Amen the God you have described shows the ultimate Sovereignty. And a God who allows creatures to be free , have choices is the most Sovereign and never threatened by such freedom. It’s the God of the Bible. Creating man in His own image and likeness. A truly Sovereign and loving God.
I don't know what ways they (you?) think is appropriate to them. Not sure what they (you?) are saying there.That’s up for debate
According to the classical theism of Augustine, Anselm, Aquinas and their adherents, God is radically unlike creatures and cannot be adequately understood in ways appropriate to them. God is simple in that God transcends every form of complexity and composition
No, I was suggesting that is what you are trying to claim. You said that Calvinists claim ownership of the term, Sovereignty, but that they no more3 do so than those who deny that God controls all things (yes, that is my paraphrase).
That's poetic, but you supposing that it goes deeper than my simple description of causation is neither stated in Scripture nor warranted by reason. If you could prove it, that would be one thing, but you can do no more than assert it and explain why you believe it.
Why would that offend me? It is what I claim!
Where have I said that "God HAS TO do a certain thing because he has the power and ability to do so."? Really? How about stop trying to tell me what I think, and then positing a remonstrance from Almighty God against me for thinking it?
Of course, and he does give men genuine free choice. What is self-contradictory is your notion that free choice of creatures is its own first cause.
Makesend I'm not a new kid on the block when it comes to talking to Calvinists through the years. People of your position always gravitate towards the sovereignty theme as a main plank of your arguments.
And I said you're playing checkers and God is playing chess because you're demanding of him he's got to stay within the confines of a very one dimensional way of thinking about sovereignty how you define it. It's valid to say in our natural realm a King can be sovereign and yet he decides to what degree he wants to insist upon everything his way. For him to be able to decide this MEANS he's sovereign . Calvinists obviously want to take that away from him actually making him NOT sovereign.
It's not false. I'll just say you are wrong instead of telling you to stop lying about what I say. I said that God can do anything with his sovereignty he wants to, and I meant it. What makes you think he wants to do something self-contradictory? Does God consider whether he wants to make something too big for himself to pick up?
Yes, I said the logic of LFW is self-contradictory. Where does that say that "God HAS TO do a certain thing because he has the power and ability to do so."?
Demonstrate how I'm doing that, and demonstrate the "relevance of an ACTUAL self-contradictory position and its relevant rebuke", whatever you mean by that. Just telling me that I'm doing this or that is not convincing.
It is genuine, because it is actual choice of a willed agent, choosing according to his own inclinations.
Clever.
Of course it is not free of God's determination! Why should it be? What do you think man is and what do you think God is?
So what? Your claim was that they do not own it anymore than those who oppose Calvinism. So there you go claiming ownership of it. That was the whole point of what you were saying!Makesend I'm not a new kid on the block when it comes to talking to Calvinists through the years. People of your position always gravitate towards the sovereignty theme as a main plank of your arguments.
Even Wikipedia points this out about Calvinism, "It emphasizes the sovereignty of God and the authority of the Bible."
Reformed Christianity - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
No. I'm not demanding anything of him. I'm saying that I do not entertain self-contradictory notions, if I see them for what they are.
I don't say he chooses for us. That is a stretch imposed on what I do say, that he chooses and so we too choose. There is no fact that is not established by God, the one and only First Cause, from which all other fact and principle logically descends, causally.
You sound as though your view is the truth. Yours is the road.
Yes they are. And the sad thing Calvinists won't admit is that their God predestinating everything is the same thing as saying God does all the choosing. And as you pointed out God told US......Choose you this day.
And the sad thing is, Self-Determinists don't realize that when a person chooses, they always choose what God had planned all along.
Man makes his plans, but the Lord directs his steps.
Do you have scriptures that teach God does that will all mankind not just a few select prophets of His ?
