An Article on free will

[Eternally-Grateful]

There is a difference between believing someone and believing IN someone. Believing God is not faith. Believing in God is faith. That is a distinction found in the Bible.

I would put it differently

even demons believe yet tremble

I can believe someone or even believe in them, yet not trust them

Faith is trust that comes from assurance. not mere belief

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

how about stopping the he said she said and get to the word.. no one is edified when we accuse each other

 

[Jim]

I would put it differently

even demons believe yet tremble

I can believe someone or even believe in them, yet not trust them

Faith is trust that comes from assurance. not mere belief

I would argue that biblically, to "believe in" is one and the same as to "have faith in". That is true in English as well as in Greek.

 

[synergy]

what do you mean by initial salvation?

That which kick starts our salvation.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

I would argue that biblically, to "believe in" is one and the same as to "have faith in". That is true in English as well as in Greek.

the English word belief is where that would stumble

A great example I have is a person would use a tightrope to push a wheel barrow across the Niagara falls. He would put enough weight in it to resemble a normal human adult. He did this multiple times going back and forth. A great crowd gatered. After awile he asked if anyone believed he could actually take a living human across. Everyone raised their hands, they believed he could do it. they believed in him.

Sadly. when he asked for volunteers. no one raised their hand. they believed he could do it. But they did not trust that he could guarantee their safety (if they fell it would be death)

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

That which kick starts our salvation.

So are we saved or are we not?

 

[synergy]

So are we saved or are we not?

Only God can decree who is saved and who is not. I'm not sure why you're asking me?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Only God can decree who is saved and who is not. I'm not sure why you're asking me?

Are you saved the moment your saved.

or do you have to keep yourself saved

 

[synergy]

Are you saved the moment your saved.

or do you have to keep yourself saved

You're asking me if I believe in OSAS? No, I do not.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

You're asking me if I believe in OSAS? No, I do not.

No,

I am asking if you believe we are saved the moment we come to christ. or if we have to work to maintain our salvation

OSAS is a term that is misused

 

[GodsGrace]

the point is the faith was so small. You can not really call it a gift..

I'm afraid I've lost the thread of our discussion...had to leave before.
But Jesus said we need only faith the size of a mustard seed.
This may not be what we were discussing...if not we'll just have to drop it.
Sorry. Or,,,get me back on track.

 

[GodsGrace]

to be saved?

Again I ask. do we do these works to be saved?

We all agree that the reply is a resounding NO.

 

[synergy]

No,

I am asking if you believe we are saved the moment we come to christ. or if we have to work to maintain our salvation

OSAS is a term that is misused

Define what you mean by "work". Is it "works of the Law", "good works", any effort exerted by humans, "work of faith", "labor of love", etc..... ?

 

[civic]

No,

I am asking if you believe we are saved the moment we come to christ. or if we have to work to maintain our salvation

OSAS is a term that is misused

I was saved at a point in time back in 1980. That’s when I was born again by receiving Christ as my Lord/ Savior confessing my sins , repenting and began following Him daily as a disciple.

Losing one’s salvation is a hot topic and there are believers , pastors , theologians on both sides of the fence.

 

[GodsGrace]

I would argue that biblically, to "believe in" is one and the same as to "have faith in". That is true in English as well as in Greek.

In reply.....to believe and to believe in basically is the same.

If I BELIEVE God,,,,I will do as He states in order to get me saved.
If I BELIEVE God...I will follow Him because I believe He is telling me the truth.

To believe means to trust....
If I believe the elevator will take me up,,,then I am trusting the elevator.

To believe in Jesus....
Means to believe in HIS NAME...
To believe in HIS AUTHORITY.
to believe in HIS CAPACITY AS GOD..
to believe He IS GOD.

If I believe Jesus,,,I trust Him as a good teacher (which is where many stop)...
If I beleive IN JESUS...then I'm trusting Him for my salvation.

We need both and I believe even in the first case I would be saved
(even though my belief system is limited).

 

[civic]

We all agree that the reply is a resounding NO.

Yep