Need a reason to believe Calvinists are who they claim to be?

[civic]

The thief on the cross was already a believer in Jesus as the Messiah.
He had faith in Jesus.
Then Jesus told him he was saved.
Calvinism teaches you are regenerated before you believe.
Just as Red Baker is teaching the Jews were saved before they repented in the baptism of John.
So was the thief on the cross saved before he believed and before Jesus told him, today you will
be with Me in paradise?
If Red Bakers religion is the truth, John 17:17.
Then the thief was also saved before he repented.

ditto as I commented in another thread faith and the gospel have nothing to do with salvation is some peoples theology.

 

[Titus]

ditto as I commented in another thread faith and the gospel have nothing to do with salvation is some peoples theology.

Really strange isnt it, Romans 1:16 for it is the power of God unto salvation

 

[Obadiah]

This is deep, is this all you have to offer to the discussion? You are attacking the person, and not what they preach by not using scriptures to expose what you think is their error. Calvinism, like other faiths has different view points that I do not agree with, being a high/hyper Calvinist, as called by others, but prefer just to be called what I am, a Christian/believer in the word of God, which for the most part is what I reference others as, instead of using such labels. Nevertheless, I care little what others call me, I'am more concerned about what God thinks of me and what I believe and teach, than others.

1st Corinthians 4:3​

“But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.”

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[Titus]

If you disagree with Calvin you are an Arminian or vice versa.
There is no truth to this common belief.
In reality it is a logical fallacy.
Two fallacies,
False dilemma fallacy: Presenting only two options as the only possibilities when other possibilities exist.

Guilt by association fallacy: discrediting a view by linking it to a group or label assumed to be wrong

I reject Calvin and all 5 points of TULIP and I am not a follower of Arminian.
I never have believed Arminian's beliefs are sound.

I'm not a Baptist but I agree faith is required to be saved. Dosent make me a baptist.
I reject limited atonement, unconditional election, doesnt make me an Arminian.

 

[civic]

Really strange isnt it, Romans 1:16 for it is the power of God unto salvation

yes some don't really now the biblical gospel and what it takes to be saved according to scripture. Jesus and the Apostles were very clear about the requirement of faith/repentance.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Calvinism is impossible because it makes God a moral monster unworthy of worship. It also includes beliefs, affirmations of fact, that contradict one another.

It is impossible to debate with a Calvinist because logic does not matter to them.

Even if no Calvinist ever believed or affirmed that God is the author of sin and evil and a moral monster, those conclusions are what they believe insofar as they are classical, consistent Calvinists.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Not like you do.

lol whatever

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

I really have no idea what you are talking about. And I seriously believe that you don't either.

Of course you dont

That’s what happens when you believe things that do not make sense

You deny it. Then you act confused when people question it

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Jesus said believing is a work.

Your stuck on calvinism

When your ready to open up your heart let me know

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Calvinism is impossible because it makes God a moral monster unworthy of worship. It also includes beliefs, affirmations of fact, that contradict one another.

It is impossible to debate with a Calvinist because logic does not matter to them.

Even if no Calvinist ever believed or affirmed that God is the author of sin and evil and a moral monster, those conclusions are what they believe insofar as they are classical, consistent Calvinists.

Sadly anticalvinists can be just as bad. We witness that in here. How can we know? They call people calvinists who are not calvinist

 

[Obadiah]

Sadly anticalvinists can be just as bad. We witness that in here. How can we know? They call people calvinists who are not calvinist

Hard it say if the are Calvinists or not since there are so many types.

Total hyper-Calvinism
Partial hyper-Calvinism
Regular High Calvinism
Moderate Calvinism
Lower Moderate Calvinism (may pre-date the confessions)
Lowest Calvinism
Amyraldism (4 point Calvinism)
Presbyterian churches: Calvinistic denominations like the Presbyterian Church in America.
Congregational churches: Some Baptist denominations are also Calvinist.

 

[Jim]

Your stuck on calvinism

I am dead set against Calvinism. It is a heresy at its core.

When your ready to open up your heart let me know

Apparently in your omniscience, you have decided my heart is not open. Imagine that.

 

[Jim]

They call people calvinists who are not calvinist

You are probably correct in that. I have to admit I tend to do that. I tend to do that to those I think are advocating any aspect of TULIP, which has as its fundamental precept, the truly disgusting doctrine of Total Depravity.

 

[Jim]

Calvinism is impossible because it makes God a moral monster unworthy of worship.

I think you are absolutely correct in that.

It also includes beliefs, affirmations of fact, that contradict one another.

I don't know that I would agree completely with that. However, I do believe that it affirms as fact assumptions that are in outright contradictions to the Bible.

It is impossible to debate with a Calvinist because logic does not matter to them.

Yes!! To most, logic is a creation, in conflict with God, of man, not realizing that God is the perfect author of logic.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

So we agree.

Believe = saved.

No “work”.

Yes saved

Forever

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

I am dead set against Calvinism. It is a heresy at its core.

That’s your problem. You see Calvinism where it is not there so your blind to what anyone says

Apparently in your omniscience, you have decided my heart is not open. Imagine that.

I do not need omniscience all I need to see is your actions

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

You are probably correct in that. I have to admit I tend to do that. I tend to do that to those I think are advocating any aspect of TULIP, which has as its fundamental precept, the truly disgusting doctrine of Total Depravity.

I reject all 5 points. Yet you argue at me as if I am calvinist

 

[Titus]

You are probably correct in that. I have to admit I tend to do that. I tend to do that to those I think are advocating any aspect of TULIP, which has as its fundamental precept, the truly disgusting doctrine of Total Depravity.

Many are calvinist in their theology and dont know it because they are ignorant of where their beliefs originated from.
I've told folks they are leaning towards calvinism and they get upset. They believe I'm misrepresenting their beliefs.

 

[Titus]

I reject all 5 points. Yet you argue at me as if I am calvinist

You reject Orginal sin/ Totally depraved at birth? e.g. Adam's sin imputed to every man?
I've never met a Baptist that rejects being born a sinner.
But if you really do, then that's wonderful.

 

[civic]

Brightframe is not really a calvinist. so he says.

He affirms the 5 points of Calvinism, TULIP.