Eternal Security

[Doug Brents]

You left out some key words. What you quoted me of saying wasn't what I said at all. Let's try again.

Some people just don't know how Saved they really are. Keywords How saved. What that means is if you think you can lose your salvation then you really don't understand the greatness of your salvation.

There is no measure, or degree, of salvation. One is either saved or not saved; there is no "more saved" or "less saved" or "HOW saved". If one is in Christ, walking in the Light, exhibiting the fruit of the Spirit, then he is saved. But if one, even one of the brethren, is living in unrepentant sin, then he is not saved.

There are many who claim to be among the brethren, but they were never saved. These are those to whom Jesus will say, "I never knew you." But there are some who Jesus once did know, but who turn back to unrepentant sin, and these are those about whom the Holy Spirit is speaking in Heb 6:4-8. Those who once were partakers in the Spirit who return to fall away into unrepentant sin.

Of this you can be certain, and in it you may rest assured: Your loving and gracious heavenly Father will never let go of your hand; he will never, by no means ever, leave you or forsake you, or ever allow you to leave or forsake him!

You said : "our brothers and sisters in Christ who fall into unrepentant sin are lost, but can be restored to Christ by being brought back to repentance."

So you agree that if you turn from sin you haven't lost your salvation. And rightly so as demonstrated in the parable of the Sheep. It tells a story of how a shepherd left his flock of 99 sheep to go find one lost sheep. This parable displays the beautiful meaning of God seeking out the lost sinner and rejoicing when they are found.

When you belong to him you're his you're part of his family. No good father would lose one of his children.

If a brother or sister in Christ falls into unrepentant sin, they are lost. And if they fail to return to repentance then they die in their lost state. They were a brother or sister, but they die lost and condemned. Not all of the saints will persevere. Scripture is clear that IF we persevere we will receive the prize of Heaven. But if we do NOT persevere we will not receive the prize; we will not be saved.

 

[Biblelesson]

There is no measure, or degree, of salvation. One is either saved or not saved; there is no "more saved" or "less saved" or "HOW saved". If one is in Christ, walking in the Light, exhibiting the fruit of the Spirit, then he is saved. But if one, even one of the brethren, is living in unrepentant sin, then he is not saved.

There are many who claim to be among the brethren, but they were never saved. These are those to whom Jesus will say, "I never knew you." But there are some who Jesus once did know, but who turn back to unrepentant sin, and these are those about whom the Holy Spirit is speaking in Heb 6:4-8. Those who once were partakers in the Spirit who return to fall away into unrepentant sin.

If a brother or sister in Christ falls into unrepentant sin, they are lost. And if they fail to return to repentance then they die in their lost state. They were a brother or sister, but they die lost and condemned. Not all of the saints will persevere. Scripture is clear that IF we persevere we will receive the prize of Heaven. But if we do NOT persevere we will not receive the prize; we will not be saved.

Once you belong to Jesus you're never lost, he makes sure of that. It's as simple as that there's no need to make it complicated.

There is a reason for us to know that we are safe and secure, in The Loving Arms of Jesus. Doubt and uncertainty robs us of our peace and joy and can turn us away from righteousness.

Doubt can also be crippling in a way that undermines our relationship with God. If we are constantly doubting his Word or wondering if he will fulfill his promises or are cynical of his stated intentions, it’s hard to grow spiritually.

That's why it's so important to get a handle and a good understanding of Perseverance of the Saints.

 

[Doug Brents]

Once you belong to Jesus you're never lost, he makes sure of that. It's as simple as that there's no need to make it complicated.

There is a reason for us to know that we are safe and secure, in The Loving Arms of Jesus. Doubt and uncertainty robs us of our peace and joy and can turn us away from righteousness.

Doubt can also be crippling in a way that undermines our relationship with God. If we are constantly doubting his Word or wondering if he will fulfill his promises or are cynical of his stated intentions, it’s hard to grow spiritually.

That's why it's so important to get a handle and a good understanding of Perseverance of the Saints.

There is no doubt or uncertainty when we are walking in the Light, and as long as we are walking in the Light, our relationship with Jesus grows deeper and stronger. Yes, the saints must persevere, but we must always be vigilant against drifting back into sin (in ourselves and in our brothers and sisters). And if we do find one of our brethren drifting, we must alert them, and draw them back into the fold.

 

[Biblelesson]

There is no doubt or uncertainty when we are walking in the Light, and as long as we are walking in the Light, our relationship with Jesus grows deeper and stronger. Yes, the saints must persevere, but we must always be vigilant against drifting back into sin (in ourselves and in our brothers and sisters). And if we do find one of our brethren drifting, we must alert them, and draw them back into the fold.

I totally agree. The Bible talks about when two walk together if one falls into the ditch the other can help get them out.

 

[Doug Brents]

I totally agree. The Bible talks about when two walk together if one falls into the ditch the other can help get them out.

Exactly. But if the one falls and the other does not pull him out, or the one walks alone and falls, He is lost and will not reach Heaven. It is not just the lost who can are fallen, but some of the brethren have fallen as well and will remain lost unless, before they die, someone guides them back to repentance.

 

[Biblelesson]

Exactly. But if the one falls and the other does not pull him out, or the one walks alone and falls, He is lost and will not reach Heaven. It is not just the lost who can are fallen, but some of the brethren have fallen as well and will remain lost unless, before they die, someone guides them back to repentance.

I hear what you're saying but what comes to my mind is what if the two walking together would be the saved person and Jesus and the safe person falls in the hole. We know all the things Jesus said about never leaving nor forsaking us so we know that he's going to get that guy out of the hole.

For another example is Daniel 3:16-28

16 Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter.

17 If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king.

18 But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

19 Then was Nebuchadnezzar full of fury, and the form of his visage was changed against Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego: therefore he spake, and commanded that they should heat the furnace one seven times more than it was wont to be heated.

20 And he commanded the most mighty men that were in his army to bind Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, and to cast them into the burning fiery furnace.

21 Then these men were bound in their coats, their hosen, and their hats, and their other garments, and were cast into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

22 Therefore because the king's commandment was urgent, and the furnace exceeding hot, the flames of the fire slew those men that took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego.

23 And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, fell down bound into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

24 Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonished, and rose up in haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellors, Did not we cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True, O king.

25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

26 Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the mouth of the burning fiery furnace, and spake, and said, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, ye servants of the most high God, come forth, and come hither. Then Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, came forth of the midst of the fire.

27 And the princes, governors, and captains, and the king's counsellors, being gathered together, saw these men, upon whose bodies the fire had no power, nor was an hair of their head singed, neither were their coats changed, nor the smell of fire had passed on them.

28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

 

[Doug Brents]

I hear what you're saying but what comes to my mind is what if the two walking together would be the saved person and Jesus and the safe person falls in the hole. We know all the things Jesus said about never leaving nor forsaking us so we know that he's going to get that guy out of the hole.

Jesus is in the Light. But if a person ceases to walk in the Light then he ceases to walk with Jesus. We are continually washed from all sin as long as we walk in the Light, but we are not continually cleansed if we are not walking in the Light. Yes, Jesus will rescue us (if we are willing) through the actions of our brothers and sisters with whom we should be walking. But if we are not walking with the brethren then we risk being overwhelmed by the cares of this world (see the parable of the soils). The second and third soils (rocks and weeds) received the Gospel and became saved, but were lost because they didn't have roots, or were choked out by the cares of this world. This is one reason that the Church is a community, not a bunch of individuals going their own ways.

 

[Biblelesson]

Jesus is in the Light. But if a person ceases to walk in the Light then he ceases to walk with Jesus. We are continually washed from all sin as long as we walk in the Light, but we are not continually cleansed if we are not walking in the Light. Yes, Jesus will rescue us (if we are willing) through the actions of our brothers and sisters with whom we should be walking. But if we are not walking with the brethren then we risk being overwhelmed by the cares of this world (see the parable of the soils). The second and third soils (rocks and weeds) received the Gospel and became saved, but were lost because they didn't have roots, or were choked out by the cares of this world. This is one reason that the Church is a community, not a bunch of individuals going their own ways.

The good news is that the people that are saved and walk away come to their senses. It happens over and over, There are example after example. Some people turn their backs on salvation and then on their death bed repent ask God to forgive them and he does.

I do like what you're saying, It's sort of like if someone thinks they've lost their salvation we as brothers in Christ can help them go look for it.

 

[Fellow Traveler]

God doesn't give you a gift of eternal life and then take it back or allow you to lose it. Then there's the fact that once you're adopted into his family you're never rejected.

What is eternal life? | GotQuestions.org

What is eternal life? Is it true that everyone ultimately has eternal life, and that it is only a matter of where that eternal life will be?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[Doug Brents]

The good news is that the people that are saved and walk away come to their senses.

Not all.

It happens over and over, There are example after example. Some people turn their backs on salvation and then on their death bed repent ask God to forgive them and he does.

I do like what you're saying, It's sort of like if someone thinks they've lost their salvation we as brothers in Christ can help them go look for it.

Indeed we can, if they will hear us, and if they still live. But if a brother dies while living in unrepentant sin, he is lost.

 

[Biblelesson]

Let's look at your two points.

Number one. You say not all come to their senses. And then I would imagine you would point to a few scriptures in the Bible that warn us to abide in Christ. There are a few of those but they are outnumbered by the scriptures tell us we will not lose the eternal life that Christ died to give us. That his work on the cross was sufficient.

Number two. How could you possibly know that if the saved brother who was living an ungodly life and suddenly died hadn't repented? That's hypothetical there's no way you could know.

I think we both agree it's better to abide in Christ and to be sure of our salvation. But once you bring up the thought of the possibility of losing your salvation that takes away the assurance.

Then there's the good old standby that covers all those walk away from Christ. That they were never really Believers in the first place. Jesus talked about them "depart from me for I never knew you".

And The Beat Goes On. Did you like Sonny and Cher? I was never a real fond of them.

 

[Doug Brents]

Let's look at your two points.

Number one. You say not all come to their senses. And then I would imagine you would point to a few scriptures in the Bible that warn us to abide in Christ. There are a few of those but they are outnumbered by the scriptures tell us we will not lose the eternal life that Christ died to give us. That his work on the cross was sufficient.

And the number of passages that say something matters? Not at all.
The fact that we are warned against falling away means that it is possible. God has set in place many ways to prevent us from falling away and to bring us back, but if we are determined to leave He will not prevent us from it (I believe so, anyway).

Number two. How could you possibly know that if the saved brother who was living an ungodly life and suddenly died hadn't repented? That's hypothetical there's no way you could know.

I do not know. But I know that a person who was once a partaker of the Holy Spirit (as Heb 6:4-6 says) who falls away and lives in unrepentant sin to the point that they "again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame" cannot be turned back to repentance. And even if they speak some words to the effect of turning back to God on their death bed (fire insurance if you will), I personally would not hold them as sincere, nor do I believe God does.

I think we both agree it's better to abide in Christ and to be sure of our salvation. But once you bring up the thought of the possibility of losing your salvation that takes away the assurance.

Then there's the good old standby that covers all those walk away from Christ. That they were never really Believers in the first place. Jesus talked about them "depart from me for I never knew you".

The cop-out of "they were never really Believers in the first place" is disingenuous at best. Clearly in Scripture there are some who "enter" the Church as wolves pretending to be sheep, and they never were part of the Fellowship. But then there are some, as Heb 6:4-6 and other passages depicts, who really are part of the Fellowship, but who fall away. Some of these are reclaimed, but some may not be.

 

[Grace ambassador]

God doesn't give you a gift of eternal life and then take it back or allow you to lose it. Then there's the fact that once you're adopted into his family you're never rejected.

Amen, precious friend, exactly what I have found In:

"What Saith The [ Vast Multitude Of God's Holy ] Scripture?":

God's 'Operation' on all new-born babes In Christ!​

+

God's ETERNAL Life Insurance​

Amen.

 

[Bronson]

And the number of passages that say something matters? Not at all.
The fact that we are warned against falling away means that it is possible. God has set in place many ways to prevent us from falling away and to bring us back, but if we are determined to leave He will not prevent us from it (I believe so, anyway).

I do not know. But I know that a person who was once a partaker of the Holy Spirit (as Heb 6:4-6 says) who falls away and lives in unrepentant sin to the point that they "again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame" cannot be turned back to repentance. And even if they speak some words to the effect of turning back to God on their death bed (fire insurance if you will), I personally would not hold them as sincere, nor do I believe God does.

The cop-out of "they were never really Believers in the first place" is disingenuous at best. Clearly in Scripture there are some who "enter" the Church as wolves pretending to be sheep, and they never were part of the Fellowship. But then there are some, as Heb 6:4-6 and other passages depicts, who really are part of the Fellowship, but who fall away. Some of these are reclaimed, but some may not be.

To be “in Christ” by faith alone means, among other things, that his righteousness has been reckoned or imputed to us. It means we are united with him in a spiritual covenant. It means there is an almost indefinable mystical oneness or spiritual fellowship with the Lord that we share every moment of life. To put it as simply as possible, to be “in Christ” means you are saved by him and are in vibrant spiritual union with him. Who would walk away from that. Only someone that never believed in Jesus in the first place. Once we have a relationship with Jesus we never want that to end. If someone could walk away that right there proves they were never saved.

To be converted is to be “born again.” At the moment of conversion, the converted person is filled with the Holy Spirit and begins a journey of turning away from sin and beginning to worship and serve the Lord. A “false conversion” is no conversion at all. A false conversion may look like a true, Spirit-caused conversion, but it is not. The reasons for false conversions are varied. Sometimes the person experiencing a false conversion doesn’t even realize it. At other times, there is intentional deception on their part. Not everyone who claims to have been converted has, in fact, been converted.

True Christians are “born again” (John 3:3) and are controlled by the Holy Spirit; they are no longer controlled by their sinful nature (Romans 8:9). Indeed, born-again Christians have the Spirit of Christ indwelling their hearts (Galatians 4:6), and they become new creations: “The old has gone, the new has come!” (2 Corinthians 5:17). When a person receives Christ, tremendous spiritual changes take place in him, and true converts will indeed display the characteristics of genuine Christians. Got?

 

[Red Baker]

This is so bad on so many levels with numerous fallacious arguments especially regarding sin and sinners. I’ll address it after work today

I waited for you to address this but it never came, maybe a oversight on your part. If indeed it was so bad on many levels, then you should have no problem addressing my post.

I'm going to jump back into this thread as time permits me to do so, in the next few days.............which time is very limited.

 

[Red Baker]

To be “in Christ” by faith alone

Dear soul, you mean well, but all you are doing is giving men like Doug ammunition to be used against the doctrine of Once Loved, Always Loved!

Faith does not put us into Christ legally, the doctrine of God's election of grace puts his elect in Christ and this from before the foundation of the world, before we had done good or evil. This is important to always remember and to defend against work mongers.

Ephesians 1:4~"According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:"

If works did not secure our salvation (and they did not) from sin and condemnation, then certainly they cannot be the means of us maintaining of our salvation unto glory. God will be no debtor to any anyone ~ yet, the way Doug and others believe and teach makes God a debtor to man!. That's pure hersey and another gospel which falls under the curse of God, per Galatians chapter one.

that his righteousness has been reckoned or imputed to us.

Amen, and that without works on our part~for again, if by works, then man could glory, yet not before God will any man glory. For it is written:

Romans 4:1-5~"What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."

Works of the flesh had not one thing to do with God imputing to Abraham His righteousness~that was by his election of pure grace. Abraham's faith was the evidence that this righteousness had been freely imputhet to Abraham. Can thsi be proven? very easily. Consider:

Galatians 3:6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.​

This is the most popular Bible quotation (Genesis 15:6; Romans 4:3,5,6,9,22,24; Galatians 3:6; James 2:23). It would behove us to put the proper sense of this bible verse.

Paul declared New Testament worship of Christ to be comparable to Abraham’s worship.

The adverbial phrase, even as, means that there is a very strong comparison to be seen.

Paul has been mentioning faith over and over, and Abraham is the greatest example of it. The Galatians stood by faith (2:16; 3:1-5); God approved Abraham by faith (Genesis 15:6).

Bronson, this is precious and sweet, if we grasp Paul introduced Abraham as father to Gentiles!

The Judaizer false teachers could only offer some connection to Moses by circumcision. Why is Abraham so important? For very good reasons in opposing the legalism of Judaizers, and all work mongers who think that they are not that depraved and have some powers of their own to please God without God providing for their total salvation from sin and condemnation.

All the Jews recognized Abraham as the great friend of God, inheritor of promises, and father of the nation, in whom they took great confidence (Matthew 3:9; John 8:33; Exodus 3:6). For those trusting Abraham, he was a man approved and commended by God for faith. For those trusting circumcision, Abraham was declared righteous before it (Romans 4:9-12). For those trusting Law, Abram was righteous 430 years before (Romans 4:13-16; Galatians 3:17). What did Abraham believe? God promised him a son and a multitudinous seed (Genesis 15:6).

Consider: Did Abraham call forth faith in order to be justified and made righteous by God at this time?

Here is where we greatly differ from Arminians and Calvinists alike about justification, whom we find to be very similar on this doctrine, when we press them for definitions.

Arminians hold conditional justification ~ faith is the human condition for righteousness.

Calvinists hold instrumental justification – faith is the instrument receiving righteousness.

We deny both as being heretical notions, for our faith does not affect legal justification.

The text says God accepted Abraham’s faith and counted it as evidence for righteousness, which is how we understand it: our faith is the spiritual evidence and fruit of salvation.

The difference is significant – is legal justification conditional, or is it unconditional? Is faith the means of righteousness before God, or is it only the evidence of righteousness?

Abraham had believed God and his promises and trusted Him obediently long before this minor event (Genesis 12:1-4; Hebrews 11:8; Genesis 12:7,8; 13:4,14-18; 14:17-24). This is very important to know.

If this event was the conditional or instrumental cause of Abraham’s justification, then he was a condemned pagan in his previous acts of worship, which God joyfully accepted!

Consider: Did Melchizedek bless Abram as a condemned sinner on his way to the lake of fire (Genesis 14:18-20)?

Before Abraham could get started believing, God had already accepted him (Genesis 15:1)!

If this event was the conditional or instrumental cause of Abraham’s justification, then the shish-ka-bob javelin act of Phinehas was his condition or instrument (Ps 106:30-31)! MOst stay away for this scriptures for it shows their corrupt teaching of Justification.

Please consider: Is it an act of faith that justifies? A life of faith? Or only while you have faith? Or what? Press people and they will get mad at you because you have them in a corner from which they cannot escape.

Why was this event singled out and quoted more in the New Testament than any passage? Abel, Enoch, and Noah were ignored, because they were not the “father” of Israel, though they proved their righteous character by their faith long before Abraham (Heb 11:4-7).

Never forget.....God wrote Genesis 15:6 for the future use of Paul in showing the important role of faith to Jews trusting the Law that came 430 years later and to Gentiles that had no Law at all!

I want to say more, but will come back later.

 

[Red Baker]

To be converted is to be “born again.”

Friend, this is not so in all due respect to your seemly genuine and sincere faith.
Although many God fearing Christians link the two together, they are not the same. Consider:

Confusing these two very different things has led to many heresies. Regeneration is God’s supernatural, omnipotent, instantaneous, creative work to give a rebel sinner a new nature that loves Him and wants to serve Him. Conversion is the lifelong educational process of a one of these regenerate persons coming to know God and the truth of the gospel for his comfort and knowledge and for how he should live in the world to please God.

Consider this article written by a old soldier of cross who is still living in his nineties~a friend of mine~who was converted after pastoring over forty years in an arminian Baptist church:

Regeneration and Conversion​

Regeneration and conversion are Bible words. Both words identify a spiritual work in the child of God. However, they do not refer to the same thing.

Regeneration​

Regeneration is wholly of God. It is the Holy Spirit’s quickening work whereby spiritual life is given to the sinner “by the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Ghost” (Tit 3:5). The word comes from “re” meaning “again” and “generate” meaning “to beget.” Jesus identified this work of God as being “born again” (John 3:3). The Bible is emphatic that God “of his own will begat” us (Jam 1:18), even as Jesus claimed He “quickeneth whom He will” (John 5:21).

Eternal life, i.e., spiritual life, is God’s sovereign gift bestowed in regeneration. While invisible to men, this life is demonstrated by man’s response in conversion.

Note especially the absence in Scripture of even one command for a sinner to seek regeneration.

Conversion​

Conversion is the response of the regenerated child of God to his Heavenly Father’s will and commandments. The word means to “turn” or “turn about.” Thus it was foretold of John the Baptist’s ministry, “and many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God” (Lu 1:16). Those John turned are declared to be already related to “the Lord their God” but needed to turn about and obey Him.

Jesus describes the Apostle Peter’s denial and recovery by saying, “when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren” (Lu 22:32).

James explains the departure of a Christian brother from the truth can be corrected if another “converteth the sinner from the error of his way” (Jam 5:20).

Numerous exhortations and commandments are addressed to the saved, i.e., regenerated children of God, calling them from sin, error and ignorance to righteousness, truth and joyful assurance in fellowship with God (1 John 1:3, 7-9). A person’s conversion is usually in proportion to his understanding of and obedience to Bible truth.

Regeneration Contrasted with Conversion​

While regeneration is a once-for-all event, conversion will occur in steps depending upon one learning to follow God’s revealed will.

Unless one holds to the false theory of sinless perfection, every child of God will have some area(s) where he needs to experience conversion.

That is, there will be ideas, habits or personality traits that need to be changed and replaced by God’s perfect and revealed will.

Results Of Confusing Regeneration And Conversion​

Many teachers of religion confuse the words — regeneration and conversion — making both refer to being eternally saved or born again. Therefore, they put various conversion commands upon the unsaved.

This has resulted in the present popular theology of conditional or decisional regeneration. It is commonly preached that the sinner must do something or meet some condition before God can or will save him.

Conditions vary from one church or evangelist to another, but may include praying the sinner’s prayer, confessing faith in Jesus, making Jesus Lord, water baptism, joining the church, taking communion or other works of righteousness.

Conditional Regeneration Refuted​

The following Scriptures mark as error this teaching of requiring a sinner to meet some condition before God can save or regenerate him.

1. Salvation is “not of works” (Eph 2:9; Tit 3:5), which excludes faith since faith is a “work” (John 6:28-29), is “of the law” (Matt 23:23) and is keeping a “commandment” (1 John 3:23).

2. Faith, love of brethren and righteous deeds all result because one “is born of God” (1 John 5:1, 4; 4:7; 2:29), and thus cannot be the means or conditions required before God saves a person. These are evidences showing one already has eternal life (John 3:36; 5:24).

3. An unsaved man cannot receive spiritual things (1 Cor 2:14), cannot please God (Rom 8:7-8) and will not come to Christ (John 5:40). He must be given spiritual life first.

4. Men are eternally saved according to God’s will (Eph 1:4-5); John 3:8; 17:2; Rom 9:15), not according to man’s will (John 1:13; Rom 9:11, 16).

5. The gospel reveals the good news of salvation only to those who “are saved” (1 Cor 1:18, 24), thus bringing spiritual “life and immorality to light” as proof and assurance of God’s salvation (2 Tim 1:10; Acts 13:48).

God’s salvation is a “free gift” without any conditions (Rom 5:15-18; 6:23!).

A Word of Encouragement​

If God has given you a new heart and spirit (Ezek 11:19-20; Eph 4:3-6) and written His laws in your heart (Rom 2:15), then you have been regenerated. This makes you accountable to obey God and “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure” (Phil 2:12-13).

Foes that will fight your efforts to obey God in true conversion will likely include your deceitful heart (Jer 17:9), your carnal flesh (Rom 8:7), your sinful lusts (1 Pet 2:11), so-called friends (Pro 29:25), and Satan (1 Cor 11:3).

You can know and have friends who rejoice in free grace and unconditional salvation. Every inquiry will receive a cordial reply. We await the opportunity to serve you in the gospel of God’s dear Son, our Lord Jesus Christ.

https://letgodbetrue.com/bible-topics/index/salvation/regeneration-and-conversion-roland/

Roland C. Crosby

 

[Fool4Christ]

To be “in Christ” by faith alone means, among other things, that his righteousness has been reckoned or imputed to us. It means we are united with him in a spiritual covenant. It means there is an almost indefinable mystical oneness or spiritual fellowship with the Lord that we share every moment of life. To put it as simply as possible, to be “in Christ” means you are saved by him and are in vibrant spiritual union with him. Who would walk away from that. Only someone that never believed in Jesus in the first place. Once we have a relationship with Jesus we never want that to end. If someone could walk away that right there proves they were never saved.

To be converted is to be “born again.” At the moment of conversion, the converted person is filled with the Holy Spirit and begins a journey of turning away from sin and beginning to worship and serve the Lord. A “false conversion” is no conversion at all. A false conversion may look like a true, Spirit-caused conversion, but it is not. The reasons for false conversions are varied. Sometimes the person experiencing a false conversion doesn’t even realize it. At other times, there is intentional deception on their part. Not everyone who claims to have been converted has, in fact, been converted.

True Christians are “born again” (John 3:3) and are controlled by the Holy Spirit; they are no longer controlled by their sinful nature (Romans 8:9). Indeed, born-again Christians have the Spirit of Christ indwelling their hearts (Galatians 4:6), and they become new creations: “The old has gone, the new has come!” (2 Corinthians 5:17). When a person receives Christ, tremendous spiritual changes take place in him, and true converts will indeed display the characteristics of genuine Christians. Got?

I find that there is great comfort in knowing that the gospel of Christ is true and that we are truly and forever saved and reconciled to God, that's what is Paul’s is saying. We have indescribable blessing and unfathomable joy and ineffable peace that fills our hearts when we understand the full assurance of our salvation that God has made known to us.

2 [For my concern is] that their hearts may be braced (comforted, cheered, and encouraged) as they are knit together in love, that they may come to have all the abounding wealth and blessings of assured conviction of understanding, and that they may become progressively more intimately acquainted with and may know more definitely and accurately and thoroughly that mystic secret of God, [which is] Christ (the Anointed One). Colossians 2:2

Hallelujah!

 

[Doug Brents]

To be “in Christ” by faith alone means, among other things, that his righteousness has been reckoned or imputed to us. It means we are united with him in a spiritual covenant. It means there is an almost indefinable mystical oneness or spiritual fellowship with the Lord that we share every moment of life. To put it as simply as possible, to be “in Christ” means you are saved by him and are in vibrant spiritual union with him. Who would walk away from that. Only someone that never believed in Jesus in the first place. Once we have a relationship with Jesus we never want that to end. If someone could walk away that right there proves they were never saved.

I also believe it is incomprehensible to walk away from that union with God, but there are some who have and do. Some because of tragedy in their life. Some because of temptation while still having shallow roots. Some because of busyness, and having the Word drowned out by the cares of this life. But that does not mean that they were never saved.

To be converted is to be “born again.” At the moment of conversion, the converted person is filled with the Holy Spirit and begins a journey of turning away from sin and beginning to worship and serve the Lord. A “false conversion” is no conversion at all. A false conversion may look like a true, Spirit-caused conversion, but it is not. The reasons for false conversions are varied. Sometimes the person experiencing a false conversion doesn’t even realize it. At other times, there is intentional deception on their part. Not everyone who claims to have been converted has, in fact, been converted.

This I agree with. But to assign this false conversion to everyone who falls away is disingenuous.

True Christians are “born again” (John 3:3) and are controlled by the Holy Spirit; they are no longer controlled by their sinful nature (Romans 8:9). Indeed, born-again Christians have the Spirit of Christ indwelling their hearts (Galatians 4:6), and they become new creations: “The old has gone, the new has come!” (2 Corinthians 5:17). When a person receives Christ, tremendous spiritual changes take place in him, and true converts will indeed display the characteristics of genuine Christians. Got?

Controlled? Not so much. Guided? Yes.
But yes, there are tremendous changes that take place when a person is converted to Christ. But that is not to say that the new creature cannot die again. Immortality has not yet been received, and even the newly born child in Christ can die again (be lost again) if they turn back to unrepentant sin.

 

[Red Baker]

the converted person is filled with the Holy Spirit and begins a journey of turning away from sin and beginning to worship and serve the Lord.

Brother, close but not quite the truth. Yes, we have the Spirit of God in us, in our new man which is created after the image of Jesus Christ. But, we still have the old man, the flesh, which is corrupt and at enmity against God~there will be a lifelong battle between the two. Though we have the Spirit of God.... the question is does He have full control of us? To the degree we are ruled by the word of God is the degree we are filled and control by the Spirit~all of God's children will be on different levels of spirituality, meaning not all are filled the Spirit by Him controlling us.

The Pentecostals have created a shortcut with their Baptism of the Spirit doctrine, with evidence of speaking in tongues, which the church epistles are 100% silence concerning. There are no shortcuts~being filled with the Spirit is an ongoing process of walking after the Spirit and heeding the commandments of our God.