Mark 16:16~"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
- Thread starter Red Baker
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Truther
Well-known member
Correct, my church is the church of 3000.
Lily
Active member
Not necessarily the bible says this about that.
At the end of the Gospel of Matthew, Jesus gave his disciples the following commission:
“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. Go, therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to follow all that I commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” Matt. 28:18-20
Now don't go adding to the scripture or taking away from it. It says in the name of the father and "the son" in the holy spirit. It doesn't say Jesus. If Jesus wanted to say Jesus he could have easily have just said "in my name."
Lily
Active member
You mean like the devil made me do it? So now we're going from drunkenness to habitual sin. Okay What does God's word In Jeremiah 17 say about that?
"The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked; who can know it?" I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.
Blaming demonic spirits just doesn't work?
"The natural heart of man is desperately corrupt; incurably sick." It is so bad, so evil, it cannot be salvaged by repairing it! It must be completely replaced. This is what the conversion process - our calling, repentance, justification, and sanctification - accomplishes.
One of the bad things about Recovering from alcohol or alcoholism is that little thing called relapse. I think the bible calls it a dog returning to its vomit.
This can also happen. Matthew 12
An Unclean Spirit Returns
…44Then it says, ‘I will return to the house I left.’ On its return, it finds the house vacant, swept clean, and put in order. 45Then it goes and brings with it seven other spirits more wicked than itself, and they go in and dwell there; and the final plight of that man is worse than the first. So will it be with this wicked generation.”
Who said you have to be immersed?
Truther
Well-known member
Which is fulfilled via....
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Truther
Well-known member
No, if you sin, you open yourself to demons.
This is why when Jesus cast them out he said "go and sin no more".
Demons are like cats...stop feeding them and they go elsewhere.
Horatius
Member
"Go and sin no more" is a phrase used by Jesus in the Bible. It appears twice in the Gospels, once after Jesus healed the man by the Pool of Bethesda (John 5:14) and the other after He rescued the woman caught in adultery from getting stoned to death (John 8:11)
In both instances there is no mention of demons. Sin includes a failure to do what is right. But sin also offends people; it is violence and lovelessness toward other people, and ultimately, rebellion against God. Further, the Bible teaches that sin involves a condition in which the heart is corrupted and inclined toward evil. The concept of sin is complex, and the terminology large and varied so that it may be best to look at the reality of sin in the Pentateuch first, then reflect theologically.
You can't look for a demon under every rock.
Your last sentence"
Demons are like cats...stop feeding them and they go elsewhere.
So what is it? First it was...We sin because we're influenced by demons? Now it's we're only being oppressed by demons because we're feeding them with our sins.
Truther
Well-known member
We sin, then demons see our weakness to repetition. Then they get involved to drive us deeper into those sins.
Extreme example is Dobson interview with Bundy.
Bundy started with porn and he said a demon approached him to take it further and further. He said he felt like a monster was in him.
Truther
Well-known member
I can say that when I was baptized in the name of Jesus I was instantly delivered from smoking and drinking etc. It was awesome and strange to me at the same time. To be delivered from sin via baptism in the name of Jesus Christ is a power boost for walking with God and minimizing exposure to sin and condemnation.
Horatius
Member
Let's see what you're saying but actually Old Ted Wouldn't be someone I would go to for biblical advice. For sure he was demon possessed. It slipped out one time in the courtroom when someone said something he didn't like he instantly turned into a monster. People that have had experience with demon possessed people usually make a comment about them having dead eyes.
But those people are the exception. Your everyday average Joe is not being made to sin by a demon. Human beings that aren't saved don't need any help it comes naturally.
Horatius
Member
I'm glad things work for you the way they did. Not everybody's experience is the same as yours. Some people have a different salvation experience. Yours was most likely just the right one for you. I think when God delivers people the way that you describe happening to you God may have a special purpose and a mission for you. And for sure you can do it all in the name of Jesus. Did you know in the name of Jesus we have the victory? Want me to hum a few bars. No, I'm sure you know it. In the name of Jesus demons will have to flee.
In the name of Jesus, in the name of Jesus,
we have the victory.
In the name of Jesus, in the name of Jesus,
Satan, you have to flee.
Oh, what can ever stand before us
when we call on that great name?
Jesus, Jesus, precious Jesus,
we have the victory.
In the name of Jesus, in the name of Jesus,
we have the victory.
In the name of Jesus, in the name of Jesus,
Satan, you have to flee.
Oh, Tell me, who can stand before us
when we call on that great name?
Jesus, Jesus, precious Jesus,
we have the victory.
Truther
Well-known member
I never said demons make anybody do anything. What I’ve always known is that they will fan the flames of someone’s sins. If someone get too sinful they will enter them or oppress them. I think we’re thinking the same thing.
Truther
Well-known member
Absolutely awesome. That is the best post I’ve seen in years. Praise God and thank you for that song.
Tom, you should be asking who came up with sprinkling as a scriptural baptism
God chose water baptism for those who love Him to give Him the answer of a good conscience (Ist Pet 3:21). Without scripture revealing it, we could never know this ordinance of identifying with Jesus Christ for salvation. It occupies a major place in the New Testament, and how it is to be performed and upon whom is clearly described. It is an elementary but essential part of Christianity.
But man has corrupted baptism like everything else, so that of 2.5 billion nominal professing Christians on earth today, less than 5% practice baptism properly. What a travesty! Its glorious "three-fold" symbolism of death and resurrection is destroyed. Its answer to God is replaced with an infant ritual unknown in scripture~or, sprinkling adults, which also is unknown in God's word, etc. Are you truly baptized? Do you understand its significance? Is God pleased by your answer? Consider:
Requirements for a Scriptural Baptism
Proper Administrator
The Scriptures require that the man who baptizes be a disciple of Jesus Christ. This point is easily confirmed by reviewing the record of the early church in the book of Acts~Acts 9:10~"And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord." This disciple baptized Paul.Proper Subject
The Scriptures teach that an individual to be baptized must first repent and believe the gospel. This requires the subject to be of sufficient age to comprehend the essential elements of the gospel and agree with them and be willing to commit themselves to follow the rellgion of Jesús Christ. . The Scriptures know nothing of baptizing infants and there is no proof where young people were baptized since many of them are still following their sinful lust and trying to figure out their ever changing body. The subject of baptism must have an active, sincere and good conscience in order to give answer. Acts 8:36-38~"And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him."Proper Doctrine
The essential elements of the gospel that must be believed prior to baptism center around the Lord Jesus Christ and His role as the Son of God and the only Saviour from sin. It is the Person of Jesus Christ that is the basis of true doctrine. As we just considered above.Proper Mode
Baptism is an immersion of the subject completely under water. This is done to represent (show a likeness or figure of) the burial and resurrection of Christ, which put away our sins. As everyone knows, a thing is neither buried nor planted with only a sprinkling. Baptism must provide a figure of the resurrection of Christ, which is only done by immersion. Philip and the eunuch both into the water!Proper Design
Baptism does not put away sin. It is only a figure of how our sins were put away by Christ’s death and resurrection. Baptism is simply an answer and testimony to God for what He did by Himself. It is the answer toward God of a conscience made good by the blood of Christ. 1st peter 3:21.Are Household Baptisms in the New Testament an Evidence of the Baptism of Infants?
No! In the case of the Philippian jailor, all those in his house were taught the gospel and believed the gospel (Acts 16:31-34); so in agreement with our Lord’s commission, the salvation offered by Paul to his house was secured by believing first and then being baptized (Mark 16:16).No! In the case of Lydia, there is no evidence the woman was even married or had any infant children (Acts 16:14-15), for “household” can easily refer to domestic servants or other employees in distinction to children (Gen 18:19; Acts 10:7; Matthew 10:25, etc.
I will close with this~there may be certain circumstances where one cannot be baptized~baptism is not essential to regeneration, it only has practical benefits attached to it, nothing more. Mark 16:16 already discussed in this thread.
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First of all, who said that cigarettes and alcohol is sin? Jesus never taught such, only phariseeism teaches such things as a way of being holy in God's sight. Have you never so much as read this?
Mark 7:18-23~"And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him; Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats? And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man."
There may be certain thing from without a man entering into him that may hinder his health in the long run, but nothing can defile us spiritually from without entering into our bodies, not one thing! Not wine or strong drink, and certain not cigarettes, or meats. etc. Wine or strong drink in moderation is permitted, by God's word. More on this later, if anyone would like to discuss this. So, your instant deliverance may only changed you into a modern day Pharisee, that I do not know, you must decide by being honest to yourself and that by using the scriptures.
There is no deliverance from sin through water baptism in Jesus' name~not the presence of sin which still lives with each and every child of God in their old man, which they are commanded to put off. Not the power of sin, for its mystery is ever at work daily tempting the very best of God's children. We are delivered completely from the penalty of sin through the Lord Jesús Christ body dying for our sins and being raised again by the power of God. We are dead the condemnation of God's law through Jesus Christ. There is NOW no condemnation to them which are IN Christ Jesus, not shall there ever be any condemantion.
Baptism in Jesus' name, does not minimize exposure to sin, you have no clue about what you are saying~and certainly no scriptural support. Which you never provided because you cannot provide. Plus, no one can minimize exposure to condemnation~one either is under God's condemnation or either one is atoll free of all condemnation through Jesus Christ's obedience and faith. to God's law for those for whom he was a surety for.
Typo error~either one is totally free of all condemnation, or he is not free of ANY sin. There is no middle ground, or being half way.
"No condemnation, how could be that this sweet message is meant for me
No condemnation how and when, the word is clearly written NOW!"
Fellow Traveler
Active member
I don't believe smoking cigarettes are sin either. I've never smoked, I just can't stand the smell of them. I heard somebody say one time that smoking cigarettes won't keep a Christian out of heaven it'll just make it smell like hell when they get there.
Same thing with alcohol. I don't think drinking in moderation Is a problem. But drunkenness is a different story.
Galatians 5:19–21: "The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: ... drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God." Ephesians 5:18: "Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery.
Truther
Well-known member
So are you saying that my experience of being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of my sins in 1979 and instantly losing the desire to drink and smoke cigarettes, including the desire to use the Lord‘s name in vain, etc., and control my other passions was not real? I had no idea I was going to be able to walk away from all that. I guess you don’t believe in deliverance ministry, huh?
Do you know that Christians had their own Egypt bonds of sinning to deal with? They had their own pharaoh devil etc to deal with. They had their own red sea deliverance, which is a type of water baptism in the name of Jesus? They had their own shouting on the other side experience, which is a type of receiving the Holy Ghost? do you believe in any of that?
Truther
Well-known member
Does anybody on this forum realize that the types and shadows of Israel during Egyptian bondage are a type of the Christian experience? Does anybody realize that there are types and shadows in the same manner of the tabernacle orchestration?
To say that you are saved without repenting and being baptized in the name of Jesus and receiving the Holy Ghost as a plan of salvation is rejecting the entire Red Sea experience.
Also, in the tabernacle, the priest killed the animal…Jesus died…and we die.
The priest washed at the laver…Jesus was baptized…and we are baptized.
The priest entered into the holiest of holies…Jesus passed the veil…and we pass the veil by receiving the Holy Ghost. All of this is done by obeying Acts 2:38.
Unless we follow Jesus, this particular way through his death, burial, and resurrection then we are not in the priesthood of God today.
To say that you are saved without repenting and being baptized in the name of Jesus and receiving the Holy Ghost as a plan of salvation is rejecting the entire Red Sea experience.
Also, in the tabernacle, the priest killed the animal…Jesus died…and we die.
The priest washed at the laver…Jesus was baptized…and we are baptized.
The priest entered into the holiest of holies…Jesus passed the veil…and we pass the veil by receiving the Holy Ghost. All of this is done by obeying Acts 2:38.
Unless we follow Jesus, this particular way through his death, burial, and resurrection then we are not in the priesthood of God today.
