It seems that you miss that Joel is prophesying of Jesus and uses Yahweh. Yahweh does not get omitted in Romans 10:13 just because the time for them to call upon Yahweh has arrived. Maybe Peterlag can explain how the prophesy of Joel 2:32 is fulfilled if it no longer is Yahweh that they have to confess is Lord and thus call upon him.
Your Views on The Trinity
- Thread starter Cyrus
- Start date
Great, because this demonstrates Jesus is YHWH.
Their denials of the divinity of Jesus start failing rather quickly.
The arguments quickly descend into utter madness.
Peterlag
Active Member
Nope. Two different "Lords"
DavidTree
Active Member
Joel 2:32 is YHWH
30“And I will show wonders in the heavens and in the earth:
Blood and fire and pillars of smoke.
31The sun shall be turned into darkness,
And the moon into blood,
Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord.
32And it shall come to pass
That whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Shall be saved.
For in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there shall be [m]deliverance,
As the Lord has said,
Among the remnant whom the Lord calls.
Same YHWH in Acts chapter 2
20The sun shall be turned into darkness,
And the moon into blood,
Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord.
21And it shall come to pass
That whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Shall be saved.’
Same YHWH in Acts chapter 4
12Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”
Peterlag
Active Member
Nobody in the Old Testament got saved by calling on the name of the Lord. Nobody. This should have been taught in second grade.
By third grade they teach about prophecy. There have been some decent Sunday School classes that taught how prophecy speaks of a future era. As such Joel 2:32 does not provide a message of salvation for the OT era but rather for the New Testament. And it is subsequently mentioned at various times in the NT. I'm not sure why that is such a complex concept.
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There is 0 doubt its a quote of Joel 2:21-22
0 doubt-acts 2:21--Rom 10:13 are quote of Joel 2:21-22
DavidTree
Active Member
More self deception coming from you.
You have been pawned by the enemy to believe what you believe.
Right. The only limitation is there is no word for Yahweh in the Greek when then mention Jesus as Lord in Rom 10:9 and 13. I'm glad I could help.
Peterlag
Active Member
Acts 2:21 and Romans 10:13 pertain to Christ. Joel 2:21-22 is referred to the coming of Christ. This is not rocket science. This conversation started when I pointed out that there's no verse in the Bible that says we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. Calling on the name of Jesus be it Acts, Romans, or foretold from Joel is not saying we should believe or confess that Jesus is God.
Runningman
Active Member
They should just begin with asking "Where does Bible define God as three persons?" But it would be boring listening to Trinitarians chase their tale for hours and produce nothing. Better sound bites and better for progress to keep the discussion going.
I purposely was being quiet about my preference of sides in the post of the video. So, it is shared for anyone interested in arguments from both sides of the debate. The NT version will be between two of them instead of four people next week.
i guess you recognize that the unitarians failed to say anything useful. I do not think that one question would have lasted four hours. But it was a balanced debate format. Each side presented their main argument and they had time for counter arguments and then cross examinations. Both sides had a good recollection of scriptures being discussed in the debate.
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Peterlag
Active Member
If the Trinity folks tell me that Jesus is a man...
That he was indeed a man while he was on the earth because he emptied himself of his Godhood (which is not stated anywhere in Scripture. That Jesus emptied himself of his Godhood).If they say this every time I post Jesus is the son of God, the Messiah to Israel, and the now resurrected Lord Christ to the Christian who sits at the right hand of God as second in command and is the head of the Church that is called the body of Christ.
Then there's no way I can win. I should then just go fishing.
Thanks, because this demonstrates Jesus is "the Lord our God".
Joel 2:32
And it shall come to pass that whosoever shall call on the Name of the Lord shall be saved; for in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.
Acts 2:21, 39
21 And it shall come to pass that whosoever shall call on the Name of the Lord shall be saved.
39 For the promise is unto you and to your children and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Runningman
Active Member
The Father is called YHWH, the Son is not called YHWH, therefore Jesus isn't YHWH. Means Jesus isn't God.
Peterlag affirms the "Lord" in Acts 2:21 refers to Jesus, but you don't.
Love it!
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