The Elect

[TibiasDad]

It doesn’t matter what you think the people here who know me know I was as we debated together as Calvinists against non Calvinists. @PapaLandShark, @Joe @Predestined @Administrator @TibiasDad @synergy @Rockson @ @dizerner @PeanutGallery and @makesends know I was from other forums

I remember it well…but for those who don’t have the experience of you back then, I can see why they may doubt your former life as a Calvinist. There is an incredible difference in your perspective now; I am still (happily) amazed at the transformation!

Doug

 

[civic]

I remember it well…but for those who don’t have the experience of you back then, I can see why they may doubt your former life as a Calvinist. There is an incredible difference in your perspective now; I am still (happily) amazed at the transformation!

Doug

Thanks my friend The great thing was we were friends when I was a Calvinist too.

 

[Rockson]

Just because you know the doctrine doesn't mean you every believed it.

Strange he defended it with such a passion though. And strange that no matter what degree he would have shown you of that you'd still make a judgement of saying not enough?

I doubt you were ever a Calvinist.

So I guess it was some type of master plan then? He convinced others of certain aspects about it and then at night time he could sleep well at night that he steered people down a road he didn't agree with? Sorry RT I doubt you've thought through on what you're saying.

 

[makesends]

Are you saying being chose, elect. predestined has different meanings with Israel and the church ?

Yes, Old Testament Israel was only a picture of the New Testament church, not the same thing. Not all who are of Israel are Israel.

 

[makesends]

You need to prove that elect/chosen in the NT has a different meaning in the NT. That onus is one you if you are saying they are different.

Not all who are of Israel are Israel. And so, all Israel will be saved.

And we have been through multitudes of posts, threads and verses to show that whomever God chooses for eternal life will indeed be saved. That is all we mean by "elect" in that context. In the OT they are called his particular people, not his eternally saved.

Here's an interesting article that touches on the last point— of them being his particular people.

 

[civic]

Not all who are of Israel are Israel. And so, all Israel will be saved.

And we have been through multitudes of posts, threads and verses to show that whomever God chooses for eternal life will indeed be saved. That is all we mean by "elect" in that context. In the OT they are called his particular people, not his eternally saved.

Here's an interesting article that touches on the last point— of them being his particular people.

Ok I’m interested in reading it brother

 

[PeanutGallery]

It doesn’t matter what you think the people here who know me know I was as we debated together as Calvinists against non Calvinists. ...

Yeppir; 'Not a True Scotsman' is a knee jerk response.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Strange he defended it with such a passion though. And strange that no matter what degree he would have shown you of that you'd still make a judgement of saying not enough?

So I guess it was some type of master plan then? He convinced others of certain aspects about it and then at night time he could sleep well at night that he steered people down a road he didn't agree with? Sorry RT I doubt you've thought through on what you're saying.

I wasn't here to read his Calvinist interpretations of Scripture. I still have my doubts. That's all I'm going to say about it.

 

[civic]

I wasn't here to read his Calvinist interpretations of Scripture. I still have my doubts. That's all I'm going to say about it.

I wasn’t a Calvinist on this forum. It was on CARM where many of us were from. I’ve been a Calvinist on that forum since 2000. I left Calvinism in 2021.

 

[civic]

I wasn't here to read his Calvinist interpretations of Scripture. I still have my doubts. That's all I'm going to say about it.

I was still a Calvinist when I started this thread and all the Calvinists supported me.

  - Birth is Passive !

Just as a man is passive in his physical birth so to is that same man when it comes to his spiritual birth. See below for the Truth in the birth process its all Gods doing, not mans. John 1:13 children born not of blood, nor of the desire or will of man, but born of God. John 3:5 Jesus...

forums.carm.org

And here

  - Prevenient Grace- Chosen in Him !

Chosen in Him – Prevenient Grace Chosen and predestined go hand in hand with each other. Why can't people just read the text without bias ? Why not just let the words speak their truth without wearing our Arminian, Calvinist, Pelagian, Evangelical, Heterodox and Cult hats ? One must change the...

forums.carm.org

 

[civic]

I wasn't here to read his Calvinist interpretations of Scripture. I still have my doubts. That's all I'm going to say about it.

Here is another as a Calvinist. Many posters here remember when I was a Calvinist.

  - God is the first cause of everything with Salvation and Sovereign in the entire process

1) Mans inability to come to God apart from Him John 3:19, "This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil." John 3:27, "John answered and said, 'A man can receive nothing, unless it has been given him...

forums.carm.org

 

[civic]

I’m embarrassed and sickened reading some of the things I said to people

  - Anti crowd changes the meaning of words

I've noticed a consistent thing with most of those who oppose Calvinism on the forum. They will take the simple and universal definition of basic words and redefine them to oppose calvinism. We see this happen daily here on the forum. Here are just a few examples and I might work on compiling a...

forums.carm.org

 

[Dizerner]

Of course. It is both intellectually and Biblically vapid.

Yes, that's a problem.

We need to come to the Bible willing to accept things that bother us.

Instead of assuming things that bother us can't be there.

 

[Joe]

It doesn’t matter what you think the people here who know me know I was as we debated together as Calvinists against non Calvinists. @PapaLandShark, @Joe @Predestined @Administrator @TibiasDad @synergy @Rockson @ @dizerner @PeanutGallery and @makesends know I was from other forums

@The Rogue Tomato
I affirm that civic was indeed a Calvinist for many years before being delivered from the false teaching. He is not the only one who was delivered either.

God Bless

 

[Dizerner]

It's nothing but a defense mechanism to say "you were never a true X."

People use that same logic to defend against OSAS as well.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

It's nothing but a defense mechanism to say "you were never a true X."

People use that same logic to defend against OSAS as well.

I didn't want to continue on the topic, but my doubts are based on his reasoning and method of interpretation of scripture. I don't want to focus on a member here, and I'm sorry for breaking my "promise" not to say anymore.

 

[civic]

I didn't want to continue on the topic, but my doubts are based on his reasoning and method of interpretation of scripture. I don't want to focus on a member here, and I'm sorry for breaking my "promise" not to say anymore.

Can you give an example how my reasoning/interpretation of a passage is not an accepted method that causes doubt ?

For example lets talk about the gospel, the resurrection, the deity of Christ, the Trinity- something we all agree on doctrinally and show me how my methods of understanding those doctrines are wrong , how I interpret scripture to prove they are true are not done with a good method. my Go to any one of my threads and point out how my methods were wrong with my conclusions.

I have started dozens of threads outside of the Calvin/Arminian forum so there are plenty to choose from.

 

[Dizerner]

I didn't want to continue on the topic, but my doubts are based on his reasoning and method of interpretation of scripture. I don't want to focus on a member here, and I'm sorry for breaking my "promise" not to say anymore.

Everyone that turned Calvinist was never a TRUE Arminian, they didn't even really know Arminian theology as an Arminian.

 

[civic]

Everyone that turned Calvinist was never a TRUE Arminian, they didn't even really know Arminian theology as an Arminian.

Exactly rofl .......

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Everyone that turned Calvinist was never a TRUE Arminian, they didn't even really know Arminian theology as an Arminian.

I was never an Arminian, but I used to believe strongly that we choose Christ of our own free will. I got the idea from C.S. Lewis' Mere Christianity. The idea was that God wants us to love him of our own free will. But the more I read the Bible, the more I saw scripture that says this is impossible, and it's only through being born from above that we are able to love God -- call that the free will of the born again, if you wish, but it's outside our natural power to love God.