Infant Reprobation and Damnation

[civic]

he is to far out there for me

agreed

 

[TedT]

Does your preconception choice determine your entire fate?

Or just being born in sin?

Sorry - I missed this question until now, sigh...

Our choice to rebel causes us to be born into, sown into, mankind either as reprobate trusting that YHWH is a false god and a liar or as a sinful elect, sent here to learn to come out from among the reprobate, Mtt 13:27-30, and to be trained in righteousness, Heb 12:5-11.

As sinful people, the impulse to sin comes from ourselves but how we express that desire and impulse is chosen by the Lord as the perfect method to bring us to repentance and faith.

 

[TedT]

And infants ?

To be born on earth into manknd is proof you are a sinner as only sinners are liable to death and suffering and all mankind suffers and dies. As sinners we are all equal but as to our faith, all sinners on earth, including infants, are separated by their election to salvation based upon their previous declaration of faith in YHWH as their GOD and Saviour OR as reprobate for deciding that YHWH was a liar and therefore a false god.

 

[TedT]

Can you show me one place in scripture it is used this way outside of your claim of Ps 51:6?

The use of any word in scripture is open to eisegetical interpretation by everyone, not just me...

 

[TedT]

I'd kindly suggest that you don't take it too seriously. ;You'd be building a whole theological structure on one verse of scripture and the verse you use is highly questionable even to be used this way.

Thanks for your concern but this verse in only one of some dozens, some with less importance, some with more, to building the wall of my faith...

We are to live by faith, not proof, so these verses are small hints, small bricks building my faith but without any poke a stick in your eye proof.

 

[TedT]

Don't believe everything you read from the MT. The Greek OT uses the same word for when Elizabeth was pregnant with John the Baptist in her womb and meet Mary.

Never underestimate the power of accepted eisegesis...the Hebrew is crushing each other to pieces, no matter who says it means something else to fit their theology because it just can't mean what it says on its face value.

 

[TedT]

As for me no I don't accept that at all and I'm not sure many others do either. Infants die in the womb for a variety of reasons

I believe it because death is the wages of sin, that which is earned by choosing to sin and nothing else.

 

[TedT]

I think too taking the Hebrew word to mean willfully crushing each other I think that's taking a word that CAN mean this but not in any full sense.

We live by faith, not proof.

 

[TedT]

ABSOLUTELY. We all deserve HELL FOR OUR OWN SIN!!! We don't need no stink'in "Original SIN".

Hell and death!

 

[TedT]

God does not charge people with sins until sins are committed.

Since death is the wages of sin, that which is earned only by choosing to sin, death proves sinfulness, right?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Since death is the wages of sin, that which is earned only by choosing to sin, death proves sinfulness, right?

Chuckle!!! why would "Sinfulness" require any "Proof" since we ALL DO IT???

 

[TedT]

Infants don’t need a savior , they haven’t sinned. They are innocent. That’s why even most Calvinists will admit they go to heaven which contradicts TD. They know they have a moral dilemma. A contradiction in their system when it comes to infants.

This alone shows the false teaching within Calvinism when it comes to the guilt and punishment that comes with a sin nature from birth.

The why, if HE truly wants everyone to be repent and come the truth, why does HE only kill some to save them from damnation and not everyone???? Why if HE loves us does HE not kill us in our infancy and save us and our families from the sinfulness we later accrued?

What is special about those HE saves by helping them avoid sin thru an early death over those HE forces to go thru a sinful life unto faith with the possibility of their damnation?

 

[TedT]

Chuckle!!! why would "Sinfulness" require any "Proof" since we ALL DO IT???

Because some think that some people are sinless until...whatever.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Because some think that some people are sinless until...whatever.

They SIN. yup - I'll go along with that. Angeline (my first born) lasted 4 hours after birth. I expect to meet her on the other side, and see her as she is.

 

[civic]

The why, if HE truly wants everyone to be repent and come the truth, why does HE only kill some to save them from damnation and not everyone???? Why if HE loves us does HE not kill us in our infancy and save us and our families from the sinfulness we later accrued?

What is special about those HE saves by helping them avoid sin thru an early death over those HE forces to go thru a sinful life unto faith with the possibility of their damnation?

God doesn't do such a thing the gospel is for everyone. One can either believe the gospel or reject the gospel and condemn themselves.

 

[TedT]

God doesn't do such a thing the gospel is for everyone. One can either believe the gospel or reject the gospel and condemn themselves.

But because some die as infants before hearing the gospel and death is the result of sinning, then those who die as infants must have already chosen to believe the gospel unto saving faith or to have rejected it a lies.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

But because some die as infants before hearing the gospel and death is the result of sinning, then those who die as infants must have already chosen to believe the gospel unto saving faith or to have rejected it a lies.

And just when you KNOW it can't get any SILLIER - it does.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Because some think that some people are sinless until...whatever.

ALL people are "sinless" - until they SIN. "Original Sin" is just a phony "cash cow" for Catholics. NOBODY is condemned by anyone's SIN but their own.

 

[civic]

ALL people are "sinless" - until they SIN. "Original Sin" is just a phony "cash cow" for Catholics. NOBODY is condemned by anyone's SIN but their own.

Amen