civic
Well-known member
Nope nothing to do with each other. Jesus called Unitarians father the devil in John 8:39-44.
The Bible does not teach to pray to Jesus
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Runningman
Well-known member
Jesus didn't call his own father the devil. This is madness. Unitarians like Jesus and I have God as our Father.
civic
Well-known member
He said the Unitarian Pharisees that their father was the devil.
Stop projecting and conflating
Runningman
Well-known member
Those particular individuals had their father as the devil, but not all are like that which is why Jesus' father is not the devil even though Jesus is plainly a Unitarian.
Nope. You continue to conflate Persons and Nature. God is one nature manifested in three persons. Therefore, the post totally misrepresents Trinitarians in that it is totally ignorant that Trinitarianism is multi-person (and monotheistic according to God's nature). It's back to the drawing board for you all.
Peterlag
Well-known member
The Bible says Jesus is an “heir” of God (Hebrew 1:2), and a “joint-heir” with us (Romans 8:17). But if Christ is a co-eternal “Person” in the “Godhead” then he cannot be an heir “of God” because being God would put him into a position to be a full owner of everything and that would mean there would be nothing he could “inherit” which is why Jesus cannot be God and an heir of God at the same time. The Bible says that Jesus Christ is the “image of God” Colossians 1:15; 2 Corinthians 4:4). If Christ is the image of God, then he cannot be God because a person cannot be himself and an image of himself at the same time. Jesus can be called the “image” of God because he always did the will of God, and because he was the image of God is why he could say you had seen the Father if you had seen him.
Ephesians 4:4-6 says there is one God and one Lord and one spirit. This verse teaches exactly what the Jews expected based on the Old Testament and what Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others taught: that there was one God, one Lord, and one spirit of God. 1 Corinthians 8:6 says “for us there is one God, the Father… and one Lord, Jesus Christ.” This simple and straightforward language elucidates that the Father is God and the Son is “Lord” making a clear differentiation between the two.
Jesus said: “…the Father is greater than I” (John 14:28). In contrast, the orthodox formula of the Trinity says the Father and the Son are “co-equal.” God is greater than Christ, just as Christ is greater than we are. 1 Corinthians 3:23 says “And ye are Christ’s; and Christ is God’s.” When the Bible says “you are Christ’s” it's saying “you belong to Christ” and many English versions say exactly that (i.e., CJB; HCSB; NASB; NET; NJB; NLT). So the verse is saying “and you belong to Christ; and Christ belongs to God” (NASB). It seems apparent that Jesus cannot be God and belong to God at the same time.
Ephesians 4:4-6 says there is one God and one Lord and one spirit. This verse teaches exactly what the Jews expected based on the Old Testament and what Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others taught: that there was one God, one Lord, and one spirit of God. 1 Corinthians 8:6 says “for us there is one God, the Father… and one Lord, Jesus Christ.” This simple and straightforward language elucidates that the Father is God and the Son is “Lord” making a clear differentiation between the two.
Jesus said: “…the Father is greater than I” (John 14:28). In contrast, the orthodox formula of the Trinity says the Father and the Son are “co-equal.” God is greater than Christ, just as Christ is greater than we are. 1 Corinthians 3:23 says “And ye are Christ’s; and Christ is God’s.” When the Bible says “you are Christ’s” it's saying “you belong to Christ” and many English versions say exactly that (i.e., CJB; HCSB; NASB; NET; NJB; NLT). So the verse is saying “and you belong to Christ; and Christ belongs to God” (NASB). It seems apparent that Jesus cannot be God and belong to God at the same time.
Runningman
Well-known member
A nature is a thing, not a person. God is a person. You’re saying God is a bunch of different person’s when they are not.
Without a nature, a person is no longer a person. You can't divorce one's nature from his person. We all have a nature whether you like it or not. So God is three persons (with one nature) which throws Peterlag's attachment for a 100 yard loss. It's once again back to the drawing board for you all.
Your repeated appeal to Christ being called Lord is proof that Christ is YHWH/Jehovah and Adonai. That's because the name Lord comes directly from κυριος as written in the Greek OT (Septuagint), and that in turn comes directly from YHWH/Jehovah and Adonai as written in the Hebrew text.
The Apostles followed the Septuagint and called Jesus κυριος (Lord) which is the Greek name for YHWH and Adonai. They did not use the name "Lord" (κυριος) for anyone besides Jesus and God the Father in the New Testament. While κυριος could be used culturally as a term of respect or authority, the Apostles specifically used "Lord" (κυριος) to indicate divine authority, reverence, or worship when referring to Jesus or God the Father. The Apostles reserved the title "Lord", in its spiritual sense, for the divine alone, and there is no record of them calling any other human "Lord" in the same way as they did for Jesus and the Father.
Thank you for continuing to prove Trinitarianism. We appreciate it.
Functional subjection does not necessitate ontological inferiority (Ephesians 5:24).
Runningman
Well-known member
You have just proven that Jesus isn't God if that's what you truly believe. God doesn't have a human nature according to Scripture because He never was a man.
Runningman
Well-known member
Jesus isn't the Lord in Acts 1:24, Acts 2:21,22, 34, 39, 47, Acts 3:20-22, and Acts 4:23-31 because God (YHWH) and Jesus are Lords in different contexts.
civic
Well-known member
Jesus is a Trinitarian not a unitarian so stop projecting your beliefs onto Jesus. He was God, the Holy Spirit is also God.
The word "Lord" is not in Acts 2:22.
civic
Well-known member
He sure is the Lord they prayed to on Acts 1 just like Paul in Acts 9
Therefore it is necessary to choose one of the men who have been with us the whole time the Lord Jesus was living among us,22;beginning from John’s baptism to the time when Jesus was taken up from us. For one of these must become a witness with us of his resurrection.”
23So they nominated two men: Joseph called Barsabbas (also known as Justus) and Matthias. 24;Then they prayed, “Lord, you know everyone’s heart. Show us which of these two you have chosen
John 2:24-25
But Jesus did not entrust Himself to them, for He knew them all. / He did not need any testimony about man, for He knew what was in a man.
Matthew 9:4But Jesus, knowing their thoughts, said, “Why do you think evil in your hearts?
Revelation 2:23
Then I will strike her children dead, and all the churches will know that I am the One who searches minds and hearts, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds.
Huh? Jesus was already God by nature, as the Preincarnate Word of God, by virtue of his Godly nature and Godly Personage. He just added human nature to his already God nature which does not nullify the fact that he remains God (and human) by nature.
civic
Well-known member
Yes Bible Basics 101 which he rejects.
Peterlag
Well-known member
Jesus did have divine authority. He is the son of God, the Messiah to Israel, the now resurrected Lord Christ to the Christian who is second in command and the head of the body of Christ.
Runningman
Well-known member
No Jesus is a Unitarian. Stop projecting your beliefs onto Jesus. Jesus defined God as one person. See John 17:3.
Runningman
Well-known member
The Lord is God (YHWH) who did miracles through Jesus. The Lord did miracles through many other men as well.
Acts 2
21And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
22Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
