedly shows that many of God’s promises are conditional, dependent on human response and obedience.

2 Chronicles 7:14
“Then if my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land.”



Jeremiah 18:7-8
“If I announce that a certain nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down, and destroyed, but then that nation renounces its evil ways, I will not destroy it as I had planned.”

Deuteronomy 28:1-2
“If you fully obey the Lord your God and carefully keep all his commands that I am giving you today, the Lord your God will set you high above all the nations of the world. You will experience all these blessings if you obey the Lord your God.”

Isaiah 1:19-20
“If you will only obey me, you will have plenty to eat. But if you turn away and refuse to listen, you will be devoured by the sword of your enemies. I, the Lord, have spoken!”

John 15:10
“When you obey my commandments, you remain in my love, just as I obey my Father’s commandments and remain in his love.”

God’s Universal Call to Repentance
Calvinism suggests that only the elect are drawn to repentance, but the Bible emphasizes God’s universal call for all people to repent and turn to Him. This reflects God’s desire for everyone to be saved.

Acts 17:30
“God overlooked people’s ignorance about these things in earlier times, but now he commands everyone everywhere to repent of their sins and turn to him.”

Luke 5:32
“I have come to call not those who think they are righteous, but those who know they are sinners and need to repent.”

Ezekiel 18:32
“I don’t want you to die, says the Sovereign Lord. Turn back and live!”

Mark 1:15
“The time promised by God has come at last! He announced. ‘The Kingdom of God is near! Repent of your sins and believe the Good News!’”



Isaiah 55:6-7
“Seek the Lord while you can find him. Call on him now while he is near. Let the wicked change their ways and banish the very thought of doing wrong. Let them turn to the Lord that he may have mercy on them. Yes, turn to our God, for he will forgive generously.”

Human Responsibility in Salvation
While Calvinism focuses on God’s sovereignty, Scripture highlights the active role of individuals in accepting or rejecting the gift of salvation. This reinforces the notion that salvation involves a cooperative response to God’s grace.

Philippians 2:12
“Work hard to show the results of your salvation, obeying God with deep reverence and fear.”

Hebrews 4:2
“For this Good News—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God.”

Matthew 7:21
“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter.”

James 2:26
“Just as the body is dead without breath, so also faith is dead without good works.”

John 6:29
“Jesus told them, ‘This is the only work God wants from you: Believe in the one he has sent.’”


Shalom.

J.

 

[Johann]

Greetings Johann,

Let us test your teachings with the word of God ~ pretty sure you will be found guilty of not rightly dividing the word of truth.

1st John 4:1​

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.”

No condition on man's part, Adam already proved that's impossible, with flesh nature free of indwelling sin! The only faith and obedience that is a perquisite for one's justification is Jesus Christ's faith and obedience which he secured for God's elect acting as their surety before the law of God, and he provided it perfectly for those given to him by his Father to redeem. John 17:2-9;

Hebrews 7:22​

“By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.”

You Johann, are not reading the verse correctly. The verse starts out by revealing to us "why" those received Christ , when most did not. As many as received him ....to them gave he the power to become the sons of God! Are you truly hearing the voice of John speaking to you through the Spirit, I think not. The power is given, then one believes, and receives what he is hearing, if the power is given. To prove what I'm saying is true, the Spirit gives to us His own commentary for verse 12, in John 1:13, which clearly said:

John 1:13​

“Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”

The new birth is not of blood, meaning it does not run from family to family, even though often it does, but that is not the means thereof. Nor is it of the flesh, or, by our own will and power, works that flow from us, for the flesh is at enmity against God, not just an enemy, which is bad enough, but is at constant war against God, truth, godliness, etc. Nor of the will of man ~ meaning that no one who also is flesh and blood bringing a message of gospel has any power/means within himself to get folks born again, impossible, the best he/she can do is bring to light where there is life that God has already spiritually resurrected from being dead in trespasses and sin to life in Jesus Christ. But of God ~ meaning the Spirit of God is the only one actively working in causing one to be born again. Maybe more on this later.

Again, you are not hearing what Jesus is teaching Nicodemus. First, he would not go against what he has already said here:

John 3:3​

“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

Meaning the new birth "MUST" proceed being able to see spiritually! A truth you are rejecting.

How do and should we understand the true sense of John 3:16? It is very simple ~ John 3:16 is "a declaration of a biblical truth," that whosoever believeth in Jesus Christ shall not perish, but they shall have everlasting life......in possess of it now, and shall continue for ever ~ using other scriptures of course, to make this statement. Such as John 11:25,26, etc.

Keep this from being too long of a post, I'm coming back to finish answering your post, I much prefer shorter post so one can think and ponder them better, without over taxing their flesh and wearing them down from even considering its context.

Your emphasis on the "MUST" is in the wrong place.
"whoever believes in Him" This is a present active participle, which emphasizes initial and continuing belief. See Special Topics at Joh_1:14; Joh_2:23. This affirmation is repeated from Joh_3:15 for emphasis.

Thank God for the "whosoever"! This must balance any overemphasis on a special group (racial, intellectual, or theological). It is not that "God's sovereignty" and "human freewill" are mutually exclusive; they are both true! God always initiates the response and sets the agenda (cf. Joh_6:44; Joh_6:65), but He has structured His relationship with humans by means of covenant. They must respond and continue to respond to His offer and conditions!


‘Calvinism, also known as Reformed Theology or the so called “Doctrines of Grace,” has had some resurgence in recent years. This has deeply disturbed and troubled me as Calvinism is a very heretical and dangerous theology that believers can be deceived into. Still, many believers have never even heard of Calvinism. For that reason, I find it necessary to post what it is that Calvinism teaches and how these false doctrines are in contradiction to the Holy Scriptures.

These are some of the major theological problems with Calvinism:

1. Calvinism denies man’s free will to obey or disobey God, which is the basis of man’s responsibility and accountability, as taught by the Bible: (Gen. 4:6-7; Deut. 11:26-28; 30:11-15, 19; Josh. 24:15; Jer. 38:20; Eze. 18:30; Acts 17:30-31);

Augustine said, “By Adam’s transgression, the freedom of’ the human will has been completely lost.”

Augustine said, “By the greatness of the first sin, we have lost the freewill to love God.”

Augustine said, “by subverting the rectitude in which he was created, he is followed with the punishment of not being able to do right” and “the freedom to abstain from sin has been lost as a punishment of sin.”

Martin Luther said that “the law demands of men what they cannot do…”

Martin Luther said, “For if man has lost his freedom, and is forced to serve sin, and cannot will good, what conclusion can more justly be drawn concerning him, than that he sins and wills evil necessarily?”

[Read/listen to my sermon “God’s Lordship and Man’s Free Will“.]

[Read also my article “Sinful Nature“.]

[Read also “The Nobody is Perfect Myth“.]

2. Calvinism denies that each individual is responsible and accountable for their own sins committed in their own life, and will not be damned for the sins of anyone else, as the Bible teaches: (Lev. 18:29; Deut. 24:16; 2 Kng. 14:6; 2 Chron. 25:4; Eze. 18:2-6; Eze. 18:20; Jer. 17:10; Matt. 16:27; Rom. 2:5-6; Rom. 14:12; 2 Cor. 5:10; 2 Cor. 11:15; 1 Pet. 1:17; Rev. 20:11-12; Rev. 22:12);

John Calvin stated, “Adam drew all his posterity with himself, by his fall, into eternal damnation.”

[Read “Augustinian Original Sin Attacked“.]

3. Calvinism denies that Christ died for everyone (Heb. 2:9; 2 Cor. 5:14-15; 1 Jn. 2:2), and His unlimited atonement does not make salvation automatic for anyone, but available for everyone (Jn. 3:14-17; 12:46; Acts 10:43; Rom. 10:11; Rev. 22:17), and that those for whom Christ died can still perish (Rom. 14:15; 1 Cor. 8:11; 2 Pet. 2:1); as the Bible teaches.

Custance said, “No man can be held accountable for a debt that has already been paid for on his behalf to the satisfaction of the offended party. But a double jeopardy, a duplication of indebtedness, is indeed involved if the non-elect are to be punished for sins which the Lord Jesus Christ has already endured punishment.”

Boettner said, “For God to have laid the sins of all men on Christ would mean that as regards to the lost He would be punishing their sins twice, once in Christ, and then again in them.”

Wayne Grudem said, “Reformed people argue that if Christ’s death actually paid for the sins of every person who ever lived, then there is no penalty left for anyone to pay, and it necessarily follows that all people will be saved, without exception. For God could not condemn to eternal punishment anyone whose sins are already paid for: that would be demanding double payment, and it would therefore be unjust.”

Joshua Williamson said, “If Christ died for everyone, everyone would be saved.”

[Read: “Limited Atonement“.]

4. Calvinism denies the universal benevolence or love of God, which wants all sinners to repent and be saved as taught by the Bible: (Eze. 33:11; John 3:14-17; 2 Pet. 3:19);

John Calvin said, “not only was the destruction of the ungodly foreknown, but the ungodly themselves have been created for the specific purpose of perishing.”

John Calvin said, “First, the eternal predestination of God, by which before the fall of Adam He decreed what should take place concerning the whole human race and every individual, was fixed and determined.”

John Calvin said, “At this point in particular the flesh rages when it hears that the predestination to death of those who perish is referred to the will of God.”

Alan Kurschner said, “God desires that his sheep are saved. God desires that his people are saved. He does not desire that every single individual who has ever lived, live in glory with him forever. If that were the case, we have an incompetent, unhappy, and impotent God.”

Matthew McMahon said, “I reject anything which makes God a cosmic bell-hop tending to the commands and demands of sinful men as another gospel. I reject anything which removes God’s sovereignty to place man as the Sovereign as another gospel. I reject anything which denies the sovereign decrees of God and His electing grace to put salvation into the hands of sinful men as another gospel. I reject anything which denies man’s total depravity and exalts his fictitious free will as another gospel. I reject anything which places the perseverance of man to glory in the incapable hands of a sinful man as another gospel. I reject anything which endeavors to treat God as the great Grandfather in the sky beckoning and pleading with man to be saved as changing the true God into a pitiable wimp.”

Erwin Lutzer said, “The revealed will was that all men be saved, but the hidden will was that the greater part of mankind be damned.”

John Calvin said, “His secret counsel, by which He determined to convert none but His elect.”

John MacArthur, comments: “His patience is not so He can save all of them, but so that He can receive all of His own…”

[Read: “The Hidden Will of The Father concerning Predestination“.]

5. Calvinism denies the conditional security of believers or the possibility of falling away from the faith as taught by the Bible (Matt. 24:13; Jn. 15:6; Acts 11:23; Acts 13:43; Acts 14:22; Rom. 8:13; Rom. 11:20-21; 1 Cor. 9:27; Heb. 2:1-3; Heb. 10:26-31; 2 Pet. 2:20-21);

Martin Luther said, “Be a sinner and sin boldly… No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day.”

Westminster Confession of Faith said, “They whom God hath accepted in His Beloved, effectually called and sanctified by his Spirit, can neither totally nor finally fall away from the state of grace; but shall certainly persevere therein to the end, and be eternally saved.”

[Read: “Conditional Security“.]

6. Calvinism denies man’s role, responsibility, and choice to cooperate with God in regeneration or in the changing of his heart as taught by the Bible(Deut. 10:16; Eze. 18:30-32; Ps. 78:8; Ps. 95:8; Heb. 3:15; Act 7:51; 17:30-31; Jas. 4:8; Col. 3:9-10; Eph. 4:22, 24; 1 Tim. 4:16);

Martin Luther said, “I say that man… when he is re-created does and endeavors nothing towards his perseverance in that kingdom; but the Spirit alone works both blessings in us, regenerating us, and preserving us when regenerate, without ourselves…”

A. W. Pink said, “The new birth is solely the work of God the Spirit and man has no part in it.”

[I have not yet solved this detail in my theology, but I do agree with Tim Conway in this preaching. (he is a Calvinist but he sounds very uncalvinist there!)]

7. Calvinism denies that there is deliverance available from all sin in Jesus Christ, or the possibility of overcoming sin in this life by the grace of God as taught by the Bible (Matt. 1:21; Jn. 8:36; Rom. 6:18, 20, 22; 8:2; 1 Cor. 10:13; 1 Thes. 3:13; 1 Thes. 5:23; Titus 2:11-12; Jude 1:24; 1 Tim. 6:14; 1 Jn. 1:9; 3:9).

The Westminster Catechism says, “No man is able, either of himself, or by any grace received in this life, perfectly to keep the commandments of God; but does daily break them in word, thought, and deed.”

[Read also “The Nobody is Perfect Myth“.]

8. Calvinism denies that man’s choice to repent of all his sins is a necessary condition of forgiveness, but rather teaches that justification by grace through faith is nothing more than justification in sin and impenitence (Antinomianism), as opposed to what the Bible teaches: (Isa. 55:7; Eze. 18:30; Prov. 28:13; Matt. 7:21; 19:17; Lk. 13:3; Acts 8:22; Rom. 2:5; 6:1-2; Titus 2:11-12; Jude 1:4; Rev. 22:14).

Charles Spurgeon said, “You must not expect that you will be perfect in ‘repentance’ before you are saved. No Christian can be perfect. “Repentance” is a grace. Some people preach it as a condition of salvation. Condition of nonsense! There are no conditions of salvation. God gives the salvation himself…”

Harry Ironside said, “The Gospel is not a call to repentance, or to amendment of our ways, to make restitution for past sins, or to promise to do better in the future. These things are proper in their place, but they do not constitute the Gospel; for the Gospel is not good advice to be obeyed, it is good news to be believed. Do not make the mistake then of thinking that the Gospel is a call to duty or a call to reformation, a call to better your condition, to behave yourself in a more perfect way than you have been doing in the past … Nor is the Gospel a demand that you give up the world, that you give up your sins, that you break off bad habits, and try to cultivate good ones. You may do all these things, and yet never believe the Gospel and consequently never be saved at all.”

[Not all calvinists are antinomians, when confronting unbelievers with the Gospel, as can be seen in Tim Conway’s preaching but many will teach antinomianism to believers, by using unorthodox doctrines like “once saved always saved”, and “monergism”. The use of such teachings leads many away from their responsibility and will lead them into disobedience, which will eventually make them lose their salvation. Read also “Synergism“.]

9. Calvinism denies that God is not the author of sin, nor the sovereign cause of its entrance into the world, as taught by the Bible (Gen. 1:31; 6:5-6; 1 Sam. 15:22; Jer. 19:5, 32:35; Isa. 5:4; Zeph. 3:5; Ecc. 7:29; Matt. 6:10; Lk. 7:30; 1 Cor. 14:33; Heb. 1:9, James 1:13).

Martin Luther said, “Since, therefore, God moves and does all in all, He necessarily moves and does all in Satan and the wicked man…”

Martin Luther said, “God worketh all things in all men even wickedness in the wicked…”

John Calvin said, “Whatever things are done wrongly and unjustly by man, these very things are the right and just works of God.”

[I talk on this subject in the beginning of my sermon “God’s Lordship and Man’s Free Will“.]

There are many other orthodox doctrines which are taught in the Scriptures and which were held by all of the Early Church which are denied by Augustinian and Reformed Theology, but the above is sufficient for this article.

As much as Calvinism claims to be orthodox, its doctrines are utterly opposed to the doctrines of the Early Church Fathers before Augustine, and they have more in common with the heretical teachings of the Gnostics and Manicheans.

[See also Jesse Morrell’s excellent documentary “Did Augustine Corrupt The Church With Gnostic Doctrine? Beyond Augustine“.]

Sadly, many Calvinist groups function as a cult today, claiming exclusively that Calvinism is Christianity, that their doctrine of T.U.L.I.P. is the gospel itself, and that anyone who disagrees with their doctrine is a “heretic,” “false teacher,” or “false convert.” They are quick to break fellowship with, and falsely accuse, any Christian that contradicts their own theology.’

[I can affirm this statement (and this whole document by the way). I have had my share of “hate-crimes” by calvinists]

Source: Jesse Morrell, “Why I Am Not A Calvinist: How Reformed Theology Contradicts Scripture” (biblicaltruthresources).

[Ps. I love calvinists. I just don’t like their doctrine(s).]

Why I am not a Calvinist: How Reformed Theology contradicts Scripture

For edification of the body of Christ – and not out of laziness – I’ve copied a blog post of Jesse Morrell to this website and I have added my own links, [between brackets], withi…

crosstheology.wordpress.com

Free Will of Men and God's Sovereignty: A Paradox for Calvinist John Piper - Dr. Eitan Bar

Fate has permeated Christianity, particularly Calvinistic theology, under the guise of "unconditional election." This predestination concept asserts that God pr

eitan.bar

J.

 

[Red Baker]

Johann,

No problem with me addressing every single point that you seem to have copied and pasted, becuase of you doing so, I will not even attempt to stay caught up for that would be an impossible task and very reasonable for you to even think anyone could do so I rather discuss such thing from one person to another each (or more if others desire to join in) using their own understanding which God has been pleased to give them. I'm really not interesting spending a lot of energy reading others thoughts especially so if they are not here to discuss what they believe with me, one on one, face to face, I trust you do understand.

Now concerning your first post, much of which I have covered so many times over in my fifty plus years of teaching the scriptures. But, for the sake of others, here we go again, with maybe different listens, many of which will not even ponder much of what we have to say, but, neither did they care for what Christ had to say and we are certainly not above our Lord and Master. We are looking for sheep, not goats, those playful little creature are too busy running and playing, and being very destructive, and will follow anyone.

I am pretty sure YOU are not rightly cutting straight the word of God and in your "system" there is no hope for the non-elect.

First of all, it is not my system, but a very clear teaching of the word of the Living God, who himself is a Sovereign all wise God, doing all things after the council of His own Sovereign will and eternal purposes, which he purposed within himself, taking no instructions/advice from anyone, whether they thought what he was going to do would be righteous in doing so. His ways are perfect, and no man has the right to say unto him, what doest thou?

Daniel 4:35​

“And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?”

Why do you even think God should provide hope for all men? Why does he have to provide hope for any as far as that goes? He left most of the created angels without any hope, is man a created being higher or lower than them?

Psalms 8:4,5​

“What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour.”+

Is God fair, just, righteous, by leaving them in their fallen state, without the least amount of mercy to them? Does God need to give account to you, or anyone else as to why he did as he did to them. The devil hates God's election because he was left out, though most likley the most glorious created being of them all. Ezekiel 28:12-29, etc. Let me move on, I'm not coping and pasting, but thinking and writing, as the Spirit leads me.

Calvinism, with its emphasis on predestination and limited atonement, often sparks theological debates.

What are you talking about? seriously? As though Jesus' teaching causes no division? He did not comes to bring peace, he came declaring the truths of the word of God and those truth cause division, between those of man's own household and they still do! Do I need to heap scriptures upon you to prove this? I can easily do so, but one or two will suffice for now.

Matthew 10:34​

“Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Matthew 15:12​

“Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?”

Calvinism asserts that salvation is limited to the elect, but the Bible consistently reveals God’s heart for all people to be saved. The Scriptures affirm God’s universal offer of grace and the invitation to everyone to respond in faith.

1. Question for you ~ was God the God of all nations in the OT, or the God of the Jews only? Your false theology will fall quicker than Dagon the god of the Philistines did before the ark of God, remember that story? Read all of 1st Samuel 5:1-6 and all of God's children shouted AMEN, AMEN!

1st Samuel 5:4​

“And when they arose early on the morrow morning, behold, Dagon was fallen upon his face to the ground before the ark of the LORD; and the head of Dagon and both the palms of his hands were cut off upon the threshold; only the stump of Dagon was left to him.”

2. The bible does not consistently reveal God's heart for all people to be saved. Who told you that lie? Your own deceived heart, Johann, no pun intended, but you need to stay with God's word for your bible answer, I speak this in love for you, that's what love does to those we are suppose to love. Question for you: Did God show the same love, or any love as far as that goes to the Egyptians in Moses' day? He hardened Pharaoh's heart (not by working in his heart to make it hard, He did so by "NOT" showing any mercy to him, and thereby, when God does that, man's heart is harden more and more, to the degree God leaves them to themselves) and his officers, when they followed Israel into the Red Sea, and once in there, he removed the wheels from off of their chariots! Now, you tell me why did the he do so, if God's heart is for all men as you said above? Johann, you have a serious problem with your understanding, you need to humble yourself under the mighty hand of God and seek your truth from his mouth not from others.

3. The scriptures does not offer grace and an invitation to everyone, the scriptures declares the message of reconciliation of what Christ has secured for God's elect, by Jesus being made the surety for them, fulfilling the requirements of the law on their behalf. God made Christ sin for us, that we might be made the righteousness of God by/through him, by what he did for us. 2nd Corinthians 5:17-19 You do not offer anything to men dead in trespasses and sin, only to those who have life, who can respond to the invitations, from such scriptures that seems to offer, and demand us to heed.

1 Timothy 2:4
“He wants everyone to be saved and to understand the truth.”

Johann, I'll start now addressing some of these scriptures, and trust you will wait until I get through with at least this first post to me. It may take a few posts, and a day or two, since I do have other obligations to fulfill, also, because I desire thoroughly to address them.

Coming back....RB