A Personal Reflection on the Trinity and Salvation

[Runningman]

so you are countering the polytheist view that says there are multiple gods. You are not countering the orthodox recognition of Jesus as the same God and who had glory with the Father before his incarnation as implied in Joh 17:5. Again, your error is that you do not consider John 17:5 or Jesus existing before Abraham or any of the many other passages. How are we to take your arguments seriously when you cannot properly explain those pre-existence passages?

Yet we have John 17:3 debunking the theories that Jesus is God. So in light of that, what is a better way to interpret what comes after it?

 

[civic]

Only means sole, singular, so yeah it refers to exclusivity quite easily. When someone is the only one of something then they're the sole individual. Hence the Father is the exclusive true God.

What's your workaround for 1 Corinthians 8:6 and Ephesians 4:6?

Oh you mean like when it says Jesus is the

ONLY LORD, SOVEREIGN, SAVIOR

Next fallacy

 

[Jay]

I believe in the full doctrine of the Incarnation to the full dogma of the absolute deity of Christ.

‘Perfect God and perfect Man.…
‘Who, although he be God and Man, yet he is not two, but one Christ.’

 

[Runningman]

Oh you mean like when it says Jesus is the

ONLY LORD, SOVEREIGN, SAVIOR

Next fallacy

I'm still working with you step by step.

What's your explanation for the Lord sending Jesus Christ if Jesus is the only Lord?

Acts 3
20that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that He may send Jesus, the Christ, who has been appointed for you.

 

[Runningman]

I believe in the full doctrine of the Incarnation to the full dogma of the absolute deity of Christ.

‘Perfect God and perfect Man.…
‘Who, although he be God and Man, yet he is not two, but one Christ.’

At least you rightly identify it as dogma, which I am comfortable with, but some of the others here have the problem of projecting their beliefs onto the Bible.

Are you Catholic btw?

 

[TomL]

Let's grant that Thomas is calling Jesus God here (I don't think he clearly is). That's after God raised Jesus up. So for the vast majority of Jesus ministry there's no evidence they believed he was God. Seems strange, why hide it. And were the disciples saved during those 3+ years?

What is not clear?

John 20:28 (NASB95) — 28 Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”

Why does Jesus respond?

John 20:29 (NASB95) — 29 Jesus said to him, “Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed.”

 

[TomL]

Only means sole, singular, so yeah it refers to exclusivity quite easily. When someone is the only one of something then they're the sole individual. Hence the Father is the exclusive true God.

What's your workaround for 1 Corinthians 8:6 and Ephesians 4:6?

Did you not see

1 Corinthians 8:6 (NASB95) — 6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

Jesus is called the one Lord.

 

[360watt]

Three of those five points contained scriptures (the other two are human conjecture). None of those three would a person of average intelligence and without preconception take to mean that Jesus is God, much less the trinity.

The father is clearly and undeniably said to be God many times. I wonder why the bible isn't anywhere near as clear about the son being God? I mean, God could have made it just as clear very easily. Perhaps because that's not what the Bible's trying to communicate, because it isn't true. That seems to be the most obvious reason.

If Jesus straight out said He was God early on it would have endangered others and messed with the God ordained timing of the crucifixion and resurrection as people would have immediately taken Him.

Aside from that..if He isnt God..He would have to be mortal. I don't know any mortal that can see someone when they are nowhere them. Jesus saw Nathaneal when He was nowhere near Nathaneal.

Jesus forgave sin of those who hadn’t directly offended Him.. that is the work of God.

Jesus accepted worship from Thomas and others.

He claimed to exist before Abraham as the one who spoke at the burning bush.

It goes on and on


I know you will say these are things given by the Fathers authority..but that doesn't address His powers being above and beyond the disciples and apostles.

 

[Runningman]

Did you not see

1 Corinthians 8:6 (NASB95) — 6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

Jesus is called the one Lord.

Context matters. One Lord for the church, yes. One Lord only? No.

What's your explanation for the Lord sending Jesus Christ if Jesus is the only Lord?

Acts 3
20that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that He may send Jesus, the Christ, who has been appointed for you.

 

[Jay]

At least you rightly identify it as dogma, which I am comfortable with, but some of the others here have the problem of projecting their beliefs onto the Bible.

Are you Catholic btw?

The way I use "Dogma" as a core set of beliefs, particularly in a religious context, . I use it mostly to describe my belief in the trinity that is held without questioning.
non denominational

 

[mikesw]

Only means sole, singular, so yeah it refers to exclusivity quite easily. When someone is the only one of something then they're the sole individual. Hence the Father is the exclusive true God.

What's your workaround for 1 Corinthians 8:6 and Ephesians 4:6?

I read these verses often because you post them often. I still do not see these denying Christ Jesus being part of the Godhead. As a hyperliteralist you should expect a verse saying "Jesus is not of the Godhead."
So in Ephesians 4:6 (NASB95)
6one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.

Then in Colossians 1:17 (NASB95)
17He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.

These shows the Father and the Son into quite a union. And see also the natural pairing of the Father and his Son. Hard to miss unless you need glasses.