Those who deny the Lord Jesus is God (=YHWH) are not saved (2 Corinthians 11:4)

[Fred]

The Father is my God.

Jesus is "my God" as well (John 20:28).

 

[synergy]

Hear it from the lips of the a maker of the Trinity.

Huh?

I have you the information you needed about the Jewish Law of Agency. You threw it away.

I did look at the one verse (John 17:18) you gave me but Jesus has dozens of other titles than that.
He is the Uncreated Word of God made flesh (John 1:1,2,14). That way it can be said that only the Trinitarian Jesus spiritual saves. All others are imposters because they're all just humans.

I have no complaint. Yahweh is God. Yahweh is the God of Jesus.

So you won't mind if I use the Name of God that the Apostles used, Θεὸς?

 

[Matthias]

Huh?

I was writing a post at the same time you posted. I stopped writing and responded to your post. The sentence I was writing carried over. As you will see, if you read my post again, I deleted that sentence.

Since it’s here now, I was going to direct you to Gregory of Nyssa. He tells us how he and others destroyed the monotheism of Jesus and compromised with paganism to create the doctrine of the Trinity.

Read it from his own lips. You’ll find it in post #228 in the Worshipping The Son thread.

I did look at the one verse (John 17:18) you gave me but Jesus has dozens of other titles than that.
He is the Uncreated Word of God made flesh (John 1:1,2,14). That way it can be said that only Trinitarian Jesus spiritual saves. All others are imposters.

Your feeding me trinitarianism as if it were the truth. It isn’t. Trinitarians cannot speak about the Trinity without using Greek philosophical concepts. Those concepts don’t come from scripture. They come from Greek philosophy and you read scripture through those eyes, not through the eyes of Jesus.

It’s easy to test this. Let’s use only one Greek philosophical concept which is indispensable in discussing your deity: ousia. There’s no way on Yahweh’s good earth that you would jettison this term from your doctrine. No way at all. A complete impossibility.

Who uses this word in scripture to speak about Yahweh?

The word only occurs one time. Is it used in reference to Yahweh? No. Check it and see.

You’re using and relying on concepts which are foreign to scripture. No wonder that you have a deity which is not the Messiah’s.

So you won't mind if I use the Name of God that the Apostles used, Θεὸς?

Why would I mind anything that you do? You don’t need my approval for anything. Post whatever it is that you believe. If you believe in a deity which is not the Messiah’s God - and you do - then I won’t go along with you.

The only God whom Jesus calls his God and my God is Yahweh. There is no God besides Yahweh. Yahweh is only one person - the God and Father of Jesus.

If you’re bound and determined to worship a deity whom the Messiah doesn’t then do it. But know this: doing so makes you a follower of men who created the Trinity; not a follower of Jesus of Nazareth.

You might as well be worshipping Dagon, or one of the other detestable deities of the pagans.

Dagon isn’t the God of Jesus. Yahweh is the God of Jesus.

 

[Matthias]

Jesus of Nazareth is not the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is the God of Jesus.

Heaven forbid that anyone would think for even a moment that the Trinity is the God of Jesus.

Jesus ascended to his God. Listen to him.

Jesus didn’t ascend to the Trinity.

Jesus ascended to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

Jesus ascended to Yahweh.

There is no other God for him to ascend to.

 

[Matthias]

My simple advice: Do not have for your God anyone or anything that Jesus of Nazareth does not have for his God.

Follow or don’t follow my advice. No one will answer to me for the choices that they make. We will all answer to Jesus of Nazareth for the choices we make.

Do what you think best.

Be prepared in advance to answer when Jesus asks, why do you have a god which I don’t?

 

[Fred]

Jesus of Nazareth is not the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is the God of Jesus.

Heaven forbid that anyone would think for even a moment that the Trinity is the God of Jesus.

Jesus ascended to his God. Listen to him.

Jesus didn’t ascend to the Trinity.

Jesus ascended to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

Jesus ascended to Yahweh.

There is no other God for him to ascend to.

Repetitious nonsense repeated over and over will never make it true.

 

[synergy]

I was writing a post at the same time you posted. I stopped writing and responded to your post. The sentence I was writing carried over. As you will see, if you read my post again, I deleted that sentence.

Since it’s here now, I was going to direct you to Gregory of Nyssa. He tells us how he and others destroyed the monotheism of Jesus and compromised with paganism to create the doctrine of the Trinity.

Read it from his own lips. You’ll find it in post #228 in the Worshipping The Son thread.




Your feeding me trinitarianism as if it were the truth. It isn’t. Trinitarians cannot speak about the Trinity without using Greek philosophical concepts. Those concepts don’t come from scripture. They come from Greek philosophy and you read scripture through those eyes, not through the eyes of Jesus.

It’s easy to test this. Let’s use only one Greek philosophical concept which is indispensable in discussing your deity: ousia. There’s no way on Yahweh’s good earth that you would jettison this term from your doctrine. No way at all. A complete impossibility.

Who uses this word in scripture to speak about Yahweh?

The word only occurs one time. Is it used in reference to Yahweh? No. Check it and see.

You’re using and relying on concepts which are foreign to scripture. No wonder that you have a deity which is not the Messiah’s.



Why would I mind anything that you do? You don’t need my approval for anything. Post whatever it is that you believe. If you believe in a deity which is not the Messiah’s God - and you do - then I won’t go along with you.

Both your Jewish view of monotheism and the polytheism the classical Greeks are "heresy". Exactly! "The polytheistic error of the Greek school is made to vanish". Correct!

"The Jewish dogma is destroyed by the acceptance of the Word and by the belief in the Spirit..." Absolutely correct! I notice that unitarians avoid John 1 like the plague.

You have very little understanding, if any, about the era of the Eastern Roman Empire and their Ecumenical Councils.

The only God whom Jesus calls his God and my God is Yahweh. There is no God besides Yahweh. Yahweh is only one person - the God and Father of Jesus.

Jesus called himself the Great "I Am". I choose to worship the "I Am" of the OT.

If you’re bound and determined to worship a deity whom the Messiah doesn’t then do it. But know this: doing so makes you a follower of men who created the Trinity; not a follower of Jesus of Nazareth.

If you’re bound and determined not to worship God whom the Messiah declared himself to be then know this: doing so makes you a follower of men who attempted to stone Jesus because he would not buy into their Jewish version of "monotheism", not a follower of Jesus of Nazareth.

You might as well be worshipping Dagon, or one of the other detestable deities of the pagans.

You might as well join in with the Pharisees in throwing rocks at Jesus. I would strongly advise against it!

Dagon isn’t the God of Jesus.

Who is Dagon? An imaginary friend?

Yahweh is the God of Jesus.

Θεὸς is God the Father.

 

[Matthias]

Both your Jewish view of monotheism and the polytheism the classical Greeks are "heresy". Exactly! "The polytheistic error of the Greek school is made to vanish". Correct!

So says trinitarianism.

"The Jewish dogma is destroyed by the acceptance of the Word and by the belief in the Spirit..." Absolutely correct! I notice that unitarians avoid John 1 like the plague.

The Jewish dogma that is destroyed by trinitarianism is the Messiah’s dogma.

I’ve never met a unitarian who avoided John 1.

You have very little understanding, if any, about the era of the Eastern Roman Empire and their Ecumenical Councils.

On what do you base this? I’ve written extensively for years about the subject.mHave you read what I have written about it?

Jesus called himself the Great "I Am". I choose to worship the "I Am" of the OT.

No he didn’t.

If you’re bound and determined not to worship God whom the Messiah declared himself to be then know this: doing so makes you a follower of men who attempted to stone Jesus because he would not buy into their Jewish version of "monotheism", not a follower of Jesus of Nazareth.

I’m bound and determined to worship the God whom the Messiah worships. The men who attempted to stone Jesus didn’t believe he is the Messiah sent by their God and his God.

You might as well join in with the Pharisees in throwing rocks at Jesus.

Unlike the Pharisees, I believe that Jesus is the Messiah.

Who is Dagon?

Seriously? Dagon is the god of the Philistines.

Θεὸς is God the Father.

Great. Jesus isn’t God the Father.

 

[synergy]

So says trinitarianism.

Hey, you're the one who forwarded those words. It's not my fault that they backfired on you.

I see that your only comeback is the word "trinitarianism". As if that word will magically transform me into a unitarian believer.

The Jewish dogma that is destroyed by trinitarianism is the Messiah’s dogma.

Keep rubbing shoulders with your Pharisees buddies in not believing that Jesus is the "I Am" of the OT. I would strongly advise against it.

I’ve never met a unitarian who avoided John 1.

But do they believe it? If yes then they would believe that Jesus is the Uncreated Word of God made flesh.

On what do you base this? I’ve written extensively for years about the subject.mHave you read what I have written about it?

Your understanding of Gregory of Nyssa's words are a perfect case in point. Your only comeback was the word "trinitarianism". As if that word will magically transform me into a unitarian believer.

No he didn’t.

John 8:58.

I’m bound and determined to worship the God whom the Messiah worships. The men who attempted to stone Jesus didn’t believe he is the Messiah sent by their God and his God.

Christ is the Greek word for Messiah. Jesus was not stoned for declaring himself the Christ. He was stoned for declaring himself the "I Am". You need to get your story straight.

Unlike the Pharisees, I believe that Jesus is the Messiah.

Again, Jesus was not stoned for declaring himself the Christ. He was stoned for declaring himself the "I Am".

Seriously? Dagon is the god of the Philistines.

You're more informed about paganism than I am. Carry on.

Great. Jesus isn’t God the Father.

I never said he was.

 

[Matthias]

Hey, you're the one who forwarded those words. It's not my fault that they backfired on you.

They didn’t backfire on me. The people who created the Trinity compromised with paganism and destroyed Jewish monotheism. I want the whole world to know it.

The Messiah is a Jewish monotheist. Trinitarianism destroys his Jewish monotheism.

Keep rubbing shoulders with your Pharisees buddies in not believing that Jesus is the "I Am" of the OT. I would strongly advise against it.

The Pharisees aren’t my buddies. They didn’t believe that Jesus is the Messiah who was sent by their God. The few Pharisees who eventually did believe Jesus is the Messiah promised, raised up and sent by their God didn’t convert to trinitarianism. They remained believers in the one God; the same one God who is the Messiah’s God.

But do they believe it? If yes then they would believe that Jesus is the Uncreated Word of God made flesh.

Jesus is the word of the one God made flesh.

Your understanding of Gregory of Nyssa's words are a perfect case in point. Your only comeback was the word "trinitarianism". As if that word will magically transform me into a unitarian believer.

Only coming to a belief in the one God who is the Messiah’s God will transform you into a unitarian.

Gregory of Nyssa didn’t come to that belief. His deity isn’t the Messiah’s one God.

I follow the Messiah, not Gregory of Nyssa.

John 8:58.

Christ is the Greek word for Messiah. Jesus was not stoned for declaring himself the Christ. He was stoned for declaring himself the "I Am". You need to get your story straight.

The Christ / Messiah has authority which his enemies refused to acknowledge. In what became a heated argument, they resorted to violence. The biblical storyline is Jesus is the Messiah, not Jesus is the one God.

If you haven’t read William Barclay’s commentary on the incident, I recommend it to you.

Again, Jesus was not stoned for declaring himself the Christ. He was stoned for declaring himself the "I Am".

Jesus claimed “I am the Messiah”. Jesus never claimed “I am the one God.”

The one God is the Messiah’s God, not the Messiah himself.

You're more informed about paganism than I am. Carry on.

Anyone who has read the Hebrew Bible has read that Dagon is the god of the Philistines. Have you not read the Old Testament?

I never said he was.

You should acknowledge that the Father alone is the one God. Jesus does.

 

[Matthias]

The Messiah is a Jewish monotheist. Trinitarianism destroys his Jewish monotheism.

Trinitarianism destroys the Messiah’s belief about who the one God is.

 

[Fred]

The Messiah is a Jewish monotheist. Trinitarianism destroys his Jewish monotheism.

Trinitarianism destroys the Messiah’s belief about who the one God is.

Jesus said "God knows your hearts." (Luke 16:15) - Jesus knew this knowledge belonged to God alone. (1 Kings 8:39)
Jesus knows the hearts of all people. (John 2:24-25)
Jesus knew He is YHWH.

 

[civic]

The Messiah is a Jewish monotheist. Trinitarianism destroys his Jewish monotheism.

Trinitarianism destroys the Messiah’s belief about who the one God is.

Thomas, Jude, John, Peter,James, Paul, Author of Hebrews,Matthew, Mark, Luke all destroy unitarianism.

 

[Matthias]

Imagine yourself standing in the Messiah’s shoes. Your belief about who the one God is has been destroyed by people who admit that they borrowed from paganism to construct their belief about who the one God is.

Standing in the Messiah’s shoes, are you happy or unhappy about what these men have done?

 

[Matthias]

Thomas, Jude, John, Peter,James, Paul, Author of Hebrews,Matthew, Mark, Luke all destroy unitarianism.

Thomas, Jude, John, Peter, James, Paul, the author of Hebrews, Matthew, Mark, Luke are all unitarians, just like the Messiah whom they follow.

 

[civic]

Thomas, Jude, John, Peter, James, Paul, the author of Hebrews, Matthew, Mark, Luke are all unitarians, just like the Messiah whom they follow.

conflating terms they are monotheists exactly like I'm a monotheist, they all affirm the Deity of Christ , that He is God.

 

[Matthias]

conflating terms they are monotheists exactly like I'm a monotheist ..

There is a difference between their unitary monotheism and your trinitary monotheism.

You aren’t a monotheist in the same way that Jesus of Nazareth is. They are.

… they all affirm the Deity of Christ , that He is God.

They all affirm the deity of Christ is his Father and their Father.

 

[civic]

There is a difference between their unitary monotheism and your trinitary monotheism.

You aren’t a monotheist like Jesus of Nazareth is. They are.




They all affirm the deity of Christ is his Father and their Father.

No as every reliable source includes Christianity along with Judaism and Islam as Monotheistic world religions.

And you are conflating oneness who teach Jesus is the Father with us. You should know better as I expect more from you.

 

[Matthias]

No as every reliable source includes Christianity along with Judaism and Islam as Monotheistic world religions.

Monotheism, yes. But unitarian monotheism and trinitarian monotheism aren’t the same monotheism.

The Messiah‘s monotheism is unitarian, not trinitarian.

 

[civic]

Monotheism, yes. But unitarian monotheism and trinitarian monotheism aren’t the same monotheism.

The Messiah‘s monotheism is unitarian, not trinitarian.

no that is not the accepted definition in any of the objective sources. Christianity , Judaism and Islam all believe in ONE God which is Monotheism. We are not Tritheists.

And notice who is back to using the word , not me

hope this helps !!!