brightfame52
Well-known member
Not in the kjv, and what version has the word trinity ?
Refuting effectually caused faith
- Thread starter TomL
- Start date
The KJV is not the only translation and the trinity is taught and the verses proving it can be quoted.
You on the other hand have no verses to support your claims.
Pancho Frijoles
Well-known member
Coming back to the OP, the two concepts are not in conflict.
God expect from us to use our free will to make the right choices.
God's irresistible grace does not suppress our free will. The Holy Spirit persuades us.
So, all praise is to God. He gave us free will, and he persuaded us to love Him through the One He Sent to earth.
In the same way we choose to drink Coca Cola without being forced to do it, God persuade us with his "All Knowing, All Powerful Divine Marketing" to drink from the water of eternal life.
Persuasion is not irresistible and The bible does not teach irresistible grace
2 Thessalonians 2:10 (KJV 1900) — 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
Acts 7:51 (KJV 1900) — 51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Im not concerned about other translations, so its not in the kjv. Show me the word Trinity in the scripture., quote the verses
Which proves nothing at all
brightfame52
Well-known member
It proves its not in the kjv, yet scripture teaches God is sovereign, without a verse literally saying it.
brightfame52
Well-known member
They do because they feel they see something in scripture, and so added the word they feel they see. Thats the very thing you are condemning for, so thats hypocritically inconsistent.
Sorry but you cannot show the thing you claim.
Do you want to dispute those other translations?
Pancho Frijoles
Well-known member
Hi, TomL
I think I get your point and I agree.
Certainly, people can resist God's love and grace and we observe it every single day.
But this is in the short term, from our extremely limited human perspective.
We see people doing evil things, and we think "That man is resisting God's call/grace". And we are right.
What I understand, though, is that God's love and grace is irresistible in the long run.
In the long run, God always wins. His plans are not frustrated. As Paul says in 1 Corinthians, the enemies are placed at the feet of Christ and taken as "prisoners" to God (this is an analogy of what the generals of armies did with prisoners. They took them to the King to convert them into servants of the King). Then God becomes everything in everyone.
That's why I like to take as an example Coca-Cola.
Is the marketing of Coca-Cola irresistible? Not in one sense. But in another sense, it has overcome the resistance of perhaps more than 50% of world population (25% of the ones who drink it at least once a year).
brightfame52
Well-known member
Nah you just cant see the truth
You don't know what the truth is and present error
Taking one as prisoner is not the same as making them your friend
Pancho Frijoles
Well-known member
You're right.
Torturing enemies do not make them friends.
Annihilating enemies do not make them friends.
God has his own methods to make them friends. None of them violates their free will.
brightfame52
Well-known member
The Faith of Gods Elect
Not only is Faith effectually caused but its peculiar to and only caused in Gods Elect. Titus 1:1
Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;
Paul, servant of God and messenger of Jesus Christ in the faith God gives to his chosen, in the knowledge of the truth that comes from a God-fearing life, and in the hope of the everlasting life which God, who cannot lie, promised before the beginning of time—(at the right moment he made his Word known in the declaration which has been entrusted to me by his command) to Titus, my true son in our common faith, be grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our saviour.Phillips Translation
Peter in writing to Gods Elect, writes 1 Pet 1:1-2
Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
Its the elect that will be caused to be obedient to the Faith or this verse could read,
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto Faith and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
2 Pet 1:1
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them[Elect] that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
Not only is Faith effectually caused but its peculiar to and only caused in Gods Elect. Titus 1:1
Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;
Paul, servant of God and messenger of Jesus Christ in the faith God gives to his chosen, in the knowledge of the truth that comes from a God-fearing life, and in the hope of the everlasting life which God, who cannot lie, promised before the beginning of time—(at the right moment he made his Word known in the declaration which has been entrusted to me by his command) to Titus, my true son in our common faith, be grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ our saviour.Phillips Translation
Peter in writing to Gods Elect, writes 1 Pet 1:1-2
Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
Its the elect that will be caused to be obedient to the Faith or this verse could read,
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto Faith and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
2 Pet 1:1
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them[Elect] that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
brightfame52
Well-known member
. All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.” Jn.6:37.
This sets forth effectually caused Faith for the Elect. The Elect are the ones given to Christ by the Father, and it is promised they shall come to Christ or believe in Him !
They shall come denotes they shall be caused to come and believe !
This sets forth effectually caused Faith for the Elect. The Elect are the ones given to Christ by the Father, and it is promised they shall come to Christ or believe in Him !
They shall come denotes they shall be caused to come and believe !
Believe
Active member
just kidding
LOL
Behold
Well-known member
You are accusing God of being a Calvinist, or a Hyper Calvinist, when you state "GOD's Irresistible Grace".
We always find that Calvinists and Hyper Calvinist, try to express their understanding of God and God's Salvation as Calvinism.
= Thats an eternal FAIL.
God is not a Calvinist.
God's Grace is an offer of Christ on the Cross, and the Holy Spirit reveals the offer.
God does not "irresistibly force you to believe"or "force you to have faith.... and this "doctrine of Devil's falsely teaches.
