Irresistible Grace

[Rockson]

To live eternally serving Him

Absolute nonsense, but folks that where Calvinism takes one. Let's read this,

Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33This he said, signifying what death he should die.
Jn 12:31.32

So our Calvinist friend here would claim that's not drawing people to the place of being saved. He can say with a straight face they can be saved before beholding Jesus on the cross and understanding his substitionary death there and what it meant? That message of what Jesus did on the cross IS the gospel of the power of God and if one believes that and receives that they shall be saved! THEY ARE NOT saved without it. The Calvinist claims here they are....way, way, way out of line.

 

[Theophilus]

Calvin said that it is only God that saves and there is nothing mortal man can do for salvation. On the surface that seems correct. It is true that only God saves. The question Calvin raises in my mind is “how does God save?” If Calvin was right then Jesus was wrong, or at least that is how it appears to me.

Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” Matthew 28:18-20

If Calvin was right then no one can make disciples, baptizing has no worth, and neither does teaching. If it is only God that chooses then nothing matters. One would not be condemned for sin, because sin is what man does and nothing man does matters.

If only Calvin could have been born before Jesus so that Jesus would have known that sin didn’t matter! If he understood Calvinism he would have known that he didn’t have to be sacrificed for the sin of the world, because sin doesn’t really condemn a man: only God saves and He saves those that He wants to save. Because all men sin and He saves some of them then sin really has nothing to do with salvation. Would He save some because they try not to sin? That would mean that man would have something to do with his own salvation. Well, according to Calvin that is not possible.

If Calvin was correct then of what benefit to anyone would teaching his doctrine be? Would it be of any benefit to anyone to teach about Jesus or anything for that matter?

If a man is to be condemned and there is nothing he, or she can do about it then it would only be cruel to teach about God to them. Why rub salt in the wound?

We call ourselves Christians because we say we follow him. He said that we should make disciples. If you do not believe it is possible to make disciples then in effect you are saying Jesus was wrong. You do right to call yourself “Calvinist” and not a Christian because you do not believe Christ and you prove yourself wrong by teaching Calvinism because if Calvin were correct it would not matter what you taught, or even if you taught. It would even be better not to teach.

 

[john]

Bad news is if you're not one of the elect your on "Block Unwanted Calls."

no one and i mean no one fully understands election. peter wrote to make our election and calling sure gives some things to make sure we have virtue few other things ..then he added if we do these thing we will never fall . to many people read a scripture and make a doctrine out of it... context or not context . i use be in carm and had all the Calvinism bologna i care to taste . i called them the chosen frozen they was aragonit conceited and very high minded. i was called many things in there.. so yes reformed theology is a hard study to understand.. to be honest . its about as interesting as Joe Biden speech . i had rather listen to kenneth copeland

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

If Calvin was right then no one can make disciples, baptizing has no worth, and neither does teaching. If it is only God that chooses then nothing matters. One would not be condemned for sin, because sin is what man does and nothing man does matters.

Non-sequitur.

 

[Rockson]

If Calvin was correct then of what benefit to anyone would teaching his doctrine be?

I've asked the very same question before. What's the point even of Jesus having rebuked people when all the time (under Calvinism) it was God who wasn't putting in them irresistible grace like Calvinists say he does for the elect. If they indeed could have repented then it all adds up.

If a man is to be condemned and there is nothing he, or she can do about it then it would only be cruel to teach about God to them. Why rub salt in the wound?

And I've said before it would be like God is taunting people. There is an expression used by children years back where they'd say something unkindly to another who would experience a set back. A kid would say mockingly, "Nyah, nyah, nyah, nyah, nyah!" As you say if man can't do anything about repenting it would be cruel to even rub their faces in it.

 

[Rowan]

no one and i mean no one fully understands election. peter wrote to make our election and calling sure gives some things to make sure we have virtue few other things ..then he added if we do these thing we will never fall . to many people read a scripture and make a doctrine out of it... context or not context . i use be in carm and had all the Calvinism bologna i care to taste . i called them the chosen frozen they was aragonit conceited and very high minded. i was called many things in there.. so yes reformed theology is a hard study to understand.. to be honest . its about as interesting as Joe Biden speech . i had rather listen to kenneth copeland

Same here The Avs.C section at carn was definitely a hard pill to swallow. As far as calvinism, Biden and Kenneth Copeland girls i'll have to pass on all three.

 

[Theophilus]

Non-sequitur.

Actually it's called exposing the sinister motives of Calvinism that are quite easy to logically point out. The Holy Spirit gives us discernment to point out false doctrine.

 

[brightfame52]

Are you saying Christ reconciled the entire world to himself 2 Cor 5:19 so he died for everyone 2 Cor 5:14-15 and so everyone will be saved. Therefore, no one is going to hell as God can't be stopped in his mission.

No thats not what Iam saying, that shows me you dont pay attention.2 Cor 5 is all about the chosen of God

 

[brightfame52]

Absolute nonsense, but folks that where Calvinism takes one. Let's read this,

Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33This he said, signifying what death he should die.
Jn 12:31.32

So our Calvinist friend here would claim that's not drawing people to the place of being saved. He can say with a straight face they can be saved before beholding Jesus on the cross and understanding his substitionary death there and what it meant? That message of what Jesus did on the cross IS the gospel of the power of God and if one believes that and receives that they shall be saved! THEY ARE NOT saved without it. The Calvinist claims here they are....way, way, way out of line.

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

 

[civic]

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

your own verse contradicts your beliefs- thanks for posting it lol. Christ died for ALL and ALL were dead.

does it say Christ died for some and some were dead ?

next

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

 

[brightfame52]

your own verse contradicts your beliefs- thanks for posting it lol. Christ died for ALL and ALL were dead.

does it say Christ died for some and some were dead ?

next

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

 

[civic]

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

something you should know all were dead and Christ died for all- not some.

next

 

[brightfame52]

something you should know all were dead and Christ died for all- not some.

next

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

 

[civic]

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

yep every believer should know that Christ died for ALL, not some and that ALL were dead not some.

next

 

[brightfame52]

yep every believer should know that Christ died for ALL, not some and that ALL were dead not some.

next

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

 

[civic]

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

ALL does not mean some

Christ died for ALL as the verse says and ALL were dead

Were only some dead ?

yes or no

next fallacy

another swing and a miss

your doctrine holds no water

your cistern if full of holes

the foundation built upon sinking sand

in the end time some will depart from the faith

1 Timothy 4:1
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

2 Corinthians 4:2
But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

 

[Rockson]

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

What are you even quoting Rev 22:3 for!

I was talking about Jn 12:31

Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33This he said, signifying what death he should die.
Jn 12:31.32

He was talking about being lifted up on the cross and when people would hear the message of what it meant he would draw people through believing to become saved! You have them saved before the gospel is preached. Serious, serious error!

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Stop making it seem like we don't believe that. But that has nothing to do with being drawn to salvation, nothing whatsoever!

This is something a Christian should know !

Yes but they should also know that you're like trying to pull a rabbit out of a hat by making it seem those verses support your position.

 

[brightfame52]

ALL does not mean some

Christ died for ALL as the verse says and ALL were dead

Were only some dead ?

yes or no

next fallacy

another swing and a miss

your doctrine holds no water

your cistern if full of holes

the foundation built upon sinking sand

in the end time some will depart from the faith

1 Timothy 4:1
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

2 Corinthians 4:2
But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

Thats the end result, to serve God Rev 22 3

And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Dan 7 14

And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Ps 22 30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

2 Cor 5 14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


This is something a Christian should know !

 

[brightfame52]

What are you even quoting Rev 22:3 for!

I was talking about Jn 12:31

Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33This he said, signifying what death he should die.
Jn 12:31.32

He was talking about being lifted up on the cross and when people would hear the message of what it meant he would draw people through believing to become saved! You have them saved before the gospel is preached. Serious, serious error!


Stop making it seem like we don't believe that. But that has nothing to do with being drawn to salvation, nothing whatsoever!

Yes but they should also know that you're like trying to pull a rabbit out of a hat by making it seem those verses support your position.

The end result is to have them Christ died for serve Him. Any Christian should know that.

 

[Rowan]

No thats not what Iam saying, that shows me you dont pay attention.2 Cor 5 is all about the chosen of God

So I'm not the only one that can't understand what you're talking about and once again you're trying to lay your inability to communicate on someone else. What a guy!