civic
Well-known member
lol
Time in heaven
- Thread starter TomL
- Start date
You are running from the facts
God has plans
He is seen planning
He thinks
You failed to defend the idea God does not think
Psalm 92:5 (KJV 1900) — 5 O LORD, how great are thy works! And thy thoughts are very deep.
Isaiah 55:8 (KJV 1900) — 8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, Neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
once again you stand refuted
He cannot deal with the scriptural evidence
civic
Well-known member
Ditto
Obadiah
Well-known member
Easy, like where, when, and what. He did that when He said " Let's make man in our image".
According to biblical accounts, God’s statement “Let us make man in our image” Genesis 1:26, is a declaration of His intention to create humanity in a unique way. This phrase suggests a partnership or consultation between God and other divine entities, often interpreted as the Word (Jesus) and the Spirit (Holy Spirit).
civic
Well-known member
Yep
That in no way addresses my question.
How does a omniscient God plan something when He has always known plan?
How does a omniscient God plan something having always known?
You give it a whirl 40 years. How does a omniscient God plan something He has always known would occur. You two dodgers need 7 more dodgers and you will have your own baseball team.
Ask the scriptures you ignore
God has plans
He is seen planning
He thinks
You failed to defend the idea God does not think
Psalm 92:5 (KJV 1900) — 5 O LORD, how great are thy works! And thy thoughts are very deep.
Isaiah 55:8 (KJV 1900) — 8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, Neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
once again you stand refuted
LOL
The scripture are all the proof needed
God has plans
(2001) and that nation then turns from the bad; about the bad things I'd planned, I will then change My mind!
(ERV) But if the people of that nation change their hearts and lives and stop doing evil things, I will change my mind and not follow my plans to bring disaster to them.
(GW) But suppose the nation that I threatened turns away from doing wrong. Then I will change my plans about the disaster I planned to do to it.
Acts 2:23this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men.
Acts 4:28to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place.
Ephesians 1:9–10 (ESV) — 9 making known to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ 10 as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.
Eph 3:9and to bring to light for everyone what is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages in God, who created all things,
He is seen planning
NIV
Isa 19:17And the land of Judah will bring terror to the Egyptians; everyone to whom Judah is mentioned will be terrified, because of what the Lord Almighty is planning against them.
Jer 26:3Perhaps they will listen and each will turn from his evil way. Then I will relent and not bring on them the disaster I was planning because of the evil they have done.
Micah 2:3Therefore, the Lord says: “I am planning disaster against this people, from which you cannot save yourselves. You will no longer walk proudly, for it will be a time of calamity.
LEB
Isa 19:17And the land of Judah will become a terror to Egypt, everyone to whom one mentions it will be afraid in himself because of the plan of Yahweh of hosts that he is planning against him.
Jer 18:11“So now then, say, please, to the people of Judah and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying, ‘Thus says Yahweh, “Look, I am preparing evil against you, and I am planning a plan against you. Please turn back, each one from his evil way, and walk rightly in your ways and your deeds.” ’
Jer 26:3Perhaps they will listen and turn back each from his evil way, and I will relent of the disaster that I am planning to do to them because of their evil deeds.
Jer 29:11For I know the plans that I am planning concerning you,’ declares Yahweh, ‘plans for prosperity and not for harm, to give to you a future and a hope.
Jer 36:3Perhaps when the house of Judah hears all the disasters that I am planning to do to them, then they may turn back each one from his evil way, and I will forgive their guilt and their sin.”
Micah 2:3Therefore, thus says Yahweh: Look! I am planning disaster against this family from which you will not be able to remove your necks. You will not walk proudly, for it is a time of disaster.
NASB
Jer 26:3‘Perhaps they will listen and everyone will turn from his evil way, that I may repent of the calamity which I am planning to do to them because of the evil of their deeds.’
Micah 2:3Therefore thus says the Lord, “Behold, I am planning against this family a calamity From which you cannot remove your necks; And you will not walk haughtily, For it will be an evil time.
He thinks
You failed to defend the idea God does not think
Psalm 92:5 (KJV 1900) — 5 O LORD, how great are thy works! And thy thoughts are very deep.
Isaiah 55:8 (KJV 1900) — 8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, Neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
And you are 3x in error
Bearing false qitness again
The answer was discursively and in succession
Scripture does in fact show he does
The scripture are all the proof needed
God has plans
(2001) and that nation then turns from the bad; about the bad things I'd planned, I will then change My mind!
(ERV) But if the people of that nation change their hearts and lives and stop doing evil things, I will change my mind and not follow my plans to bring disaster to them.
(GW) But suppose the nation that I threatened turns away from doing wrong. Then I will change my plans about the disaster I planned to do to it.
Acts 2:23this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men.
Acts 4:28to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place.
Ephesians 1:9–10 (ESV) — 9 making known to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ 10 as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.
Eph 3:9and to bring to light for everyone what is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages in God, who created all things,
He is seen planning
NIV
Isa 19:17And the land of Judah will bring terror to the Egyptians; everyone to whom Judah is mentioned will be terrified, because of what the Lord Almighty is planning against them.
Jer 26:3Perhaps they will listen and each will turn from his evil way. Then I will relent and not bring on them the disaster I was planning because of the evil they have done.
Micah 2:3Therefore, the Lord says: “I am planning disaster against this people, from which you cannot save yourselves. You will no longer walk proudly, for it will be a time of calamity.
LEB
Isa 19:17And the land of Judah will become a terror to Egypt, everyone to whom one mentions it will be afraid in himself because of the plan of Yahweh of hosts that he is planning against him.
Jer 18:11“So now then, say, please, to the people of Judah and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, saying, ‘Thus says Yahweh, “Look, I am preparing evil against you, and I am planning a plan against you. Please turn back, each one from his evil way, and walk rightly in your ways and your deeds.” ’
Jer 26:3Perhaps they will listen and turn back each from his evil way, and I will relent of the disaster that I am planning to do to them because of their evil deeds.
Jer 29:11For I know the plans that I am planning concerning you,’ declares Yahweh, ‘plans for prosperity and not for harm, to give to you a future and a hope.
Jer 36:3Perhaps when the house of Judah hears all the disasters that I am planning to do to them, then they may turn back each one from his evil way, and I will forgive their guilt and their sin.”
Micah 2:3Therefore, thus says Yahweh: Look! I am planning disaster against this family from which you will not be able to remove your necks. You will not walk proudly, for it is a time of disaster.
NASB
Jer 26:3‘Perhaps they will listen and everyone will turn from his evil way, that I may repent of the calamity which I am planning to do to them because of the evil of their deeds.’
Micah 2:3Therefore thus says the Lord, “Behold, I am planning against this family a calamity From which you cannot remove your necks; And you will not walk haughtily, For it will be an evil time.
He thinks
You failed to defend the idea God does not think
Psalm 92:5 (KJV 1900) — 5 O LORD, how great are thy works! And thy thoughts are very deep.
Isaiah 55:8 (KJV 1900) — 8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, Neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
Why does your theology require you to fight against scripture?
Dodger, how does a omniscient God plan when the plan has always been known?
Dodger, how does a omniscient God plan when the plan has always been known?
Obadiah
Well-known member
He can also change His plans.
The Lord said, “Abraham, I have heard that the people of Sodom and Gomorrah are doing all kinds of evil things. 21Now I am going down to see for myself if those people really are that bad. If they aren't, I would like to know.”
The LORD replied, “If I find 50 good people in Sodom, I will save the city to keep them from being killed.” Abraham answered, “I am nothing more than the dust of the earth. Please forgive me, LORD, for daring to speak to you like this. But suppose there are only 45 good people in Sodom. Would you still wipe out the whole city?” “If I find 45 good people,” the LORD replied, “I won't destroy the city.” “Suppose there are just 40 good people?” Abraham asked. “Even for them,” the LORD replied, “I won't destroy the city.” Abraham said, “Please don't be angry, LORD, if I ask you what you will do if there are only 30 good people in the city.” “If I find 30,” the LORD replied, “I still won't destroy it.” Then Abraham said, “I don't have any right to ask you, LORD, but what would you do if you find only 20?” “Because of them, I won't destroy the city,” was the LORD's answer. Finally, Abraham said, “Please don't get angry, LORD, if I speak just once more. Suppose you find only 10 good people there.” “For the sake of 10 good people,” the LORD told him, “I still won't destroy the city.” After speaking with Abraham, the LORD left, and Abraham went back home.
The Lord said, “Abraham, I have heard that the people of Sodom and Gomorrah are doing all kinds of evil things. 21Now I am going down to see for myself if those people really are that bad. If they aren't, I would like to know.”
Genesis 18:20-21
The LORD replied, “If I find 50 good people in Sodom, I will save the city to keep them from being killed.” Abraham answered, “I am nothing more than the dust of the earth. Please forgive me, LORD, for daring to speak to you like this. But suppose there are only 45 good people in Sodom. Would you still wipe out the whole city?” “If I find 45 good people,” the LORD replied, “I won't destroy the city.” “Suppose there are just 40 good people?” Abraham asked. “Even for them,” the LORD replied, “I won't destroy the city.” Abraham said, “Please don't be angry, LORD, if I ask you what you will do if there are only 30 good people in the city.” “If I find 30,” the LORD replied, “I still won't destroy it.” Then Abraham said, “I don't have any right to ask you, LORD, but what would you do if you find only 20?” “Because of them, I won't destroy the city,” was the LORD's answer. Finally, Abraham said, “Please don't get angry, LORD, if I speak just once more. Suppose you find only 10 good people there.” “For the sake of 10 good people,” the LORD told him, “I still won't destroy the city.” After speaking with Abraham, the LORD left, and Abraham went back home.
Genesis 18:26-33
civic
Well-known member
Amen
civic
Well-known member
Conditions placed on man and God changing His mind and plans reveals His interaction in real time. This refutes his position as everything is fixed from eternity past by His eternal decree
This is the Open Theist position for sure.
Scripture and the scriptural position
Jeremiah 18:7–10 (ESV) — 7 If at any time I declare concerning a nation or a kingdom, that I will pluck up and break down and destroy it, 8 and if that nation, concerning which I have spoken, turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I intended to do to it. 9 And if at any time I declare concerning a nation or a kingdom that I will build and plant it, 10 and if it does evil in my sight, not listening to my voice, then I will relent of the good that I had intended to do to it.
Open theism is not the scriptural position. It certainly was not the position of the early church. Or the church of the middle ages.
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