Jesus denied being God

[Runningman]

The Father denied being God, and never once said " I am God " .

see how easy it is to make an argument from silence lol.

and BTW- Jesus in saying why tallest Me good was making the point He is God in the narrative as I pointed out. So your OP is nothing but a failure and based upon a false presupposition.

How would the Father deny being God when the Father is Himself the only true God? (John 17:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6, Ephesians 4:6, 1 John 5:20)

Furthermore, there is a direct 1:1 correlation between the Father being YHWH and YHWH saying He is God. Therefore the Father said he is God. Jesus never dared to say such a thing. Actually, Jesus flatout denied it in Mark 10:18.

Psalm 2​

7I will proclaim the decree​

spoken to Me by the LORD:​

“You are My Son;​

today I have become Your Father.​

​

Isaiah 45​

5I am the LORD, and there is no other;​

there is no God but Me.​

I will equip you for battle,​

though you have not known Me,​

 

[Runningman]

Since each Person of the Trinity is “God” then the name “God” can be assigned to anyone of the Three Persons, this time to the Father in Acts 3:13. This is so simple a concept that only a Judaizer will refuse to understand it.

Doctrines don't explain what the Bible says but here you are beginning with your stories and then finding Scripture to support them. A classic case of the cart in front of the horse. Begin with Scripture first and then the Trinity is nonexistent.

So you're saying that it's not God that is speaking in Ex 3 even though He did in fact say that He is God? Boy, you are going up against God Himself here. The "Angel" reference is the Narrators reference. Furthermore, when Prophets would speak for God they would preface their statements with "thus says the Lord". There is no such thing here. You are therefore, going up against God's statement here. Do you really want to misrepresent God for the purposes of propping up your Judaizing ideas?

Correct the angel is not God and never said he is God. Where did you see that? Not going up against God, but I will go up against you for sure. Put up some Scripture about where the angel said he is God.

 

[Runningman]

You believe Jesus was the result of God having intercourse?

With whom did he beget him?

I thought you argue he was created not begotten

Created and begotten. All begotten have a beginning point just like all created have a beginning point. The error in yours is if Jesus was not begotten then the Bible is in gross error and should have never said he is begotten.

however

John 1:18 (ESV) — 18 No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father’s side, he has made him known.

John 1:18 (NIV) — 18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.

John 1:18 (NASB 2020) — 18 No one has seen God at any time; God the only Son, who is in the arms of the Father, He has explained Him.

Monogenos carries a meaning of unique one of a kind, only

Monogenos also means only-begotten. Changing it to your version only introduces more contradictions into Scripture. For example, if no one has seen God then Jesus hasn't seen God and no one has seen Jesus. That's wrong.

Secondly, this is numerically two Gods in your version. Now you have a polytheism problem to deal with.

The word for begotten in Hebrews 1:5 refers to offspring in the sense of procreation Let's see you have fun Scripture-twisting your way out of that one.

My Bible Word Study




LEMMA
μονογενής monogenēs one and only; only; only-begotten; unique; alone
LXGNTLEX one and only; only
LXLXXLEX only-begotten; unique; alone
BAGD
GELNT
TDNT
VCEDONTW
ESL
Louw-Nida unique, only
MGLNT only, only begotten
DBL Greek unique
WSNTDICT
LXGRCANLEX one and only; only; one and only
NASB Dictionaries only begotten
MCEDONTW only-begotten; only-born; unique
VEDONTW
LSJ the only member of a kin; kind; only, single
LEH LXX Lexicon the only member of a kin, only-begotten, only; id.; alone in its kind, one only
IGEL only-begotten; single; one and the same
TDNTA
BEDBW
CDWGTHB only-born; sole; only (begotten, child)
PLGNT
LALS only-begotten; unique; alone; יָחִיד; only; lonely, deserted
STGHD only-born

same here

John 3:16 (ESV) — 16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 3:16 (NIV) — 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

John 3:16 (NASB 2020) — 16 “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish, but have eternal life.

Only-begotten Son.

BTW the phrase from Heb 1:5 appears here also

Acts 13:33 (KJV 1900) — 33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.

These versions refer to procreation. There's your proof Jesus was created as the Son at his resurrection.

 

[Runningman]

Nope It is my position Jesus was both man and God. As a man he could and did die

but you are still left with the fact he is called the first and the last the same as Yahweh


and scripture

Revelation 1:7–8 (KJV 1900) — 7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. 8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Revelation 1:17–18 (KJV 1900) — 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

So the first and last died according to Revelation 1:18

YHWH is the first and last and He didn't die.

So First and Last doesn't make someone is God. It's a title referring to category, a common scholarly opinion by the way, and Jesus and YHWH are not in the same category.

1 Timothy 6:14–16 (KJV 1900) — 14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ: 15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; 16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

Jesus Christ is the near antecedant but see also

That's not Jesus. For one, it says Jesus will she who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords. So Jesus didn't show that already when he came? Then he is not the only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lord.

Two, Jesus doesn't alone have immortality. Immortality means that someone cannot die ever. Yes, Jesus is immortal now, but he isn't alone. Jesus was given eternal life by God. God is the one who alone is immortal whereas Jesus already died according to Revelation 1:18.

Many people already saw Jesus even after he went to heaven.

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Jesus is clearly the king of kings and the lord of lords

Where did you read that? Where did you get the idea this is Jesus?

You need to give this one up

Jesus is plainly the king of kings and the lord of lords

Verse?

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Word order is different.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

That's the Father. I already provided plenty of Scripture to support this.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Jesus is good and others are also good, but no one is good except God alone. Jesus denied having absolute goodness therefore he denied being God.

CHuckle!!! pathetic!!! Jesus WAS A FULLY HUMAN MAN, with all the limitations and blind spots that HUMANITY imposes. However He was ALSO the human embodiment of "THE WORD" who was God. Jesus denied nothing - your "Theology" does.

 

[TomL]

So the first and last died according to Revelation 1:18

Yes and it is scripture and cannot be broken

Revelation 1:17–18 (KJV 1900) — 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

YHWH is the first and last and He didn't die.

Jesus is the first and last and he did die

Revelation 1:17–18 (KJV 1900) — 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

and the coming one

Revelation 22:12–13 (NASB 2020) — 12 “Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to reward each one as his work deserves. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.”

So First and Last doesn't make someone is God. It's a title referring to category, a common scholarly opinion by the way, and Jesus and YHWH are not in the same category.

False reasoning

Christ in his humanity died not in his deity

That's not Jesus. For one, it says Jesus will she who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords. So Jesus didn't show that already when he came? Then he is not the only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lord.

Are you going to ignore these

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

which plainly note Jesus is the king of kings and the lord of lords?

Two, Jesus doesn't alone have immortality. Immortality means that someone cannot die ever. Yes, Jesus is immortal now, but he isn't alone. Jesus was given eternal life by God. God is the one who alone is immortal whereas Jesus already died according to Revelation 1:18.

In his deity Jesus did not die

and this is scripture

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Many people already saw Jesus even after he went to heaven.

Where did you read that? Where did you get the idea this is Jesus?

Verse?

again

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

So even if youn want to deny the verse in Timothy

You are still stuck with those two in revelation.

You you are really one who believes scripture you are going to have to admit

Jesus is both first and last and kingof all kings and lord of all lords possessing the same titles as Yahweh

 

[TomL]

Created and begotten. All begotten have a beginning point just like all created have a beginning point. The error in yours is if Jesus was not begotten then the Bible is in gross error and should have never said he is begotten.

Sorry big difference between created and begotten

Find a verse you think actually states Jesus was created

I can note he created all things

Colossians 1:16 (NASB 2020) — 16 for by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominions, or rulers, or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.

and without him nothing was created

Colossians 1:16 (NASB 2020) — 16 for by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominions, or rulers, or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.

which is sufficient in itself to show he was not a created being

Monogenos also means only-begotten. Changing it to your version only introduces more contradictions into Scripture. For example, if no one has seen God then Jesus hasn't seen God and no one has seen Jesus. That's wrong.

Um lexical evidence shows more

My Bible Word Study

Lemma

μονογενής monogenēs one and only; only; only-begotten; unique; alone

LXGNTLEX one and only; only

LXLXXLEX only-begotten; unique; alone

BAGD

GELNT

TDNT

VCEDONTW

ESL

Louw-Nida unique, only

MGLNT only, only begotten

DBL Greek unique

WSNTDICT

LXGRCANLEX one and only; only; one and only

NASB Dictionaries only begotten

MCEDONTW only-begotten; only-born; unique

VEDONTW

LSJ the only member of a kin; kind; only, single

LEH LXX Lexicon the only member of a kin, only-begotten, only; id.; alone in its kind, one only

IGEL only-begotten; single; one and the same

TDNTA

BEDBW

CDWGTHB only-born; sole; only (begotten, child)

PLGNT

LALS only-begotten; unique; alone; יָחִיד; only; lonely, deserted

STGHD only-born

Are yoiu going to ignore the lexical evidence

Secondly, this is numerically two Gods in your version. Now you have a polytheism problem to deal with.

Nope I believe they are one being

But your watchtower claims he is a small g god

You have a big God and a smaller god

An almighty god and a mighty god

So it is the watchtower which teaches polytheism

And this day I have begotten you refers to the resurrection here

Acts 13:30–33 (UASV) — 30 But God raised him from the dead, 31 and for many days he appeared to those who had come up with him from Galilee to Jerusalem, who are now his witnesses to the people. 32 So we are declaring to you the good news about the promise made to the forefathers, 33 that God has fulfilled this promise to our children in that he raised up Jesus, as it is also written in the second Psalm, “ ‘You are my Son, today I have begotten you.’

 

[synergy]

Doctrines don't explain what the Bible says but here you are beginning with your stories and then finding Scripture to support them. A classic case of the cart in front of the horse. Begin with Scripture first and then the Trinity is nonexistent.

You're projecting the shortcomings and logical failures of your Judaizing stories. You tend to project alot. You should look into remedying that nasty habit of yours.

Correct the angel is not God and never said he is God. Where did you see that? Not going up against God, but I will go up against you for sure. Put up some Scripture about where the angel said he is God.

Ex 3:6 Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.

Now, it's time to get the popcorn.

 

[Runningman]

CHuckle!!! pathetic!!! Jesus WAS A FULLY HUMAN MAN, with all the limitations and blind spots that HUMANITY imposes. However He was ALSO the human embodiment of "THE WORD" who was God. Jesus denied nothing - your "Theology" does.

The Word in John 1:1 isn't the definite God in the Greek. Can you deny that?

Strong's	Greek	English	Morphology
1722 [e]	Ἐν En	In [the]	Prep
746 [e]	ἀρχῇ archē	beginning	N-DFS
1510 [e]	ἦν ēn	was	V-IIA-3S
3588 [e]	ὁ ho	the	Art-NMS
3056 [e]	Λόγος, Logos	Word,	N-NMS
2532 [e]	καὶ kai	and	Conj
3588 [e]	ὁ ho	the	Art-NMS
3056 [e]	Λόγος Logos	Word	N-NMS
1510 [e]	ἦν ēn	was	V-IIA-3S
4314 [e]	πρὸς pros	with	Prep
3588 [e]	τὸν ton	-	Art-AMS
2316 [e]	Θεόν, Theon	God,	N-AMS
2532 [e]	καὶ kai	and	Conj
2316 [e]	Θεὸς Theos	God	N-NMS
1510 [e]	ἦν ēn	was	V-IIA-3S
3588 [e]	ὁ ho	the	Art-NMS
3056 [e]	Λόγος. Logos	Word.	N-NMS

 

[Runningman]

You're projecting the shortcomings and logical failures of your Judaizing stories. You tend to project alot. You should look into remedying that nasty habit of yours.

Ex 3:6 Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.

Let's make this easier for you since quoting Acts 3:13 didn't help.

Person 1 = God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob
Person 2 = God's servant Jesus

Person 1 is not person 2. Correct?

Acts 3​

13The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified His servant Jesus.​

Jesus spoke of the God of Abraham, etc, in the third person after quoting Him:

Matthew 22​

32‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living.”​

All of this plainly means that Jesus isn't the God of Abraham by his own words.

Now read Exodus 3:14,15. Jesus isn't the I AM.

Exodus 3​

14God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ ”​

​

15God also told Moses, “Say to the Israelites, ‘The LORD, the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you.’ This is My name forever, and this is how I am to be remembered in every generation.​

Yes this proves Jesus isn't YHWH, isn't the I AM, etc.

Now, it's time to get the popcorn.

Get it and enjoy! I am!

 

[Runningman]

Yes and it is scripture and cannot be broken

Revelation 1:17–18 (KJV 1900) — 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.


Jesus is the first and last and he did die

Revelation 1:17–18 (KJV 1900) — 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

and the coming one

Revelation 22:12–13 (NASB 2020) — 12 “Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to reward each one as his work deserves. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.”





False reasoning

Christ in his humanity died not in his deity


Are you going to ignore these

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

which plainly note Jesus is the king of kings and the lord of lords?


In his deity Jesus did not die

and this is scripture

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

again

Revelation 17:14 (KJV 1900) — 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 19:13–16 (KJV 1900) — 13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

So even if youn want to deny the verse in Timothy

You are still stuck with those two in revelation.

You you are really one who believes scripture you are going to have to admit

Jesus is both first and last and kingof all kings and lord of all lords possessing the same titles as Yahweh

I see you're just going to keep repeating the same things since you have done so for atleast two comments now. Let's go ahead and take your toys away. Ready for most of the titles Jesus and God don't share with each other? Let's do it.

Jesus isn't the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob:

Acts 3
13The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified His servant Jesus.

Matthew 22
32‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living.”

Jesus isn't the only true God:

John 17
3Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.

Jesus isn't the Lord of heaven and earth:

Matt 11
25At that time Jesus declared, “I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because You have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.

Acts 17
24The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples made by human hands. 25Nor is He served by human hands, as if He needed anything, because He Himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else.

Jesus isn't the Holy Spirit:

Matt 12
32Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the one to come.

Jesus isn't the Lord God Almighty:

Revelation 1
8“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, who is and was and is to come—the Almighty.

Revelation 21
22But I saw no temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

Jesus isn't YHWH:
Psalm 2
7I will proclaim the decree spoken to Me by the LORD: “You are My Son; today I have become Your Father.

Psalm 110
1The LORD[YHWH] said to my Lord:[Jesus]
“Sit at My right hand
until I make Your enemies
a footstool for Your feet.

Jesus isn't the Sovereign Lord and Creator:

Acts 4
24When the believers heard this, they lifted up their voices to God with one accord. “Sovereign Lord,” they said, “You made the heaven and the earth and the sea and everything in them.
27...Your holy servant Jesus, whom You anointed.

Jesus, the Lamb, is not Lord God Almighty:

Revelation 21
22But I saw no temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

John 1
29The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, “Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world! 30This is He of whom I said, ‘A man who comes after me has surpassed me because He was before me.’

Jesus isn't the True God:

John 17
3Now this is eternal life, that they may know You,[the Father] the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent.

1 Thessalonians 1
9For they themselves report what kind of welcome you gave us, and how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God 10and to await His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead—Jesus our deliverer from the coming wrath.

Jesus is not the Father:

Matt 23
9And do not call anyone on earth your father, for you have one Father, who is in heaven.

God is not the Son of Man or a man:

Numbers 23
19God is not a man, that He should lie,
or a son of man, that He should change His mind.
Does He speak and not act?
Does He promise and not fulfill?

Jesus the son of Abraham:

Matt 1
1This is the record of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham:

The Father the God of Abraham:

Acts 3
13The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified His servant Jesus.
Jesus the mediator between God and men:

1 Timothy 2
5For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

God the Father is Jesus' Savior:

Hebrews 5
7During the days of Jesus’ earthly life, He offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the One who could save Him from death, and

Jesus is not the invisible God:

Colossians 1
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.

1 Timothy 1
17Now to the King eternal, immortal, and invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.

Jesus is not God and Father of the church:

Romans 1
7To all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be saints:
Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Jesus is not the One God:

1 Corinthians 8
6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we exist. And there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we exist.

The Word of God is not the testimony of Jesus:

Revelation 1
2who testifies to everything he saw. This is the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 20
4Then I saw the thrones, and those seated on them had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God,

God illuminates the city, the Lamb a lamp:

Revelation 21
23And the city has no need of sun or moon to shine on it, because the glory of God illuminates the city, and the Lamb is its lamp.

They don't need the lamp anymore:

Revelation 22
5There will be no more night in the city, and they will have no need for the light of a lamp or of the sun. For the Lord God will shine on them, and they will reign forever and ever.

God isn't the son of Abraham:

Matthew 1
1This is the record of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham:

Jesus is not the on God and Father who is Lord over all:

Ephesians 4
4There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

The Word in John 1:1 isn't the definite God in the Greek. Can you deny that?

Play your word games.

 

[synergy]

Let's make this easier for you since quoting Acts 3:13 didn't help.

Person 1 = God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob
Person 2 = God's servant Jesus

Person 1 is not person 2. Correct?

Acts 3​

13The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified His servant Jesus.​

Jesus spoke of the God of Abraham, etc, in the third person after quoting Him:

Matthew 22​

32‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living.”​

All of this plainly means that Jesus isn't the God of Abraham by his own words.

Now read Exodus 3:14,15. Jesus isn't the I AM.

Exodus 3​

14God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ ”​

​

15God also told Moses, “Say to the Israelites, ‘The LORD, the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you.’ This is My name forever, and this is how I am to be remembered in every generation.​

Yes this proves Jesus isn't YHWH, isn't the I AM, etc.

Get it and enjoy! I am!

So you finally realized that it was false for you to say the following:

the angel is not God and never said he is God. Where did you see that? Not going up against God, but I will go up against you for sure. Put up some Scripture about where the angel said he is God.

I only had a few bites of before Ex 3:6 set you straight and you offered no more counterarguments.

Ex 3:6 Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God.

This proves that we are talking about God in Ex 3 whose name is "I Am", the very same name that Jesus used to name himself in John 8:58. Thus, Jesus is God.

 

[Peterlag]

He also said I and the father are ONE. (John 10:30). John 1 gives details.

John 10:30
There is no reason to take this verse to mean that Christ was saying that he and the Father make up "one God." The phrase was a common one, and even today if someone used it, people would know exactly what they meant... he and his Father are very much alike. When Paul wrote to the Corinthians about his ministry there, he said that he had planted the seed and Apollos had watered it. Then he said, "... he who plants and he who waters are one..." (1 Corinthians 3:8 NKJV). In the Greek texts, the wording of Paul is the same as that in John 10:30, yet no one claims that Paul and Apollos make up "one being." Christ uses the concept of "being one" in other places, and from them one can see that "one purpose" is what is meant. John 11:52 says Jesus was to die to make all God's children "one." In John 17:11, 21 and 22, Jesus prayed to God that his followers would be "one" as he and God were "one." I think it's obvious that Jesus was not praying that all his followers would become one being in "substance" just as he and his Father were one being or "substance." I believe the meaning is clear: Jesus was praying that all his followers be one in purpose just as he and God were one in purpose.

 

[Peterlag]

I don't see the word God in John 8:58. You are simply interpreting it to mean such when in fact it doesn't actually say any such things. Scripture doesn't lie, but people do. I believe you are misunderstanding John 8:58. Jesus never directly said he is God. Honest people all admit this.

John 8:58
At the last super, the disciples were trying to find out who would deny the Christ. They said literally, "Not I am, Lord" Matthew 26:22, 25. No one would say the disciples were trying to deny they were God because they were using the phrase "Not I am." "I am" was a common way of designating oneself and it did not mean you were claiming to be God. The argument is made that because Jesus was "before" Abraham, Jesus must be God. Jesus figuratively existed in Abraham's time. He did not actually physically exist as a person, but rather he existed in the mind of God as God's plan for the redemption of man. In order for the Trinitarian argument that Jesus' "I am" statement in John 8:58 makes him God, his statement must be equivalent with God's "I am" statement in Exodus 3:14. The two statements are very different. The Greek phrase in John does mean "I am." The Hebrew phrase in Exodus means "to be" or "to become." God was saying "I will be what I will be."

 

[Peterlag]

It's a rhetorical question. Jesus knew He is God in human form.

Jesus claimed to be God in John 10:30 when He said, “I and the Father are one.” He repeated this claim on the night of His betrayal when He told Philip, “If you’ve seen me you have seen the Father” (John 14:9).

John said that Jesus is God in the first verse of his Gospel, calling Jesus “the Word”.

In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God, and the Word was God (John 1:1).

To verify that he was talking about Jesus, he said, “The Word became flesh and made His dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth” (John 1:14).

Paul agreed with John. In Colossians 1:15-16 he wrote;

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.

The writer to the Hebrews essentially said the same thing in Hebrews 1:2-3, calling Jesus the one through whom God made the universe, the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of His being.

God Himself agreed with this in Hebrews 1:8. Speaking of His Son He said. “Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever; a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.”

Finally, In Revelation 1:8, God said, “I am the Alpha and the Omega” and in Rev. 22:13, Jesus said, “I am the Alpha and the Omega.” The only way this could be true of both is if they are one and the same.

In these verses the Bible makes a convincing case for the fact that Jesus is God in human form.

The Bible's Authority Archives – Grace thru faith

gracethrufaith.com

John 1:1
Jesus Christ is not a lexical definition of logos. The verse does not say "In the beginning was Jesus." The "Word" is not synonymous with Jesus, or even the "Messiah." The word logos in John 1:1 refers to God's creative self-expression... His reason, purpose and plans, especially as they are brought into action. It refers to God's self-expression or communication of Himself. This has come to pass through His creation and especially the heavens. It has come through the spoken word of the prophets and through Scripture. Most notably it has come into being through His Son. The logos is the expression of God and is His communication of Himself just as a "word" is an outward expression of a person's thoughts. This outward expression of God has now occurred through His Son and thus it's perfectly understandable why Jesus is called the "Word." Jesus is an outward expression of God's reason, wisdom, purpose and plan. For the same reason we call revelation "a word from God" and the Bible "the Word of God."

If we understand that the logos is God's expression... His plan, purpose, reason and wisdom. Then it is clear they were with Him "in the beginning." Scripture says God's wisdom was "from the beginning" and it was common in Hebrew writing to personify a concept such as wisdom. The fact that the logos "became" flesh shows it did not exist that way before. There is no pre-existence for Jesus in this verse other than his figurative "existence" as the plan, purpose or wisdom of God for the salvation of man. The same is true with the "word" in writing. It had no literal pre-existence as a "spirit-book" somehow in eternity past, but came into being as God gave the revelation to people and they wrote it down.

 

[Peterlag]

So are you claiming Jesus was not good?

No he did not say Jesus was not good. Jesus said he was not good.

 

[Pancho Frijoles]

Nobody's rejecting Acts 3:13 The Father is glorifying the Son

The Father? Acts 3:13 does not say "The Father", but "The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob."
Once again, when you read "God" you immediately visualize The Father, even when the text does not say "The Father"!
Why do you, Trinitarian brothers, continue to do this?
Perhaps because the Holy Spirit has seeded in your hearts, since your childhood, that God is The Father.

Our Father, my friends, is the "Only and True God."

 

[Fred]

Jesus said he was not good.

Jesus never said that.

 

[TomL]

No he did not say Jesus was not good. Jesus said he was not good.

Jesus denied he was good?

Where?

It is not in that verse