"Works Salvation"

[DavidTree]

Well, I know I should so yes I do want to know. Please

this gave me a good wholesome lol - thank you and Good late morning

Also = fresh ground coffee at my house = all who love the LORD are welcome

 

[DavidTree]

So water cannot save us because it is wet??????? Huh??????

1 Pet 3:21 says that the water of the Flood is symbolic of what now saves you: baptism. The Flood was the symbol, not baptism. But the baptism that saves us must have water (John 3:5) to fit the symbol.

Peter begins with water???

i do not see water in verse 18

 

[Jim]

Its interpreting the word.

have you actually stuidied the greek word? Have you studied greek histroy and how the word was used. Do youi uinderstand in greek society what a baptizer did?

it does not appear like it.. Your taking an english translation and a church translation. and missing the whole word.

No, I am taking the meaning of a Greek word from a Greek dictionary.

I translated it literally using a possible interpretation for the greek word Baptizo.

According to whom? You? No thank you.

so is being placed into

If I am immersed or placed into something, does it matter what word I use.

of course not

Immerse and place into are not the same. I have not seen any Greek interpretation of "baptzo" that means placed into. I can place water into a bucket, but that is not what the word "baptizo" could mean.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

I have studied the word "baptizo" in the Greek, and it is used to mean "to immerse," "to submerge," or "to dip". It can also imply cleansing by immersion, or even being overwhelmed.

thank you.

Do you know what a "baptizer" was in the greek, it was an occupation. what did he do?

But again, there is only one immersion/baptism in the NT Church.

This is not true.

I already proved this

baptism in the HS and fire is not water
Baptized into moses is not water

And it is not "Spirit immersion/baptism", although the Spirit is definitely involved in baptism/immersion. The one baptism/immersion in the NT Church requires/demands/is not NT baptism without water (1 Pet 3:21) and human action (Matt 28:19). Without water and human action you don't have NT baptism/immersion.

Why does circumcision not save, but water does?

And how was an OT believer saved apart from water baptism?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

No, I am taking the meaning of a Greek word from a Greek dictionary.

well I do not know what dictionary you took it from. but it is seriously lacking

According to whom? You? No thank you.

Immerse and place into are not the same. I have not seen any Greek interpretation of "baptzo" that means placed into. I can place water into a bucket, but that is not what the word "baptizo" could mean.

lol

The jews being baptized into moses. Can you explain how they were immersed into moses?

 

[Jim]

John the baptist

I indeed baptize in water, he will baptize with the hs and fire

Jesus. You will be baptized with the HS

Paul. they were baptized into moses.

so you are both wrong on all counts

None of that changes what I posted concerning Matthew 28. Moreover, the meaning of baptize in Matthew 28 cannot be referring to baptism of the Holy Spirit, because the reference there is what the apostles (and we) are commanded to do. There is no command in all of the NT that the apostles or anyone were commanded to baptize with the Holy Spirit.

 

[FreeInChrist]

So water cannot save us because it is wet??????? Huh??????

1 Pet 3:21 says that the water of the Flood is symbolic of what now saves you: baptism. The Flood was the symbol, not baptism. But the baptism that saves us must have water (John 3:5) to fit the symbol.

You are missing something.

They did not get wet in the flood.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

So water cannot save us because it is wet??????? Huh??????

what work of the law was required for salvation?

1 Pet 3:21 says that the water of the Flood is symbolic of what now saves you: baptism. The Flood was the symbol, not baptism. But the baptism that saves us must have water (John 3:5) to fit the symbol.

no. It says the waters of the flood is another symbols. just as water baptism is.

it does not remove filth of the flesh (sin)

its the answer of a good consciousness to God./.

what saves us? the resurrection of Christ.

 

[Jim]

You can good grief all you want. Cornelius was a forgiven man way b4 Peter preached to him to believe.

The Bible makes no such claim. It is only you clinging to your false doctrines making that claim. And you are wrong!

 

[Jim]

@brightfame52 @Jim

Of course he was, and this can be easily proven.

Then do it.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

None of that changes what I posted concerning Matthew 28. Moreover, the meaning of baptize in Matthew 28

Matt 28 is believers baptism.

we were not even discussing matt 28. see how you have totally changed things.. then again, I have come to expect that from you.. Remeber, you say you do not believe our works saves us.

cannot be referring to baptism of the Holy Spirit, because the reference there is what the apostles (and we) are commanded to do.

I never said it did now did I. Now your a false accuser.

There is no command in all of the NT that the apostles or anyone were commanded to baptize with the Holy Spirit.

because spirit baptism is not a command

I was not commanded to be baptized into christ. I was not commanded into his death, I was not commanded to be baptized into his body (rom 6 1 cor 12 and gal 5)

we are told those events happened to us..

 

[DavidTree]

Eph 2: 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
2: 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

IOW..Faith is not considered a work in the context of salvation; rather, it is viewed as a gift from God that does not rely on human effort. The Bible teaches that we are saved by grace through faith, not by our works

Requiring anything in addition to faith in Jesus Christ for salvation is a works-based salvation. To add anything to the gospel is to say that Jesus’ death on the cross was not sufficient to purchase our salvation. To say that baptism is necessary for salvation is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ’s death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus’ death alone paid for our sins

But you all are certainly entitled to your opinions....

What you said here in your post, God Commanded Beforehand = Exodus 31:12-17

12And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 13“Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: ‘Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you. 14You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. 15Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. 16Therefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the Sabbath throughout their generations as a perpetual covenant. 17It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever; for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day He rested and was refreshed.’ ”

 

[Jim]

Matt 28 is believers baptism.

we were not even discussing matt 28. see how you have totally changed things.. then again, I have come to expect that from you.. Remeber, you say you do not believe our works saves us.

@DavidTree mentioned Matthew 28:19 in Reply #2617. I simply expanded on the meaning of the word baptize in that verse. Get of that High Horse you ride all the time and you just might learn something.

 

[Jim]

I never said it did now did I. Now your a false accuser.

Yeah you did. Go back and look at your reply #2602

 

[Jim]

Matt 28 is believers baptism.

As if you even knew what that is.

 

[brightfame52]

i love Acts ch10/Cornelius

Before Peter was sent by the Lord to Cornelius we know that he was hearing the Word of God thru the Jewish people.
For the FATHER was already at work in Cornelius heart

There is a GREAT Precedent that God set in Acts chapter = can you see it

Yes the word of Salvation is sent to them that are fearing God, the regenerated, for they are the good ground hearers. Acts 13:26

Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

The good ground hearer Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

See a heart that fears God is good by regeneration, and when it hears and receives the word, he will spiritually understand bear fruit, faith

 

[brightfame52]

The Bible makes no such claim. It is only you clinging to your false doctrines making that claim. And you are wrong!

Says a person who has zero understanding of the bible

 

[DavidTree]

Yes the word of Salvation is sent to them that are fearing God, the regenerated, for they are the good ground hearers. Acts 13:26

Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

The good ground hearer Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

See a heart that fears God is good by regeneration, and when it hears and receives the word, he will spiritually understand bear fruit, faith

this is TRUTH which you posted AND it is a "precedent" set by the LJC in His Gospel

there is another Precedent, established beforehand, AND is being EXPRESSED in Acts ch10

@Tothalordbeallglory @Red Baker

 

[brightfame52]

this is TRUTH which you posted AND it is a "precedent" set by the LJC in His Gospel

there is another Precedent, established beforehand, AND is being EXPRESSED in Acts ch10

@Tothalordbeallglory @Red Baker

LJC ?

 

[DavidTree]

LJC ?

Lord Jesus Christ