Freed from : Calvinism-TULIP-5 points Hyper-Calvinism

[atpollard]

The law was a schoolmaster to lead us to christ.

Who is "us" in that scripture?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

How many people obeyed the Law of Moses?
exactly 1 ... Jesus.

Does the fact that God Incarnate was the ONLY person (EVER) that exercised his "free will" to obey say something?
It does to me.

Choose Disobey = 100%
Choose Obey = 0%

We should come up with a name for that ... what about "Total Inability"?

Lol

Show me where God says if you obey every word you will be saved?

The law was a schoolmaster to lead us to christ, You need to study galations 3.

 

[GodsGrace]

You will not discuss any verse that I point to, except to offer a barrage of verses that prove that Scripture Lied and must mean the opposite of what it says.

That is because the verses you post,,,to which I have replied more than once...
do NOT mean what the reformed THINK they mean.

You see everything through calvinist colored glasses.
Scipture does not lie.
CALVINISM LIES.

If show you a conflict....
you should ponder WHY there's a conflict...
not tell me I'm stating a scripture is wrong...
I'M STATING THE OPPOSITE.

You tell everyone on the Forum that they don't understand....
maybe YOU don't understand??

For example, you have NOTHING to say about John 6:44. You present verses to prove that all CAN come to Jesus (when John 6:44 literally says "No one can come to me") and you present another verse on "draw" and an argument about Universalism to prove that Draw cannot mean Draw. You never actually comment on the actual words in John 6:44 or its context in John 6.

Well atpollard, we must exegete scripture.
The best way to do this is to let scripture explain scripture.
I explained to you different concepts of John 6:44,,,at least 2 or 3...
NONE OF WHICH AGREES WITH JOHN CALVIN theology.

I'm not going to explain again why YOUR understanding of the word DRAW would lead to universalism due to the statement of Jesus in John 12:32

Since you refuse to really discuss any verse that I suggest ("no it doesn't mean what it says" is not really a discussion), I am disinclined to discuss any verse that you present. If you had addressed John 6:44, I would have responded to any one verse that YOU wanted to talk about (including chasing the word DRAW through scripture if that is what you wanted.)

The reason is just that simple.

I did address John 6:44.

YOU OTOH,,,cannot show how YOUR understanding is the correct understanding.

And you tend to argue with me instead of replying to my explanations and why you don't agree.
It might be because I'm a girl.
But I've studied Calvinism A LOT for many years....
so I'm ready when you are.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Who is "us" in that scripture?

Everyone.. Paul read those words to the galatian church, which had jew and gentile it was written to all

God wrote the law in our hearts, thats why a gentile could keep the law.. because it is in our dna.

We just can not be perfect. Because everyone one of us can;t get past the first command.. some of us on a daily basis

 

[atpollard]

It IS an honest question.

There is no gospel in reformed theology.
There is no love in reformed theology.
There is no justice in reformed theology.
There is no hope in reformed theology.

Have you ever heard of Charles Spurgeon?
(he was a reformed Baptist Preacher whose sermons were published in the newspaper, so they are preserved for us to read them)

 

[GodsGrace]

How many people obeyed the Law of Moses?
exactly 1 ... Jesus.

Does the fact that God Incarnate was the ONLY person (EVER) that exercised his "free will" to obey say something?
It does to me.

Choose Disobey = 100%
Choose Obey = 0%

We should come up with a name for that ... what about "Total Inability"?

Sir....
TOTAL INABILITY means that man is UNABLE TO SEEK GOD.

It DOES NOT mean that man is unable to obey God.

Please get your theology correct.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Have you ever heard of Charles Spurgeon?
(he was a reformed Baptist Preacher whose sermons were published in the newspaper, so they are preserved for us to read them)

Ever heard of the bible

It was persevered for us to read.

Be a follower of God not man

 

[GodsGrace]

Have you ever heard of Charles Spurgeon?
(he was a reformed Baptist Preacher whose sermons were published in the newspaper, so they are preserved for us to read them)

Yes atpollard...I've heard of John Spurgeon.
And I'm sorry John MacArthur is so sick and probably dying.
And I love RC even though I don't agree with him on anything reformed.
And I can't stand John Piper and how he talks.
And I have no respect for Augustine of Hippo for more reasons than one.

So?

Now what.

Let's stick to the bible..

 

[Johann]

The law is not even a command.

God did not say keep this and you will be saved

Some clarification needed here brother---

The law is indeed a set of commands given by God.

Salvation is not through the law, but the law reveals the need for a Savior. The law could not save, but it pointed to Christ, who fulfills the law on behalf of believers (Matthew 5:17).

God did not say, "Keep the law and you will be saved," but He did say that obedience to His commands was expected and that the law was a guide to living in covenant with Him. Yet, salvation is through faith in Christ alone, not by the works of the law.

J.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Some clarification needed here brother---

The law is indeed a set of commands given by God.

Salvation is not through the law, but the law reveals the need for a Savior. The law could not save, but it pointed to Christ, who fulfills the law on behalf of believers (Matthew 5:17).

God did not say, "Keep the law and you will be saved," but He did say that obedience to His commands was expected and that the law was a guide to living in covenant with Him. Yet, salvation is through faith in Christ alone, not by the works of the law.

J.

The law is the moral commands, the national commands, and the sacrificial commands. All which lead to christ

The moral commands prove to us we are in sin

The sacrificial commands prove to us what needs to be done to be forgiven of those sins.

 

[Johann]

The law is the moral commands, the national commands, and the sacrificial commands. All which lead to christ

The moral commands prove to us we are in sin

The sacrificial commands prove to us what needs to be done to be forgiven of those sins.

More for the readers sake here--love the fact you don't dismiss the moral commands/Imperatives of YHWH fulfilled in Christ Jesus brother.

You shall have no other gods before Me (Exodus 20:3)
This commandment is not explicitly mentioned in the Pauline Epistles. However, Paul often addresses idolatry and the worship of false gods, particularly in 1 Corinthians 10:14 and Romans 1:25. These passages emphasize that believers should avoid idolatry, which reflects the underlying principle of this commandment.

2. You shall not make for yourselves a carved image (Exodus 20:4)
While not directly quoted in the Pauline letters, the issue of idolatry is addressed in passages like Romans 1:23 and 1 Corinthians 10:14, where Paul warns against the worship of idols, indirectly upholding this commandment.

3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain (Exodus 20:7)
In Ephesians 4:29, Paul speaks to the issue of speech, instructing believers to use their words for edification, which indirectly relates to honoring God's name and avoiding the misuse of it.

Romans 2:24 addresses how God's name is dishonored among the Gentiles when they fail to live according to His standards, which can be seen as an indirect reference to this commandment.

4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy (Exodus 20:8)
Colossians 2:16–17 addresses the Sabbath, indicating that Christians are not bound by the observance of the Sabbath as part of the law: “Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.”

5. Honor your father and your mother (Exodus 20:12)
Ephesians 6:2–3 directly quotes this commandment: “Honor your father and mother (which is the first commandment with a promise), that it may go well with you and that you may live long in the land.”

6. You shall not murder (Exodus 20:13)
This commandment is referenced in Romans 13:9, where Paul lists several commandments in the context of love: "The commandments, 'You shall not murder... You shall love your neighbor as yourself.'"

7. You shall not commit adultery (Exodus 20:14)
1 Corinthians 6:9–10 and Romans 13:9 both address sexual immorality, including adultery, as part of the moral instructions for believers. In 1 Corinthians 6:18, Paul urges believers to flee from sexual immorality, which aligns with the prohibition against adultery.

8. You shall not steal (Exodus 20:15)
Ephesians 4:28 addresses theft: “Let the thief no longer steal, but rather let him labor, doing honest work with his own hands.”

9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor (Exodus 20:16)
Ephesians 4:25 says, “Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor,” which directly addresses the issue of bearing false witness.

10. You shall not covet (Exodus 20:17)
Romans 7:7 mentions coveting specifically: “I would not have known what it is to covet if the law had not said, 'You shall not covet.'” Additionally, Colossians 3:5 instructs believers to put to death "covetousness, which is idolatry."


Pauline Epistles mention directly or indirectly 9 out of the 10 commandments in some form. The only commandment that is not directly referenced is the command about not making a graven image (Exodus 20:4), though idolatry is addressed indirectly in various places.


In Paul's teachings, especially in his letters to the Romans and Ephesians, the commandments are often connected to the broader principle of love (as in Romans 13:8–10) or the law of Christ, emphasizing that believers are to live out these commandments not to be justified but as part of their sanctification and transformation through the Holy Spirit.

The Sabbath commandment is the most notable one that Paul does not insist upon, as it was part of the Mosaic Law that was fulfilled in Christ (as seen in Colossians 2:16–17).

Shalom.

J.

 

[atpollard]

Where is HOPE in the Calvinist "gospel"??

If ONLY that was an honest question.

It IS an honest question.

Sure it is …

There is no gospel in reformed theology.
There is no love in reformed theology.
There is no justice in reformed theology.
There is no hope in reformed theology.

… all appearances to the contrary not withstanding.

The Essence of the Gospel​

Charles Haddon Spurgeon December 4, 1870