Justice "served" in the Atonement?

If the law giver is paying for the sin of the law breaker. he is held under the same requirements.

Provide the Scriptures that says just that?

You can't.

Christ's death meet the REQUIREMENT. Not keeping the law of Moses.

You do know what Moses got his law wrong..... right? Moses was fallible and made mistakes.

Do you know what "UNDER THE LAW".... means?
 
.This was something I was given when I was a teenager. It hit my kind of hard. The price of payment of Sin. I believe it was written by RB Thieme Jr of the Beracha church in Texas.

Ps 22, the payment of sin

My God, My God why has thou forsaken me? Far from my deliverance are the words of my gowning (ps 22:1)

Jesus Christ uttered these words on the cross. Christ is God; He is also man. He quoted this scripture from his humanity addressing God the father. Christ knew perfectly well why the Father was forsaking him. This was the purpose for which Jesus had been born into the world. The Father was forsaking the humanity of Christ as part of Judging him for the sins of mankind. The sins of mankind were being imputed to Him, and he was taking the punishment due every human being who would ever live. So horrible was this judgment to His sinless humanity that he expressed his agony by repeating again and again from the psalm of David.. The Hebrew word for gowning meant our Lord was screaming in the pain of Devine judgment

You must realize just why Jesus Christ was screaming, and you must have some picture of what happened to our Lord prior to that time. Jesus had just endured 6 trials. During this time, men had lied about him (no one enjoys being maligned) and yet Jesus kept quiet. He did not answer or fight back. When the court finished taking testimony, they could not draw an indictment because the false witnesses did not agree. Men began to step up and have a little fun at his expense. They took turns slugging, cursing and spitting on him. Jesus Christ was hit dozens and dozens of times. as the bible says, "he was buffeted" which is simply a Greek word for "slugged" (matt 26: 27, mark 14: 65) Is 52" 14 tells us that he was so badly beaten that the features of his face were completely destroyed, and yet he stood up and took it all and lived.

In between all the punching, other men came up and said," so you are a prophet huh? then prophesy who hit you!" Boom! they slapped him, they hit him (matt 26: 28) At one point during these trials, they stripped him to the waist, His hands tied above his head, and then he was scourged (literally "skinned with a whip"). The romans used a "mastix" a very brutal type of whip, to which they attached sharp bits of bone, metal and splinters, anything that would cut! Then the strongest man in the battalion would beat the victim.

Usually by this time any member of the human race would have been reduced to screaming incoherent hysterias, "like a sheep that is silent before his shearers, so he did not open his mouth" (Is 53 7b cf acts 8: 32) He never cried out to anyone, he did not raise his voice in to scream in pain. Then after the beating was over, as was Roman custom, they rubbed salt into what was left of the raw back to cauterize the wound. They mocked him, they scourged him, they took him to the cross.

As He hung on the cross, it was excruciatingly painful. His bones pulled apart from the weight of his body, slowly, miserably. the torture was unbelievable! Yet not once did he cry out-

Not until midday, when the sun was overhead. Suddenly the hill was blotted out in darkness. Then, in that darkness, something happened that made Jesus scream. All of the punching, slapping, lying, maligning torture and pain had not caused him to cry out, yet now, something so terrible made him scream. In a moment of time, your sin, my sin and the past present and future sins of the whole world were poured out on him. It was then that in his greatest agony he screamed. God the father turned his back on him. Why, Because thou art holy (ps 22:3)

Holiness is a combination of righteousness and justice. In absolute righteousness God the father directed his perfect justice against Christ imputing all sin to him and judging him as the substitute for mankind. In that moment of time, "he who knew no sin was made sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in him (2 cor 2: 51)

Yeah. That feed your ego. The idea that God would do such for your sin made you want to see your sins as being worse than they actually are.

Every man has this ego problem.
 
Provide the Scriptures that says just that?

You can't.

Christ's death meet the REQUIREMENT. Not keeping the law of Moses.

You do know what Moses got his law wrong..... right? Moses was fallible and made mistakes.

Do you know what "UNDER THE LAW".... means?
Its obvious you have no idea what REDEMPTION MEANS

Jesus kept the law completely. He did not break one command

if he did, His sacrifice is null and void and your dead in your sin
 
as payment for sin? No

That is a false gospel you're preaching. I actually believe Christ suffered MORE than you do....

Isn't that "ironic".

Christ suffered the innocence and limitation of the flesh. Christ "grew".....

Is that payment for my sin? No

Yawn

So Christ's suffering wasn't payment for sin? Geesh...

What caused Jesus to cry out on the 9th hour?

what happened at that moment?

do you even know what the penalty of sin is?

I do. Just like we do, Christ began to die when HE.... was conceived of a virgin. Confined to a womb of Mary.

Is that not suffering? Is that not the payment for sin? It wasn't just all this "sin" you think was "laid upon Christ" on the tree.

If you're going to try to teach someone anything, you need to grow up to actually be a teacher.

Heb 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
Heb 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
 
Its obvious you have no idea what REDEMPTION MEANS

Jesus kept the law completely. He did not break one command

if he did, His sacrifice is null and void and your dead in your sin

That is your false Gospel.

Jesus broke the Sabbath. Jesus also touched lepers.....

Do I need to keep going? I can list more.

Jesus said that the law of Moses didn't bring Grace. Do you know this?

Joh 1:17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Notice the "CONTRAST".
 
Last edited:
Feed my ego.

lol

Dude, your a joke. I will place you in my prayer bin. Your pride is deep. to deep for me to be able to help you. or anyone for that matter

My pride? I'm not the one that finds value for my sin through the death of Jesus Christ.

Yes. Ego is rampant in what people preach about Christ.

Christ doesn't need any of us and the average person preaches a Gospel where Christ NEEDS US to be complete.
 
Nope He is the authority on the kingdom

That's NOT ALL HE SAID. Duh. Hence the "cherry picking."

Completely evaded my point.

Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?' (Matt. 18:33 NKJ)
And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers
until he should pay all that was due to him. (Matt. 18:34 NKJ)


Which verse also completely debunks OSAS by the way.

"Fellow servant."
 
That's NOT ALL HE SAID. Duh. Hence the "cherry picking."

Completely evaded my point.

Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?' (Matt. 18:33 NKJ)
And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers
until he should pay all that was due to him. (Matt. 18:34 NKJ)


Which verse also completely debunks OSAS by the way.

"Fellow servant."

Ah.....

I started to try to guide the discussion into defining exactly what "justice" means in the context of what is being preached. I'm glad I waited....

What do you expect was actually "due to him"?
 
Angry and torturers should give you a clue.

So God demands anger and torture for Justice?

Again. What is "due him"?

Don't look at what God gives them over to, look at what God demands.


whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, (Rom. 3:25 NKJ)

So Jesus didn't do the work of an High Priest when he forgave sins on earth?
 
So God demands anger and torture for Justice?

Hell exists, Scripture teaches it. Please do a study of the wrath of God in Scripture, he is not a peace loving hippie.

So Jesus didn't do the work of an High Priest when he forgave sins on earth?

Try reading this again more slowly:

because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, (Rom. 3:25 NKJ)
 
--Prophet and King.

J.

Forgiveness doesn't always establish a relationship. Many times it actually doesn't. Forgiveness has been defined as "giving up the will to get even".....

I once knew a "Preacher" that often said

"People go to hell with their sins forgiven."

"Agreement" is everything.
 
Back
Top Bottom