It does not appear the bible teaches timelessness
God requires man to HUMBLE THEMSELVES
- Thread starter civic
- Start date
Yep that it is. Classic theism posits God does not thinkYep proves sequence , planning , thinking , time etc …. Just another contradiction in Calvinism.
God's knowledge is innate, ungenerate, non-discursive, eternal and unfalsifiable according to it
Seems God has a past
Genesis 1:1–2 (KJV 1900) — 1 IN the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
And a future
Revelation 21:4 (KJV 1900) — 4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
TibiasDad
Well-known member
1) The question is not whether God has a past or future, but whether he is subject to, ruled by, time itself.
2) Both of these passages, while speaking of God, are written from a human perspective, not God’s. In the beginning of our universe “God created”; in the believer’s future “God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes…”
Doug
"I think first a person needs to accept and believe that God's Word is true, "Every Word" as the Jesus "of the Bible" teaches. And it is these "Holy Scriptures" inspired by God that men can trust "for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works". Men who are guided by these Words are called "Learned of the Father". There are "MANY" men who call Jesus Lord, Lord and preach in HIS Name, but not so "many" who are learned of the Father.
Matt. 7: 13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
John 6: 44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
Is. 8: 20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
1 John 2: 3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
But in this world we have Wesley, Calvin, Arminius, Huss, Smith, Russell, White and the Pope and many others, and a monster religious system who divides itself according to whose religious philosophy they adopt.
Each one transgressing God's commandments by their own traditions, each one creating their own religion, their own Judgments, their own high days and sabbaths, their own imager of God in the likeness of men, and each one pointing out the flaws in the other religious business, like you guys to the Calvinists, but never considering the beam stuck in their own eye.
It seems there is a "repentance" or an "Exodus" in every example of faithful man in the entire Bible. Not an exodus from one religious sect to another, like the Pharisees to the Sadducee or a Catholic to a Protestant. But an Exodus out of the religions of this world, out of the old man "Wherein in time past we walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience".
It is this Exodus that I advocate for.
As Paul teaches.
2 Cor. 6: 16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,"
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
I must admit that you frustrate me when you make such petty arguments as this.
Paradox = a seemingly absurd or self-contradictory statement or proposition that when investigated or explained may prove to be well founded or true.
Negative = a word or phrase that expresses disagreement or rejection with something
These two words are complementary. They are not opposed to one another. You're making petty false claims. A paradox such as I have referenced is a negative relative to our disagreement.
I expressed a paradox that time has no end.
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
No need for you to slow down; I am already way ahead of you!
Unless you have an inside track to what it’s like from God’s point of view, you and I have no way of being absolute; which was my whole point to Civic in an earlier post. Nobody can explain this perfectly so as to be able to tell someone else ‘You’re wrong’! Discuss with grace and humility, gentleness and patience, for no one can say they are absolutely right in this matter. (Cf Eph 4:1-4)
Sure they can. You've obvious changed your approach on attacking my position. You're not "way ahead of me" at all. I very seriously doubt that you have ever meaningfully discussed this before. You just accepted what "CS Lewis" said just like you've blindly accepted what the Wesley brothers have said.
I only mention my experience in the fact that I rejected what men said decades ago. You're just repeating what you've heard. Big difference.
I'm going to rightfully witness the fact that you're ignoring large portions of what I have written to you. I like manner, I will do the same.
Sure it has. You obviously don't know the subject nor the Scriptures to the degree of recognizing them. I will leave you to your thoughts and mediations. Maybe you will find them on your own and actually recognize them yourself.
I've found in my life that sometimes is it just best not to try to lead someone in great detail to the "Truth". If you "discover it" yourself, it becomes a matter of pride. You might believe it then.......
Such is the ways of men...........
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
Time changes even in death.
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
I agree. There is a mistranslation in the book of Revelation that many try to use as evidence but it just witnesses to limitation of having late Latin witnesses in English Bibles.
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
No one has claimed that time rules God. When are you going to actually establish the necessity of omniscience relative to Divinity?
If you have every extensively studied the Character of God, you will know there is no necessity for such a premise as this.
That premise comes from the mind of a man. Man desires to know everything so he will have limitless power. God is limited by His Character. I AM that I AM. It is emphatic statement of self sufficiency. As such, what you create means what exactly relative to God?
No they are not. They are written from God's perspective. You know why? They came from God. They are revelation from God. They are statements of conditions purposed by God.
It is impossible for you to remove them from God's perspective.
Nope. Both texts deal with His creation which is subject to time.
I did not ask about physical substance. Is there time when nothing exists?
So time travel is a rule of time. You can't go forward and you can't go back.
When you exist outside of time there is no present past or future.
I'm sensing a dodge.
Thinks about what? What to do? God is omniscient.
civic
Well-known member
Is there time in heaven ? Yes or no
civic
Well-known member
Wrong there is time in heaven and heaven is a place.
Next fallacy
And we know God dwells in heaven.
Oops
Next
hope this helps !!!
Nope. Do you age in heaven?
There is no time in heaven.
Dodger, is God subject to the rules of time?
civic
Well-known member
Another strawman
