The Gospel Of Salvation

[Eternally-Grateful]

I figured you wouldn't. I once believed the same a long time ago.

Question. Will Christ have former Gentiles with Him that will rule along side with Him?

Yes, they will rule from their own nations.

But God will rule from Jerusalem. On davids throne, and his people will be back in their land. OT prophets speak of this often.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

This earth will pass away with a fervent heat and the elements be dissolved.
The sins that bind all of creation will one day vanish in the destruction of the sky and earth. It planet will pass away. We look for new heavens and new earth. What was the sin of the Amorites?

yes, But until this time, God gave a specific plot of land to a nation he called out.

They are not in this land now in peace because of lev 26, they sinned against God and God punished and is still punishing them, but when the repent (and we are told they will) he will return them to that land

 

[praise_yeshua]

Yes, they will rule from their own nations.

But God will rule from Jerusalem. On davids throne, and his people will be back in their land. OT prophets speak of this often.

Where do you get ruling with Christ from their own nations?

Do you realize that you're creating a hierarchy with Jews and Gentiles where Jews will be the only ones ruling with Christ. This is no true to how God has treated all the familias of the earth. There is no hierarchy or rank among the children of Adam. Abraham was a child of his father Adam. Like a good father, Adam didn't choose between his sons Abel and Cain. He drove Cain away in hopes that Cain would change. Vengeance only belongs to Christ. Christ has chosen to forgive any man that will believe in Him.

 

[praise_yeshua]

yes, But until this time, God gave a specific plot of land to a nation he called out.

They are not in this land now in peace because of lev 26, they sinned against God and God punished and is still punishing them, but when the repent (and we are told they will) he will return them to that land

I know already what you believe. You mentioned the sins of the Amorites being the reason for not having that land. What was that sin and didn't Joshua judge the Amorites? The children of Abraham gained that land and then lost it. Only the heir Jesus Christ owns any promise to that land. He is the heir of David but the promise is not for David. It was for his heir. Did you know the King of kings title came from Persians?

 

[praise_yeshua]

@Eternally-Grateful

When God established Israel, it is clear through the book of Judges that God never intended Israel to rule this world. Yet, the heir of David is to rule this world. You speak of a small patch of land when God is working on something really BIG. God was working through Israel to bring about the heir of Abraham and David to join together all the families of the earth.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Where do you get ruling with Christ from their own nations?

From the OT. The nations or families of the earth will come worship the king. Those who do not will be punished by no rain

Do you realize that you're creating a hierarchy with Jews and Gentiles where Jews will be the only ones ruling with Christ. This is no true to how God has treated all the familias of the earth. There is no hierarchy or rank among the children of Adam. Abraham was a child of his father Adam. Like a good father, Adam didn't choose between his sons Abel and Cain. He drove Cain away in hopes that Cain would change. Vengeance only belongs to Christ. Christ has chosen to forgive any man that will believe in Him.

No.

Jesus rules.

Each nation is ruled by Jesus.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

I know already what you believe. You mentioned the sins of the Amorites being the reason for not having that land. What was that sin and didn't Joshua judge the Amorites? The children of Abraham gained that land and then lost it. Only the heir Jesus Christ owns any promise to that land. He is the heir of David but the promise is not for David. It was for his heir. Did you know the King of kings title came from Persians?

It means they still could get saved, they stil believed. They had not come to the point where they were beyond repentance.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

@Eternally-Grateful

When God established Israel, it is clear through the book of Judges that God never intended Israel to rule this world. Yet, the heir of David is to rule this world. You speak of a small patch of land when God is working on something really BIG. God was working through Israel to bring about the heir of Abraham and David to join together all the families of the earth.

Lol

I thought you said you knew what I believed?

I never said Israel would rule the world

 

[praise_yeshua]

From the OT. The nations or families of the earth will come worship the king. Those who do not will be punished by no rain

No.

Jesus rules.

Each nation is ruled by Jesus.

Can you quote the OT....

Yes. Jesus rules. Why are you separating Gentiles from Jesus while leaving Jews near to Him?

 

[praise_yeshua]

Lol

I thought you said you knew what I believed?

I never said Israel would rule the world

Never said you believed this. I told you what the truth is. I do know what you believe. You don't know what I believe.

You're not paying attention to what I asked and said.

Given what you believe and what you admit above, then why is Jesus Christ ruling all nations if He is only to rule as the Kings of Israel ruled?

 

[jeremiah1five]

Then make the case to ignore Judaism's requirements of a Hebrew mother.

All this bluster from you and you fold like a dish rag.

In a patriarchal society I don't ignore it. I support it.

 

[jeremiah1five]

I claim seed (singular) in the sole heir of Abraham. Jesus Christ. I don't claim Abraham's seed. I am a joint heir with Christ.

Get it right if you're going to make an argument against what I believe.

That's fine for you but I don't diminish what went before.
Isaac's inheritance was real as was Jacob's. The same for his 12 sons and their descendants. There could be no inheritance for Jesus to inherit without those going before Him passing it down to Him. And each and every son and daughter of Abraham will take up their part in the inheritance in the end.

 

[jeremiah1five]

No. You and James both try to produce a compromise that doesn't work within the context of the law. The law is much more than 4 principles. The entire Torah details the law. It came from Moses...... The Torah came from MOSES....

For all intents and purposes it was enough for these mixed heritage Hebrews who were born again to follow these four precepts from the Law of Moses. They weren't even required to be circumcised which was the whole reason for the council.

Surely you know this. In Jesus Christ, I am heir of all things. Abraham looked for the new Jerusalem from God....

It doesn't say Jerusalem, it says "city."

Pay attention. Abraham knew his seed in Isaac wasn't enough in Isaac himself. He looked for his Eternal heir. God in flesh.

No, Abraham was content to pass the inheritance to Isaac. There is nothing that says Abraham "looked for God in the flesh" or an "eternal heir."

For a Trinitarian, you don't really know the teaching at all....

Heb 11:9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
Heb 11:10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

He didn't find it because it's not on earth.

Do you notice that "sojourn" Abraham made? Abraham already had Salem. He gave a tenth of the spoils to the King of Salem. A King of Gentiles.....

Melchisedec was king of Salem, not Abraham. Abraham never inherited Mel's property. And Melchisedec wasn't Gentile (non-Hebrew.) There is no Gentile "priests' of the Most High God."

You know the teaching of Judaism.... right?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Can you quote the OT....

Yes. Jesus rules. Why are you separating Gentiles from Jesus while leaving Jews near to Him?

Zech 14: 11 The people shall dwell in it;
And no longer shall there be utter destruction,
But Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.
12 And this shall be the plague with which the Lord will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem:

Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet,
Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets,
And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths.
13 It shall come to pass in that day
That a great panic from the Lord will be among them.
Everyone will seize the hand of his neighbor,
And raise his hand against his neighbor’s hand;
14 Judah also will fight at Jerusalem.
And the wealth of all the surrounding nations
Shall be gathered together:
Gold, silver, and apparel in great abundance.
15 Such also shall be the plague
On the horse and the mule,
On the camel and the donkey,
And on all the cattle that will be in those camps.
So shall this plague be.

The Nations Worship the King​

16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Never said you believed this.

Yet this is what you accused me of

I told you what the truth is. I do know what you believe. You don't know what I believe.

You're not paying attention to what I asked and said.

Given what you believe and what you admit above, then why is Jesus Christ ruling all nations if He is only to rule as the Kings of Israel ruled?

I said Jesus would rule the world from Jerusalem.

Now who is the one not paying attention?

 

[praise_yeshua]

Yet this is what you accused me of

Reread the interaction. I told you what I believe. Not what you believe. I simply said I already know what you believe. I'm not a liar. If you insist that I am, then you can discuss this with someone else. I do know what you believe because I know the people you got it from. You're not unique in any of this. I am. I preach/teach what I believe.

I said Jesus would rule the world from Jerusalem.

Now who is the one not paying attention?

I knew that several posts ago. You're selectively quoting what I said. I wrote an entire response to this concerning how you're creating second class citizens in the body of Christ by teaching that Christ ignores Gentiles to fellowship with only Jews in this "Jerusalem" you think Abraham was looking for.

Abraham isn't going to be in this "Jerusalem". He didn't care about it when he had it with him in Salem. Abraham defeated the armies and gave a 10th of the spoils to Gentiles. He didn't move there. Abraham keep looking for a heavenly city.

Yes. Jesus will rule the heavenly city of Jerusalem. An Eternal city. This Salem/Jerusalem you're looking for will be destroyed.

How do you feel about that?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Reread the interaction. I told you what I believe. Not what you believe. I simply said I already know what you believe. I'm not a liar. If you insist that I am, then you can discuss this with someone else. I do know what you believe because I know the people you got it from. You're not unique in any of this. I am. I preach/teach what I believe.

Dude, You claimed you know what I believed, then proved the opposite by the questions you asked me.

I knew that several posts ago. You're selectively quoting what I said. I wrote an entire response to this concerning how you're creating second class citizens in the body of Christ by teaching that Christ ignores Gentiles to fellowship with only Jews in this "Jerusalem" you think Abraham was looking for.

Are you serious?

Abraham isn't going to be in this "Jerusalem". He didn't care about it when he had it with him in Salem. Abraham defeated the armies and gave a 10th of the spoils to Gentiles. He didn't move there. Abraham keep looking for a heavenly city.

I never said he was going to be in this jerusalem? CAN YOU READ?????????????????????

Yes. Jesus will rule the heavenly city of Jerusalem. An Eternal city. This Salem/Jerusalem you're looking for will be destroyed.

How do you feel about that?

Yes

But he will rule the earthly kingdom also. On davids throne, as the seed of David. And all the people of the earth (nations) will worship him, he will rule the nations with a rod of Iron.

Please do nto mock me, If you want to discuss I will discuss. But I will not be told what I believe and lied to

 

[praise_yeshua]

16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain.

It is all about timing. You're posting this verse without any context of timing. It has been thousands of years since this verse was given.

Which is what people like yourself do. They claim a verse means what they want it to mean without any context to establish such.

Notice how Jerusalem is mentioned in many different contexts. Example. Revelations chapter 11.

Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Jerusalem has existed for thousands of years. Yet, here you are insisting that Abraham desires this city that has been filled with the blood of countless people for thousands of years.

This "Jesus" you want isn't Jesus Christ.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Dude, You claimed you know what I believed, then proved the opposite by the questions you asked me.

What question. Post the question. What you're reference is what I said about the truth. I'm not your "dude". I am a adult that has studied this for a very long time.

Are you serious?

I never said he was going to be in this jerusalem? CAN YOU READ?????????????????????

What you said requires that Abraham be looking for this Jerusalem you insist Christ will rule from. What you believe requires it. It doesn't matter if you said it or not. I am 10 steps ahead of you.

Yes

But he will rule the earthly kingdom also. On davids throne, as the seed of David. And all the people of the earth (nations) will worship him, he will rule the nations with a rod of Iron.

Please do nto mock me, If you want to discuss I will discuss. But I will not be told what I believe and lied to

You have a teacher. You got this belief from a teacher. I know what these teachers you're following teach. Thusly, I know what you believe already. I know you from the people you believe. Just like I know those who follow Christ from what they MUST believe to be in fellowship with God.

You believe the thousand year reign will take place on this earth with Christ ruling from a Jerusalem that will be destroyed by God Himself. You believe this is the promises given to Jews when Abraham rejected the city of Salem. Abraham looked for another city.

So tell me why Abraham would return to this earth with Christ and care one thing about Salem? Abraham would still be looking for the heavenly city........ What pleasure would Abraham find from more wars and strife.

You ignore what I wrote about creating second class citizens in Gentiles by forcing them to go back to their countries and stay there.....I'm going to be with Christ. Now tell me again WHY I'm not....

Can you see how your beliefs tarnish my relationship with Christ. You're making me bow to you.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

It is all about timing. You're posting this verse without any context of timing. It has been thousands of years since this verse was given.

Which is what people like yourself do. They claim a verse means what they want it to mean without any context to establish such.

Notice how Jerusalem is mentioned in many different contexts. Example. Revelations chapter 11.

Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Jerusalem has existed for thousands of years. Yet, here you are insisting that Abraham desires this city that has been filled with the blood of countless people for thousands of years.

This "Jesus" you want isn't Jesus Christ.

1. Nothing like that had ever happened.

2. I was hoping you would look it up instead of me posting the whole chapter

Zech 14:

The Day of the Lord​

14 Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
2 For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;
The city shall be taken,
The houses rifled,
And the women ravished.
Half of the city shall go into captivity,
But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
3 Then the Lord will go forth
And fight against those nations,
As He fights in the day of battle.
4 And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives,
Which faces Jerusalem on the east.
And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two,
From east to west,
Making a very large valley;
Half of the mountain shall move toward the north
And half of it toward the south.
5 Then you shall flee through My mountain valley,
For the mountain valley shall reach to Azal.
Yes, you shall flee
As you fled from the earthquake
In the days of Uzziah king of Judah.
Thus the Lord my God will come,
And all the saints withYou.
6 It shall come to pass in that day
That there will be no light;
The lights will diminish.
7 It shall be one day
Which is known to the Lord—
Neither day nor night.
But at evening time it shall happen
That it will be light.
8 And in that day it shall be
That living waters shall flow from Jerusalem,
Half of them toward the eastern sea
And half of them towardthe western sea;
In both summer and winter it shall occur.
9 And the Lord shall be King over all the earth.
In that day it shall be—
“The Lord is one,”
And His name one.
10 All the land shall be turned into a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem. Jerusalem shall be raised up and inhabited in her place from Benjamin’s Gate to the place of the First Gate and the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the king’s winepresses.

11 The people shall dwell in it;
And no longer shall there be utter destruction,
But Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.
12 And this shall be the plague with which the Lord will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem:

Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet,
Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets,
And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths.
13 It shall come to pass in that day
That a great panic from the Lord will be among them.
Everyone will seize the hand of his neighbor,
And raise his hand against his neighbor’s hand;
14 Judah also will fight at Jerusalem.
And the wealth of all the surrounding nations
Shall be gathered together:
Gold, silver, and apparel in great abundance.
15 Such also shall be the plague
On the horse and the mule,
On the camel and the donkey,
And on all the cattle that will be in those camps.
So shall this plague be.

The Nations Worship the King​

16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain. 18 If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt and the punishment of all the nations that do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.