How Calvin justified persecuting his opponents

civic said:
See below the evil man known as calvin and his justification for putting people to death who disagree with his institutes.

Calvin did not patiently discuss his differences with people who promoted competing ideas. Calvin requested beheadings, made death threats, and praised God for orchestrating the torture of heretics.

Calvin spelled out his theologically reinforced vengeance in a personal letter:

Calvin believed God made sure criminals didn’t die quickly when tortured. This vengeful attitude and his support for outdated Old Covenant laws that legislated capital punishment for competing theologians that challenged his preferred doctrines look more like ISIS than Jesus.

Michael Servetus, a Spaniard, physician, scientist and Bible scholar, suffered a worse fate. He was Calvin's longtime acquaintance who resisted the authority of the Roman Catholic Church. However, he angered Calvin by returning a copy of Calvin's Institutes with critical comments in the margins. So what did Calvin do? You can read his resolution from a personal letter he wrote to a friend:

The next time Servetus attended Calvin's Sunday preaching service on a visit, Calvin had him arrested and charged with heresy. The 38 official charges included rejection of the Trinity and infant baptism. The city magistrates condemned him to death. Calvin pleaded for Servetus to be beheaded instead of the more brutal method of burning at the stake, but to no avail. Some people see Calvin’s compassion in pursuing a more humane method of death, but ultimately he supported killing Servetus and all such heretics.

Calvin summarized the execution this way:

How could such torture be condoned? In November 1552 the Geneva Council declared Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion to be a "holy doctrine which no man might speak against." Disagreeing with Calvin’s view of God was a violation warranting the death penalty according to the way John Calvin interpreted Leviticus 24:16.

John Calvin argued:
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Cllvin turned him over but the city council of Geneva condemned him. Calvin never laid a hand on him.
 
civic said:
Well at least you can see the heart behind the man
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[Act 21:20 ESV] 20 And when they heard it, they glorified God. And they said to him, "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed. They are all zealous for the law,
  • As Calvin was zealous to uphold the Laws of Geneva.

[Act 22:3 ESV] 3 "I am a Jew, born in Tarsus in Cilicia, but brought up in this city, educated at the feet of Gamaliel according to the strict manner of the law of our fathers, being zealous for God as all of you are this day.
  • As Calvin was zealous to confront those that taught LIES (heresies) about the God that Calvin loved.

[Gal 1:14 ESV] 14 And I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people, so extremely zealous was I for the traditions of my fathers.
  • … like Luther and Hus who suffered and labored to restore the Apostolic Foundation of Scripture to the Church.

[Tit 2:14 ESV] 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works.
  • Calvin’s zeal may have been a gift from God … King David, John the Baptist and Jesus all became violent in their zeal to confront evil.
[1Pe 3:13 ESV] 13 Now who is there to harm you if you are zealous for what is good?
  • Servetus was not THRICE condemned because of his great desire to do good, but for his eagerness to seek confrontation.

[Rev 3:19 ESV] 19 Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent.
  • If Calvin is guilty if “reproving” Servetus, then Servetus is guilty of refusing to “repent”. It was the latter that got him killed, not the former.
 
atpollard said:
[Act 21:20 ESV] 20 And when they heard it, they glorified God. And they said to him, "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed. They are all zealous for the law,
  • As Calvin was zealous to uphold the Laws of Geneva.

[Act 22:3 ESV] 3 "I am a Jew, born in Tarsus in Cilicia, but brought up in this city, educated at the feet of Gamaliel according to the strict manner of the law of our fathers, being zealous for God as all of you are this day.
  • As Calvin was zealous to confront those that taught LIES (heresies) about the God that Calvin loved.

[Gal 1:14 ESV] 14 And I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people, so extremely zealous was I for the traditions of my fathers.
  • … like Luther and Hus who suffered and labored to restore the Apostolic Foundation of Scripture to the Church.

[Tit 2:14 ESV] 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works.
  • Calvin’s zeal may have been a gift from God … King David, John the Baptist and Jesus all became violent in their zeal to confront evil.
[1Pe 3:13 ESV] 13 Now who is there to harm you if you are zealous for what is good?
  • Servetus was not THRICE condemned because of his great desire to do good, but for his eagerness to seek confrontation.

[Rev 3:19 ESV] 19 Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent.
  • If Calvin is guilty if “reproving” Servetus, then Servetus is guilty of refusing to “repent”. It was the latter that got him killed, not the former.
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no one should be killed for their faith by someone claiming to have faith in the same God, the same Christ.

Jesus taught believers to love their enemies not kill them.
 
civic said:
no one should be killed for their faith by someone claiming to have faith in the same God, the same Christ.

Jesus taught believers to love their enemies not kill them.
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Should anyone own a slave?
 
Presby02 said:
Only God knows the heart.
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True but you will know them by their fruits 🍎

The fruit of Love

1 Corinthians 13:1-7
If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres

Galatians 5:22-23
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

James 2:8
8However, if you fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well.

John 13:34-35
34 "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another. 35 "By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another."

John 15:13
13 "Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.

John 15:17
17 "This I command you, that you love one another

Matt 22:37-40
And He said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the great and foremost commandment. 39 The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”

Loving God is always connected to loving others. If you cannot or do not love others then you do not love God and are deceived. The greatest commandment Jesus answered was to love God with all you mind, heart, soul and strength and your neighbor. Jesus connected the love of God with loving others. He said the whole world will know you are My disciples by how you love one another.

John takes it a step further and says if you don't love others then you don't love God either.

1 John 2:3-6
3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: 6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

1 John 3:9-12
9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another; 12 not as Cain, who was of the evil one and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother's were righteous.

1 John 3:14-19
14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death. 15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 16 We know love by this, that He laid down His life for us; and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 17 But whoever has the world's goods, and sees his brother in need and closes his heart against him, how does the love of God abide in him? 18 Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth.

1 John 3:23-24
23 This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. 24 The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

1 John 4:7-14
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. 8 The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love. 9 By this the love of God was manifested in us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world so that we might live through Him. 10 In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us. 13 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.

1 John 4:16-21
16 We have come to know and have believed the love which God has for us. God is love, and the one who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him. 17 By this, love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment; because as He is, so also are we in this world. 18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love. 19 We love, because He first loved us. 20 If someone says, "I love God," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for the one who does not love his brother whom he has seen, cannot love God whom he has not seen. 21 And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

hope this helps !!!
 
Last edited:
I will let Jesus words speak about how to love, what He commanded His followers to do.

You will know them by their fruits !

Luke 6:32-36
32“If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

Calvin showed no mercy, hated those who opposed his beliefs, proclaimed death as their judgment, and disobeyed Jesus command to love your enemies and do good to them. His life mirrored Saul before his conversion and was nothing like the Apostle Paul after conversion.

Jesus commands overrule the laws of the land. Shall we obey God or man ?



hope this helps !!!
 
civic said:
True but you will know them by their fruits 🍎

The fruit of Love

1 Corinthians 13:1-7
If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres

Galatians 5:22-23
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

James 2:8
8However, if you fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well.

John 13:34-35
34 "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another. 35 "By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another."

John 15:13
13 "Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.

John 15:17
17 "This I command you, that you love one another

Matt 22:37-40
And He said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the great and foremost commandment. 39 The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”

Loving God is always connected to loving others. If you cannot or do not love others then you do not love God and are deceived. The greatest commandment Jesus answered was to love God with all you mind, heart, soul and strength and your neighbor. Jesus connected the love of God with loving others. He said the whole world will know you are My disciples by how you love one another.

John takes it a step further and says if you don't love others then you don't love God either.

1 John 2:3-6
3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: 6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

1 John 3:9-12
9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another; 12 not as Cain, who was of the evil one and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother's were righteous.

1 John 3:14-19
14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death. 15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 16 We know love by this, that He laid down His life for us; and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 17 But whoever has the world's goods, and sees his brother in need and closes his heart against him, how does the love of God abide in him? 18 Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth.

1 John 3:23-24
23 This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. 24 The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

1 John 4:7-14
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. 8 The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love. 9 By this the love of God was manifested in us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world so that we might live through Him. 10 In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us. 13 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.

1 John 4:16-21
16 We have come to know and have believed the love which God has for us. God is love, and the one who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him. 17 By this, love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment; because as He is, so also are we in this world. 18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love. 19 We love, because He first loved us. 20 If someone says, "I love God," and hates his brother, he is a liar; for the one who does not love his brother whom he has seen, cannot love God whom he has not seen. 21 And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

hope this helps !!!
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So that gives you the right to judge someone who has been dead 500 years because of theological biases? Would you judge David or Paul in the same way?
 
Presby02 said:
So that gives you the right to judge someone who has been dead 500 years because of theological biases? Would you judge David or Paul in the same way?
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major difference between them and I use to use the same argument for 4 decades.

1-Calvin was like Saul, not Paul
2- David repented of his sin, confessed his evil deed and never did it again.

oh and BTW you left out Moses. :)

And we are talking about Jesus teaching and the standards He and the Apostles taught us to live by in the N.T.

hope this helps !!!
 
civic said:
major difference between them and I use to use the same argument for 4 decades.

1-Calvin was like Saul, not Paul
2- David repented of his sin, confessed his evil deed and never did it again.

oh and BTW you left out Moses. :)

And we are talking about Jesus teaching and the standards He and the Apostles taught us to live by in the N.T.

hope this helps !!!
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1)Saul and Paul are the same person

2) David not only committed murder he also committed adultery. Yet was a man after Gods own heart.

So is it your position Calvin was not a Christian?
 
civic said:
One was a born again believer ( Paul )
The other one was not ( Saul )

He was known as Paul after his conversion. :)
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Still the same person. A name change does not mean your a different person.

You did not answer my question. Was Calvin a Christian? Your judge and jury right?
 
Presby02 said:
Still the same person. A name change does not mean your a different person.

You did not answer my question. Was Calvin a Christian? Your judge and jury right?
Click to expand...
He was a murderer before conversion, not after.

And I would guess calvin was not since there was ZERO FRUIT OF THE SPIRIT in his life. He did not love the brethren or his neighbor. He was a hypocrite. His life was one marked by hatred not love.

You will know them by their fruits. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit.

hope this helps !!!
 

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