Who is the creator

[charismaticlady]

The Spirit lets me know that you are not anointed by Him, when you teach such error, which contradicts Scripture.

May I ask what background you have for your beliefs you say come from the Holy Spirit?

Catholic
Lutheran
Reformed Calvinist
Protestant - which one
Pentecostal
Nothing

 

[FreeInChrist]

All thought stops on the day of ones death-He was in hades( grave=dead) for 3 days.

We know that... The apostles creed tells us that.... But you do not know why he was there and you have no proof it was for 3 entire days....

Bible: Ephesians 4:9 and 1 Peter 3:18-20, are interpreted to suggest that He went to the realm of the dead after His crucifixion. This descent is often understood as a means to proclaim victory over sin and death or to bring salvation to the righteous who had died before His resurrection

Quit guessing and quit lying and do your own research if you want to know more...... I am done with long explanations to you.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Interesting.

Just think of this... the definition of polytheism is.

polytheism /pŏl′ē-thē-ĭz″əm, pŏl″ē-thē′ĭz-əm/

noun​

1. The worship of or belief in more than one god.
2. The doctrine of, or belief in, a plurality of gods.
3. The belief of the existence of many gods.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition

No matter how often, or by who the JW are challenged on John 1 :1 NWT from the JW.ORG "STUDY BIBle" they defend this......

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.

Go along a little further

2) This one was in the beginning with God.
3 ) All things came into existence through him and apart from him not even one thing came into existence.

So the JW is claiming this "little" god (and it is safe to say they regard this as a person and not merely words from our Fathers mouth because they have capitalized the W... like in most other translations they find fault with)

So this little God, according to them was in the beginning with Jehovah, and everything came into existence by this little god.

IS IT ANY WONDER WHY THEY WILL NEVER ACCEPT THAT JESUS WAS/IS GOD?( If you disagree with this @charismaticlady lets not get into that now) They cannot because these are 2 separate gods. Jehova and the Word.

And with two separate gods... that is polytheism.... and they will scream and hollar but it is fact.....

Boy....

BTW... This is the link to the translation I usually use as this is the one they evidentlly get their people with these days... John 1 https://www.jw.org/en/library/bible/study-bible/books/john/1/

 

[FreeInChrist]

There are two different types of sin:
sins unto death
sins not unto death

1 John 3 is only about sins unto death, not sins not unto death.

Lawlessness is breaking any of the Ten Commandments of God. verse 4 and 24

When the New Covenant was prophesied in the Old Testament, and repeated in the New, it said God would literally write His laws on our hearts. They would become part of us, our new nature. For instance, think of something you would never do, like suicide, or murder. Then look at what you said:



Understand?

Yes, I understand the distinction you’re making. My hesitation isn’t about whether Scripture can distinguish kinds of sin, but whether John himself is doing that in this passage.

I don’t see John signaling a shift in categories when he moves from chapter 1 to chapter 3, nor do I see him restricting “sin” in 3:4–9 to what you’re calling sins unto death. That’s why I understand “cannot sin” in terms of a settled pattern rather than an absolute category of acts.

So when I said John isn’t saying a believer never commits a sin, I wasn’t denying moral seriousness ~I was trying to read 3:9 in continuity with 1:8 and the rest of the letter.

Now look at 1 John 1:7 about sins not unto death. While walking in the Spirit/Light after all our sins unto death have been taken away from our nature (1 John 3:5) and He's made us righteous (not holy yet where we never stumble even unintentionally, 2 Peter 1:5-11) the unintentional slight imperfections still abhorrent to the perfect Father, Jesus as our Advocate, still cleanses them as He is still in the process of maturing every one of the fruit of the Spirit, just as He cleansed sins unto death from us before we repented as one in the unsaved world. As the Finisher of our faith, even those He will complete, Phil. 1:6.

1 John 1:7 shows also we now have fellowship with the Father because of the complete cleansing from Jesus and His powerful blood. This is not talking about recommitting a sin unto death. In fact, in 1 John 5:16-17 we are not even suppose to pray for a brother or sister that has gone back to sins unto death. Because we still have free will, those sins are willful disobedience, not slight imperfections. Read Hebrews 10:26-31. I've heard many false teachers even try to twist that passage to being only to Jews. Nope! It is our apostasy. Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.:

This problem with misunderstanding the two types of sin started in the Reformation when instead of teaching what I just explained, they lumped the two types of sin together in the doctrine, "sin is sin." And even though there is no such thing as a real doctrine of sinless perfection, righteousness is sinlessness of only sins unto death, and holiness is perfection of even slight imperfections from immature fruit of the Spirit. Only after that (Phil. 1:6) could we ever say we are in a state of "sinless perfection."

For further study on these two types go back to our schoolmaster and study Numbers 15:22-36 about sins not unto death first, and then notice there was no sacrifice for sins unto death for God's people.

 

[charismaticlady]

Yes, I understand the distinction you’re making. My hesitation isn’t about whether Scripture can distinguish kinds of sin, but whether John himself is doing that in this passage.

I don’t see John signaling a shift in categories when he moves from chapter 1 to chapter 3, nor do I see him restricting “sin” in 3:4–9 to what you’re calling sins unto death. That’s why I understand “cannot sin” in terms of a settled pattern rather than an absolute category of acts.

So when I said John isn’t saying a believer never commits a sin, I wasn’t denying moral seriousness ~I was trying to read 3:9 in continuity with 1:8 and the rest of the letter.

Comparing 1 John 3:9 with 1 John 1:8 is simple. 1:8 (and 10, also 6) is before Christ; 3:9 is after being born again of the seed of the Father. Your clean nature has been freed from all desire to commit sins unto death. Unfortunately there are still people IN churches who have never been born again of the Spirit, and have never experienced the removal of the desire to commit lawlessness. It is a heaviness you actually can feel leave your body. That happened to me 30 years AFTER going to church, and 49 years ago.

John explains in more detail in 1 John 2:4. "He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

1 John 1:8 is the same as Romans 3:23 "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."

This is mankind that we all are part of. The very next verse tells us how to become a Christian so you "may not sin." 1 John 2:1.

Examine 1 John 1:9 "if you confess your sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS. I emphasize those words to ask you if you are still lying about having no sin? Exactly how much is "all unrighteousness" to you? When Jesus cleanses us of our past sins as I know you will agree with me, He doesn't leave the old sin nature in us to sin in the future. No. He takes away all desire to commit unrighteousness. That is as the Author of our faith. And as 1 John 2:4 above says it is about lawlessness - the breaking of God's commandments. Of the two types of sin, lawlessness are sins unto death, not immature fruit which from our justification is the next step Jesus takes in maturing the fruit of the Spirit which are sins not unto death that as we walk in the Spirit, abiding IN Him, He automatically cleanses those sins we are not even aware of. They are unintentional, just as Numbers 15:22-29 points out in that sacrifice. If you keep reading 30-36 you will see that the breaking of the smallest commandment produces DEATH.

Romans 6 is also about sins unto death in the crucifying of the old man (sin nature), and the resurrection of a clean new nature. To prove Paul's talking about sins unto death, he says at the end, the wages of sin is death. Not all sin, just lawlessness. Even with a clean nature you are not perfect, but can be if you remain abiding in Christ. John 15:1-4. Philippians 1:6.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Comparing 1 John 3:9 with 1 John 1:8 is simple. 1:8 (and 10, also 6) is before Christ; 3:9 is after being born again of the seed of the Father. Your clean nature has been freed from all desire to commit sins unto death. Unfortunately there are still people IN churches who have never been born again of the Spirit, and have never experienced the removal of the desire to commit lawlessness. It is a heaviness you actually can feel leave your body. That happened to me 30 years AFTER going to church, and 49 years ago.

Well stated. Yes, there are those who have not had that spiritual rebirth but I suppose they may not even want it?

Many just feel that they " believe" what they have been taught to believe, or that they were saved before the foundations of the world and are comfortable in their own miserable skin. I had a boss like that . I could tell quite a story on that one but I will not as he died 30 or 35 years ago and no sense smearing the dead.

But the desire to remove committing lawlessness and sin is most definitely there, though in truth for some, it can be a struggle but one well worth it.

John explains in more detail in 1 John 2:4. "He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."

1 John 1:8 is the same as Romans 3:23 "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."

This is mankind that we all are part of. The very next verse tells us how to become a Christian so you "may not sin." 1 John 2:1.

Examine 1 John 1:9 "if you confess your sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS. I emphasize those words to ask you if you are still lying about having no sin? Exactly how much is "all unrighteousness" to you? When Jesus cleanses us of our past sins as I know you will agree with me, He doesn't leave the old sin nature in us to sin in the future. No. He takes away all desire to commit unrighteousness. That is as the Author of our faith. And as 1 John 2:4 above says it is about lawlessness - the breaking of God's commandments. Of the two types of sin, lawlessness are sins unto death, not immature fruit which from our justification is the next step Jesus takes in maturing the fruit of the Spirit which are sins not unto death that as we walk in the Spirit, abiding IN Him, He automatically cleanses those sins we are not even aware of. They are unintentional, just as Numbers 15:22-29 points out in that sacrifice. If you keep reading 30-36 you will see that the breaking of the smallest commandment produces DEATH.

Romans 6 is also about sins unto death in the crucifying of the old man (sin nature), and the resurrection of a clean new nature. To prove Paul's talking about sins unto death, he says at the end, the wages of sin is death. Not all sin, just lawlessness. Even with a clean nature you are not perfect, but can be if you remain abiding in Christ. John 15:1-4. Philippians 1:6.

 

[charismaticlady]

But the desire to remove committing lawlessness and sin is most definitely there, though in truth for some, it can be a struggle but one well worth it.

I'm not sure exactly what you are saying.

Are you clear now on the difference between 1 John 1:8 and 1 John 3:9?

 

[FreeInChrist]

I'm not sure exactly what you are saying.

Are you clear now on the difference between 1 John 1:8 and 1 John 3:9?

YES

 

[charismaticlady]

YES

Wonderful! Few there are who find it.

 

[JesusFan]

And how many don’t have it? What would you say the ratio is; 100 to 1, 500 to 1?

One other thought; the nature of scholarly research is not to “fit the mold”, but to establish a verifiable understanding of something. After a long period of time, a reliable pattern is established that creates a consensus in, and a consistency of established understanding and thereby truth constants that are stabilizing factors.

To suggest diverting from that established understanding requires a mountain of evidence to prove the validity of the argument that it should be different. That’s why doctoral dissertations have to be presented and proven to a panel of experts to validate the theory of the concept being presented by the student.

2000 years of research and examination by people who are seeking the truth about reality have agreed that the language and intent of the NT writers is to establish that Jesus is God the son! If you don’t agree, that’s your right, but you don’t alter the evidence that says differently to make your argument.

Doug

At least someone like the unitarian Dr thayer agreed that the NT taught jesus is God, even though he disagreed with it

 

[JesusFan]

Because they are not reputable--Any reputable scholar would support Gods will by putting his name back where he willed it in his bible( its not mans bible) because he wants it there, The unreputable Greek scholars refuse because they know it exposes their trinity god and those religions as false.

The JW Kingdom Interlinear used as Greek text the 'catholic' Greek NT though

 

[JesusFan]

I don't need to. The teachings of Jesus are clear--John 1:1 contradicts him to the core. In the same book of John Jesus teaches-17:3-The one who sent him= Father = THE ONLY TRUE GOD verse 6=YHVH(Jehovah, Verse 26= YHVH(Jehovah--See one of them would be a liar standing against each other in contradiction in your altered bibles. My post about John 1:1 is pure fact.

even though every reputable and recognized Koine Greek scholar disagrees that can be translated as "the word was a god?"

 

[JesusFan]

Then tell us all which one is a liar-John? or Jesus because in the same book of John at 17:1-6,26--Jesus teaches-The one who sent him= Father is THE ONLY TRUE GOD=100% contradiction of the Word being called capitol G God at John 1:1-- So please tell us who lied. Otherwise my facts i present are 100% truth that takes away the contradiction found in all the altered bibles that mislead to destruction.

Same Jesus also stated that He existed in heaven and shared i the very glory of God, can ANY other then God share in that glory?

 

[TibiasDad]

At least someone like the unitarian Dr thayer agreed that the NT taught jesus is God, even though he disagreed with it

Agreed! He was an honest scholar!


Doug

 

[Keiw1]

The Son Exalted Above Angels​

Hebrews 1: 5 For to which of the angels did He ever say:

“You are My Son,
Today I have begotten You”?
And again:

“I will be to Him a Father,
And He shall be to Me a Son”?

6 But when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says:

“Let all the angels of God worship Him.”

7 And of the angels He says:

“Who makes His angels spirits
And His ministers a flame of fire.”

8 But to the Son He says:

“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”

10 And:

“You, Lord, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
11 They will perish, but You remain;
And they will all grow old like a garment;
12 Like a cloak You will fold them up,
And they will be changed.
But You are the same,
And Your years will not fail.”

13 But to which of the angels has He ever said:

“Sit at My right hand,
Till I make Your enemies Your footstool”?

14 Are they not all ministering spirits sent forth to minister for those who will inherit salvation?

I just showed you 1:4-- thus your religion twists 1:5

 

[Keiw1]

We know that... The apostles creed tells us that.... But you do not know why he was there and you have no proof it was for 3 entire days....

Bible: Ephesians 4:9 and 1 Peter 3:18-20, are interpreted to suggest that He went to the realm of the dead after His crucifixion. This descent is often understood as a means to proclaim victory over sin and death or to bring salvation to the righteous who had died before His resurrection

Quit guessing and quit lying and do your own research if you want to know more...... I am done with long explanations to you.

It is 100% proof of the comma error in what Jesus said to the thief. Interpreted by the darkness.

 

[Keiw1]

The JW Kingdom Interlinear used as Greek text the 'catholic' Greek NT though

Much of it was correct. Its all that remained. God fixed his bible via holy spirit=NWT.

 

[Keiw1]

even though every reputable and recognized Koine Greek scholar disagrees that can be translated as "the word was a god?"

Trinity Greek scholars=mislead deceivers.

 

[Keiw1]

Same Jesus also stated that He existed in heaven and shared i the very glory of God, can ANY other then God share in that glory?

He was in heaven-He is the firstborn of all creation( Col 1:15-16) = created direct-first and last=only begotten son.

 

[charismaticlady]

He was in heaven-He is the firstborn of all creation( Col 1:15-16) = created direct-first and last=only begotten son.

Jesus is the ruler of all creation. Jesus was not created; He is the Creator! Firstborn means ruler. Just as King David was called firstborn, though he had many older brothers.