Explain yourself.
Transmitting The Fallen Nature
- Thread starter Olde Tymer
- Start date
GeneZ
Well-known member
You deny what I just presented in not the Word of God?
"From birth I was cast upon you; from my mother's womb you have been my God." Psalm 22:10
God can not make God to be His God! Only humanity can do that!
You still can not think in the abstract way needed, and is required at times to grasp the Word of God "by faith."
......... Faith rest is the nesting place for what believers will need to accept something by faith....
If Jesus Himself says He was forsaken? Do not call it a lie, and try to rationalize it so it can fit Him into the box that suits your finite thinking.
Instead, you should question your old perspective. Then seek to find out how his being forsaken was possible with Scripture.
Catholics fight such thinking and hate it when Scripture smacks them between their dogmatized eyes.
You do too!
"And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven."
Try that on a catholic.
Then study how they respond.
You will be seeing them do what you now do in reference to the humanity of Jesus being forsaken on the Cross.
...........
Jesus didn't have to blind anyone, we were all born blind, deaf and dumb in respect to knowing God. He spoke in parables to expose those who preferred the darkness and reveled in their blindness, thinking themselves to be wise, yet in reality, "stupid is as stupid does".Jesus hid the truth to everyone but the 12. Blinded them, kept the truth hidden from them so seeing they wouldn’t see and hearing they would not hear. His deity was veiled and so was the truth He taught
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What you are talking about here has nothing to do with Christ's Incarnation and the statement in Phillipians.
Phil.2:5-7
5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, 6 who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.
You and I are to have the same mindset. He veiled His deity so He could function solely as a man. He didn't consider Himself as God while He walked the earth. We are to be of that same mind and not consider ourselves to be our own "god" thinking we know anything and can do whatever we please. The difference of course is that He is God and could in fact do whatever pleased Him and he knew everything. But He set before us how we are to walk, by grace through faith in the filling of the Spirit, relying solely on God for all we need.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Why did Satan tempt Jesus to turn the stones into bread?Jesus hid the truth to everyone but the 12. Blinded them, kept the truth hidden from them so seeing they wouldn’t see and hearing they would not hear. His deity was veiled and so was the truth He taught
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How was it a temptation?
I'd like to be able to turn stones into bread ... and dirty dishes into clean ones and an unmade bed to being made and dirty floors into clean ones. sigh. The only temptation I have to suffer along those lines is "stuff the cooking and housework, let's go watch a movie".
Oh and in answer to your question is ... because He is God and had the power within himself to do it. But if He had then Phillipians couldn't say:
"did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men."
... because he would have grasped God's power from within Himself and He would not be in the likeness of men as men cannot turn stones into bread.
GeneZ
Well-known member
I'd like to be able to turn stones into bread ... and dirty dishes into clean ones and an unmade bed to being made and dirty floors into clean ones. sigh. The only temptation I have to suffer along those lines is "stuff the cooking and housework, let's go watch a movie".
Oh and in answer to your question is ... because He is God and had the power within himself to do it. But if He had then Phillipians couldn't say:
"did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men."
... because he would have grasped God's power from within Himself and He would not be in the likeness of men as men cannot turn stones into bread.
That is correct.. yup!
IF he turned the stones into bread?
He would have taken back up the life he had to lay down as God.
Producing bread from His own Deity would have INSTANTLY disqualified Him to die in our place as a man.
For a LAMB WITHOUT SPOT OR BLEMISH WAS REQUIRED! Not God!
He faced the deaths (plurality) on the Cross (all our deaths) all while being the most beloved man ever to be known by God.
God knows this will take time with many...
He is not angry when some need more time to work it out.
But, the devil will be working overtime to pressure those believers to not accept this truth. That part is painful.
It must be endured till we break through to grasping the truth by God's grace.
The devil will want us to be robbed of the riches that this gold and silver and precious stones this doctrine offers.
The devil will keep trying to sell us on some rationalized substitution for the truth.
" Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you."
James 4:7
James 4:7
grace and peace.....
civic
Well-known member
GeneZ
Well-known member
Chapter and verse?
And, while your at it. Tell me how turning the stones into bread could be a temptation to the humanity of Jesus.
You do not even know yet what Satan asked means in the Greek.
For Satan KNEW Jesus was God... from knowing Him prior the incarnation.
Was he tempting Jesus to prove he was God? NO!
What was the temptation wanting to produce then?
Tempt Jesus to get Him to stop being as a man. As a man that he had to remain being
to get to the Cross, and pay the price for all men's sins, AS A MAN!
Got anymore pop quizzes to divert to, so you do not have to answer a question?
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GeneZ
Well-known member
You sound like someone who leans to much on the KJV.
The Jews tested God - not tempted God - in the wilderness.
In Matthew 4:3 Satan was not testing Jesus to prove he is God.
For in the Greek of Matthew 4:3 Satan began by acknowledging that He already knew Jesus was God.
The problem Satan faced was how to trick Jesus by tempting Him to resort back to being as God and stop being as a man....
...........................
Actually, Jesus performed a ton of miracles, the biggest one being bringing Lazarus back from the dead. So tell me how your Arian/Nestorian thinking explains how the making of bread is a temptation whereas bringing back Lazarus from the dead is not. I'll be waiting.....
And by the way, Happy New Year to everyone!
civic
Well-known member
Same word in the Greek but of course since you don’t know Greek you wouldn’t know that right
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The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
Turning stones into bread would have been a selfish miracle. Jesus didn't heal the sick and raise Lazarus for his own physical benefit.
GeneZ
Well-known member
With your line of logic concerning miracles?
Moses could be construed to have been God.
and Paul healed many people supernaturally.
You are not breaking it down correctly.
I also see you are still resorting to using catch phrases like Arian/Nestorian.
You do that like ANTIFA calling conservatives fascists.'
GeneZ
Well-known member
What Greek class condition is the word "if" in Matthew 4:3?
And, be careful. Some who visit here are students of the Greek.
Don't embarrass yourself. "First class conditional clause" _ Matthew 4:3.
Trouble with your negativity?
Its robbing yourself of learning and benefitting what you might receive from this simple man.
civic
Well-known member
GeneZ
Well-known member
Matthew 4:3. The word translated "if" is in the first class condition.
Meaning? Satan was acknowledging Jesus was God.
Satan was not testing Jesus to prove he is God.
You are playing games by diverting and resorting to using the King James
to translate it "tempt" when the meaning is to "test."
No one in the OT was tempting God.
They were testing God. Testing him to prove that He is God, by saying He was not God..
In contrast to your diversion to the OT?
In Matthew 4:3 was just the opposite as to what took place.
Satan was not testing Jesus to prove He is God.
Satan was tempting Jesus, after acknowledging He is God, to stop functioning as a man!
After all that. Some may still benefit and learn something from this in spite of it.
civic
Well-known member
Nice bait n switch it’s the same word used with YHWH in the OT and with Jesus in the NT.
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GeneZ
Well-known member
Game playing time over sir.
You have no idea what Matthew 4:3 is really saying...
4:3 The tempter [emphasizes a function of the devil] came to him and said,
“If [does not express doubt; first class condition in Greek construction: the reality
of a condition affirmed from viewpoint of the speaker; can be translated “since”]
you are the Son of God [same title for Jesus used at His baptism (cf. Matt. 3:17)],
tell these stones to become bread.”
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The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
That's funny, I thought the OT was in Hebrew. The Septuagint is a translation, where interpretation takes place.
