Abandonment of the Son in PSA.....

praise_yeshua

Well-known member
Joh 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
Joh 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.

Seems rather simple. God didn't abandon the Son on the cross.
 
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Depends on how you define "abandon," because what happened when Christ said "Why have you forsaken me?" was temporary.

This has to be when the atonement happened in time, when the clouds became dark to symbolize the judgment happening.

Jesus said "It is finished," before he died, and that doesn't fit the theology of those who deny PSA and make atonement mere physical death.
 
Depends on how you define "abandon," because what happened when Christ said "Why have you forsaken me?" was temporary.

This has to be when the atonement happened in time, when the clouds became dark to symbolize the judgment happening.

Jesus said "It is finished," before he died, and that doesn't fit the theology of those who deny PSA and make atonement mere physical death.
There was no abandonment thats a fiction of ones imagination not found in Scripture- Thats the false teaching of PSA.
 
There was no abandonment thats a fiction of ones imagination not found in Scripture- Thats the false teaching of PSA.

Depends on how you define it.

Whatever sin is supposed to get from God—well, that is the price Jesus paid for us.
 
Depends on how you define "abandon," because what happened when Christ said "Why have you forsaken me?" was temporary.

This has to be when the atonement happened in time, when the clouds became dark to symbolize the judgment happening.

Jesus said "It is finished," before he died, and that doesn't fit the theology of those who deny PSA and make atonement mere physical death.

Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani.

Psalm 22.....

It is an appeal to the death of sin. The futility of humanity. This does not change anything relative to the relationship of the Father and the Son. Jesus was leaving His human body in death.
 
What is going on? I wrote what I mean. You're asking me to repeat myself? I'm just trying to understand.

Okay, fair enough.

You wrote that Jesus' cry of being forsaken was an appeal to the futility of humanity.

I responded to this claim with a post that argues it is instead an expression of judgment on sin.

Thus I DID respond to EXACTLY what you wrote.

If you don't like it, that's a different story.
 
Okay, fair enough.

You wrote that Jesus' cry of being forsaken was an appeal to the futility of humanity.

I responded to this claim with a post that argues it is instead an expression of judgment on sin.

Thus I DID respond to EXACTLY what you wrote.

If you don't like it, that's a different story.

I expected something relative to the "futility of humanity". Not an argument based upon "payment for sin".

If you believe your view is plausible then consider my own "plausible" or tell me why it isn't.

Jesus "gave up the "ghost". He left His physical body. He did not abandon it. He arose from the grave. Using these facts relative to believing God actually "turned His back" on the Son isn't being accurate with the facts.
 
Okay, fair enough.

You wrote that Jesus' cry of being forsaken was an appeal to the futility of humanity.

I responded to this claim with a post that argues it is instead an expression of judgment on sin.

Thus I DID respond to EXACTLY what you wrote.

If you don't like it, that's a different story.
Or another viable option is its a proclamation He is the Messiah. :)



The messianic passage of Psalm 22 was played out before their very eyes, and Jesus quotes the opening verse letting His persecutors know that He truly is the Son of God, the Messiah, by quoting Psalm 22. The passage was being lived out before all witnesses of the crucifixion. It is a proclamation and a declaration that He is the Messiah, God's One and Only Son who gave His life as a ransom for many.

What the Father did allow to happen and not rescue His Son from was His death and suffering from those wicked leaders to be our sacrifice for sin. The entire weight of that was upon Him to bear alone, but the Father never left Him. He was there hearing His prayers and answering them upon His death. Moreover, let us not forget Jesus' promise to the sinner, "Today, you will be with me in paradise Luke 23:4." For God so loved the world that He gave His Only Begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him will not perish but have everlasting life. The Trinity was never fractured, broken, or severed for even a moment, but together, the Godhead accomplished salvation for sinners.

It was a Triune effort that worked out to perfection as They had planned from the very beginning. Furthermore, when this reconciliation took place at the cross, we read that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself - 2 Corinthians 5:19. The book of Romans states that "God demonstrated His love for us that while we were still sinners Christ died for us" (Romans 5:8). So Jesus' sacrificial atonement both propitiates (turns away God’s wrath) and expiates (covers our sins). Gods’ wrath does not fall on the sacrifice. Scripture teaches us that sin was condemned in the flesh, not that Jesus was condemned (Romans 8:3).



Psalm 22
My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?
Far from my deliverance are the words of my groaning.
2 O my God, I cry by day, but You do not answer;
And by night, but I have no rest.
3 Yet You are holy,
O You who are enthroned upon the praises of Israel.
4 In You our fathers trusted;
They trusted and You delivered them.
5 To You they cried out and were delivered;
In You they trusted and were not disappointed.
6 But I am a worm and not a man,
A reproach of men and despised by the people.
7 All who see me sneer at me;
They separate with the lip, they wag the head, saying,
8 “Commit yourself to the Lord; let Him deliver him;
Let Him rescue him, because He delights in him.”
9 Yet You are He who brought me forth from the womb;
You made me trust when upon my mother’s breasts.
10 Upon You I was cast from birth;
You have been my God from my mother’s womb.
11 Be not far from me, for trouble is near;
For there is none to help.
12 Many bulls have surrounded me;
Strong bulls of Bashan have encircled me.
13 They open wide their mouth at me,
As a ravening and a roaring lion.
14 I am poured out like water,
And all my bones are out of joint;
My heart is like wax;
It is melted within me.
15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd,
And my tongue cleaves to my jaws;
And You lay me in the dust of death.
16 For dogs have surrounded me;
A band of evildoers has encompassed me;
They pierced my hands and my feet.
17 I can count all my bones.
They look, they stare at me;
18 They divide my garments among them,
And for my clothing they cast lots.
19 But You, O Lord, be not far off;
O You my help, hasten to my assistance.
20 Deliver my soul from the sword,
My only life from the power of the dog.
21 Save me from the lion’s mouth;
From the horns of the wild oxen You answer me.
22 I will tell of Your name to my brethren;
In the midst of the assembly I will praise You.
23 You who fear the Lord, praise Him;
All you descendants of Jacob, glorify Him,
And stand in awe of Him, all you of Israel.
24 For He has not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted;
Nor has He hidden His face from him
;
But when he cried to Him for help, He heard.
25 From You comes my praise in the great assembly;
I shall pay my vows before those who fear Him.
26 The afflicted will eat and be satisfied;
Those who seek Him will praise the Lord.
Let your heart live forever!
27 All the ends of the earth will remember and turn to the Lord,
And all the families of the nations will worship before You.
28 For the kingdom is the Lord’s
And He rules over the nations.
29 All the prosperous of the earth will eat and worship,
All those who go down to the dust will bow before Him,
Even he who cannot keep his soul alive.
30 Posterity will serve Him;
It will be told of the Lord to the coming generation.
31 They will come and will declare His righteousness
To a people who will be born, that He has performed it.

hope this helps!!!
 
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