Scripture teaches that Jesus was not involved in his resurrection

[Runningman]

Thanks for proving my point.
God worked through Elijah, so Elijah can't be discounted in what took place.

You are attempting to eradicate Jesus in the resurrection of Himself from the dead, but like the example above it is a total flop on your part.

So Elijah didn't actually do what he said. Is Elijah a liar or a prophet?

John 2:22
When therefore He was risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this and they believed the Scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.


Too bad you don't believe the word Jesus had said.

You just cursed Jesus Christ now you think you have any standing to talk about what I believe. You aren't even talking about it, you're being accusatory. You sound a lot like Satan tonight. Are you ok? Need prayer?

 

[Fred]

So Elijah didn't actually do what he said. Is Elijah a liar or a prophet?

You just cursed Jesus Christ now you think you have any standing to talk about what I believe. You aren't even talking about it, you're being accusatory. You sound a lot like Satan tonight. Are you ok? Need prayer?

1 Kings 17:1
And Elijah the Tishbite, who was of the inhabitants of Gilead, said unto Ahab, As the LORD God of Israel liveth, before whom I stand, there shall not be dew nor rain these years, but according to my word.

It was according to what the prophet declared.


You blaspheme Jesus by denying He is God. It's really sad.

 

[Runningman]

1 Kings 17:1
And Elijah the Tishbite, who was of the inhabitants of Gilead, said unto Ahab, As the LORD God of Israel liveth, before whom I stand, there shall not be dew nor rain these years, but according to my word.

It was according to what the prophet declared.


Your heresy blasphemes Jesus Christ everyday. I don't need anything from those who espouse such disgusting heresy. It's vomit.

So people can say that they will do something without actually needing to do it. It doesn't mean Jesus Christ is a liar as you seem to believe now, evidenced by your curses you've hurled toward him tonight.

While speaking against Jesus is forgivable, I still recommend you repent. Jesus will deny those who deny him to God. You're not going to like what happens after that. Though you're a theological catastrophe and an idolater, that, too, is pardonable. You don't really want to cross the line just because you are in full disagreement with the teachings of Jesus.

All of the gospels show that Jesus spoke of his resurrection in a purely prophetic sense not as something he would actually perform himself.

Mark 8:3​

"And he began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes and be killed, and after three days rise again."​

​

Matthew 16:21​

"From that time Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised."​

​

Luke 9:22​

"The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised."​

​

Mark 10:33-34​

"See, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and the scribes, and they will condemn him to death and deliver him over to the Gentiles. And they will mock him and spit on him, and flog him and kill him. And after three days he will rise."​

​

Matthew 12:39-40​

"But he answered them, 'An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.'"​

 

[Fred]

So people can say that they will do something without actually needing to do it.

It's at his word.

 

[Runningman]

It's at his word.

No one in the Bible agrees with you.

 

[Fred]

No one in the Bible agrees with you.

You don't accurately speak for them.

 

[Runningman]

You don't accurately speak for them.

You don't know Jesus. You seem to have this kind of pagan superman idea of Jesus. Jesus is a man who was totally empowered by God, not God himself. Even Jesus prayed and begged for God to save him from death. Not to be saved from physical death, but permanent death. Jesus was resurrected by God the Father as the entire body of Scripture testifies.

Hebrews 5
7During the days of Jesus’ earthly life, He offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the One who could save Him from death, and He was heard because of His reverence.

 

[Fred]

You don't

It's fun ignoring and skipping over almost everything you write.

I know it's going to be garbage anyway, so I don't bother with it.

You've ignored and/or evaded what I have asked you in the past.

 

[Runningman]

It's fun ignoring and skipping over almost everything you write.

I know it's going to be garbage anyway, so I don't bother with it.

You've ignored and/or evaded what I have asked you in the past.

Your replies are mostly meaningless and of no substance. Makes my thoughtful, Scriptural, replies stand out better. Thank you.

 

[Fred]

Your replies are mostly meaningless and of no substance.

The above just makes no sense at all.

Makes my thoughtful, Scriptural, replies stand out better. Thank you.

That's delusional.


Your OP is a disater.

 

[Runningman]

The above just makes no sense at all.





That's delusional.


Your OP is a disater.

I have the scriptural high ground and I am dominating. You're a lone wolf in this thread mostly just making a distraction because you can't address the OP.

 

[Fred]

I have the scriptural high ground and I am dominating.

Wow. How unimpressive.

Make sure you stand in front of the mirror while hitting your fist against your chest as you keep telling yourself that.

 

[Runningman]

Wow. How unimpressive.

Make sure you stand in front of the mirror while hitting your fist against your chest as you keep telling yourself that.

I really want to get back to actual Bible discussion instead of the drama you bring to this forum. With all due respect, I do not care about your opinions. If you can't get back on track I am putting you on ignore.

 

[Fred]

I really want to get back to actual Bible discussion instead of the drama you bring to this forum.

Tell yourself that from post 31.

 

[Runningman]

Let's begin where we left off. Looking forward to anyone actually replying seriously.

All of the gospels show that Jesus spoke of his resurrection in a purely prophetic sense not as something he would actually perform himself.

Mark 8:3​

"And he began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes and be killed, and after three days rise again."​

​

Matthew 16:21​

"From that time Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised."​

​

Luke 9:22​

"The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised."​

​

Mark 10:33-34​

"See, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and the scribes, and they will condemn him to death and deliver him over to the Gentiles. And they will mock him and spit on him, and flog him and kill him. And after three days he will rise."​

​

Matthew 12:39-40​

"But he answered them, 'An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.'"​

 

[Fred]

All of the gospels show that Jesus spoke of his resurrection in a purely prophetic sense not as something he would actually perform himself.

John 2:19-21 proves otherwise.

Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (TDNT): The idea of the self-resurrection of Jesus is first found in Johannine theology (Jn. 2:19, 21; 10:17, 18) (2:335, egeirō, Oepke).

 

[Runningman]

John 2:19-21 proves otherwise.

Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (TDNT): The idea of the self-resurrection of Jesus is first found in Johannine theology (Jn. 2:19, 21; 10:17, 18) (2:335, egeirō, Oepke).

Thanks for getting back on track Fred! So since all of the precedent regarding Jesus' resurrection is prophetic and no one mentioned Jesus resurrecting himself after he died, then you have only provided further support for this OP. What you have provided is prophecy.

To prove it isn't actually something Jesus would do, simply see John 2:22:

John 2
22After He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this. Then they believed the Scripture and the word that Jesus had spoken.

John recalled what Jesus said, not as something Jesus would do to himself, but rather something that would happen to him. Hence John spoke of the resurrection in the passive voice; meaning John is saying that the resurrection was performed on Jesus rather than something Jesus did to himself. Check out the Greek, it's not debateable. Don't forget the entire Bible speaks of Jesus' resurrection as something he didn't do.

Conclusion: Jesus didn't resurrect Jesus, but God resurrected Jesus. Means Jesus isn't God. The Trinity is false.

 

[Fred]

Thanks for getting back on track Fred!

Something you never did here:

F

Thread 'The Unitarian challenge for those who deny Jesus is Almighty God'

Sep 10, 2023

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/i-wish-i-were-a-unitarian.617/#post-15606

This thread is from what I discussed in the link above. Unfortunately, the one to whom I was addressing evaded this issue, so if any other Unitarian (those who deny the Lord Jesus is Almighty God) can defend their belief I would be interested in seeing to whom they apply the following passages to.

The Father or the Lord Jesus?
Matthew 10:28 (Him)

John 7:18 (He is true, and there is no unrighteousness in Him)

Acts 1:24 (Lord)
Acts 2:20 (Lord)
Acts 2:21 (Lord)
Acts 2:25 (Lord)
Acts...

• Fred
• Replies: 113
• Forum: The Trinity

• 
• 

So since all of the precedent regarding Jesus' resurrection is prophetic and no one mentioned Jesus resurrecting himself after he died, then you have only provided further support for this OP. What you have provided is prophecy.

To prove it isn't actually something Jesus would do, simply see John 2:22:

John 2
22After He was raised from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this. Then they believed the Scripture and the word that Jesus had spoken.

Verse 22 proves the raising was done by Jesus from verse 19.

 

[Runningman]

Something you never did here:

F

Thread 'The Unitarian challenge for those who deny Jesus is Almighty God'

Sep 10, 2023

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/i-wish-i-were-a-unitarian.617/#post-15606

This thread is from what I discussed in the link above. Unfortunately, the one to whom I was addressing evaded this issue, so if any other Unitarian (those who deny the Lord Jesus is Almighty God) can defend their belief I would be interested in seeing to whom they apply the following passages to.

The Father or the Lord Jesus?
Matthew 10:28 (Him)

John 7:18 (He is true, and there is no unrighteousness in Him)

Acts 1:24 (Lord)
Acts 2:20 (Lord)
Acts 2:21 (Lord)
Acts 2:25 (Lord)
Acts...

• Fred
• Replies: 113
• Forum: The Trinity

• 
• 

Verse 22 proves the raising was done by Jesus from verse 19.

So you don't actually have any Scriptural backing to support your opinion of John 2:19-21.

1. John didn't agree that Jesus resurrected himself in John 2:22
2. The rest of the gospels speak of Jesus' resurrection in a prophetic sense
3. The rest of the Bible doesn't mention Jesus resurrecting himself

This seems to be an open and shut case. No wonder so few people have engaged this thread; they simply cannot provide a Scriptural rebuttal becasue the Trinitarian opinion regarding the resurrection of Jesus is a one-verse-wonder!

Yet in the Unitarian perspective, we enjoy the entire Bible that describes the resurrection of Jesus as being something God did, not something Jesus did.

 

[Fred]

So you don't actually have any Scriptural backing to support your opinion of John 2:19-21.

John 2:19-21 is Scriptural support.