Wrangler
Well-known member
Correct. It says the word was God. It does not say that Jesus is God. How could you possibly have missed that?
Even in John 1, Jesus is not God
- Thread starter Wrangler
- Start date
I'm telling you that I do know Christ is the express image of God the Father. I know that already.
I do know the Jesus is God. I know that already.
Are you saying that Christ and the Father are the same Person? That's modalism.
101G
Well-known member
and? did 101G not respond? so How did 101G lose a no argument subject.... (smilew)... LOL, Oh dear..... NEXT. well here come an argument in just a second.
101G.
Here's another verse that shows that Jesus is God. Thanks Jeremiah for that verse.
16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
101G
Well-known member
@Wrangler, @synergy, @jeremiah1five, and @Fred
GINOLJC to all
to the above mention. the Lord Jesus knew he was God in Flesh, the apostles knew the Lord Jesus was God in Flesh. but did not the disciples KNEW also? yes. is not the bible clear in this? well let's see. especially to my friend Wrangler who love to ... I guess argue, argue this. the apostle Pau, then Saul met the Lord Jesus on his way to Damascus. and being led into the city he encountered a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias. Dr. Luke is writing this account here in Acts chapter 9. and this disciple inquire with the Lord Jesus about this man Saul. and the Lord assure him, by saying, Acts 9:15 "But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:"
the apostle Paul later give this account before some Jews at Jerusalem and in that account he said this. remember dr. Luke recorded this. Acts 22:12 "And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there," Acts 22:13 "Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him." Acts 22:14 "And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth."
101G have one question to those mention above, "who had chosen Paul, then Saul?" Ananias said, 1. "The God of our fathers". which means the God of the OT. now 101G agree with Ananias, and maybe you too. but here is where 101G differ for you all. 101G say that the one who chose Saul, now Paul, is "JESUS" the Lord. do any of you agree.
101G will be looking for all of your answers.
101G.
GINOLJC to all
to the above mention. the Lord Jesus knew he was God in Flesh, the apostles knew the Lord Jesus was God in Flesh. but did not the disciples KNEW also? yes. is not the bible clear in this? well let's see. especially to my friend Wrangler who love to ... I guess argue, argue this. the apostle Pau, then Saul met the Lord Jesus on his way to Damascus. and being led into the city he encountered a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias. Dr. Luke is writing this account here in Acts chapter 9. and this disciple inquire with the Lord Jesus about this man Saul. and the Lord assure him, by saying, Acts 9:15 "But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:"
the apostle Paul later give this account before some Jews at Jerusalem and in that account he said this. remember dr. Luke recorded this. Acts 22:12 "And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there," Acts 22:13 "Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him." Acts 22:14 "And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth."
101G have one question to those mention above, "who had chosen Paul, then Saul?" Ananias said, 1. "The God of our fathers". which means the God of the OT. now 101G agree with Ananias, and maybe you too. but here is where 101G differ for you all. 101G say that the one who chose Saul, now Paul, is "JESUS" the Lord. do any of you agree.
101G will be looking for all of your answers.
101G.
I believe that Jesus is the "I Am" God of the OT. Is that what you're trying to get at?
Wrangler
Well-known member
There is not one single verse that shows your heresy to be true. Not one! Notice how the verse does not come right out and say that Jesus is God? That's because he is not. Scripture uses language of forms, images, reflections and manifestations precisely because these are NOT God.
If Jesus were God, the trinity would be false. So, what is it?
- The trinity is false and Jesus is God.
- The trinity is true and Jesus is NOT God.
101G
Well-known member
No, as you said before, "I already know this".... (smile).
so, you agree that the God of our fathers is Jesus correct, Yes or No?
101G.
101G
Well-known member
well your answer to the encounter of Saul on the road to Damascus if Jesus is the God of our fathers that will put an end to your false belief..... now, your answer please.
101G.
Wrangler
Well-known member
I don't understand what your question is. Jesus is no kind of god, of our father's or anyone else, but a man.
I do love how trinitarians are always changing the subject! This thread is about John 1 but you retreat to Saul on the road to Damascus.
101G
Well-known member
well what's hard to understand? you said, " Jesus is no kind of god, of our father's or anyone else, but a man." so you do not agree that it was the Lord Jesus who chose Saul on the road to Damascus, only a Yes or No please...
101G
101G
Well-known member
well what hard to understand? you said, " Jesus is no kind of god, of our father's or anyone else, but a man." so you do not agree that it was the Lord Jesus who chose Saul on the road to Damascus is the "GOD" of our father's, only a Yes or No please...
101G
Your heretical thinking causes you run away from the phrase "God was manifested in the flesh". Please explain that phrase to us.
Huh? Your heretical thinking has infected your logical thinking.
101G
Well-known member
@ Wrangler, well time up.
Any time it takes that long for one to answer a simple yes or no question, it means they are no sure. And yes, for good reasons. Because there is a third account of this same incident. but you said, " Jesus is no kind of god, of our father's or anyone else, but a man.". well that's enough. Paul is before king Agrippa, and gives the same testimony but now the revelation of who chose him. And here is this account.
Acts 26:12 "Whereupon as I went to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests," Acts 26:13 "At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed with me." Acts 26:14 "And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks." Acts 26:15 "And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest." Acts 26:16 "But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;"
Here this term “MAKE” is the Greek term, G4400 προχειρίζομαι procheirizomai (pro-chei-riy'-zo-mai) v.
1. to handle for oneself in advance.
2. (figuratively) to purpose.
[middle voice from G4253 and a derivative of G5495]
KJV: choose, make
see how the KJV can translate this word. Which is the same exact word used by Ananias in Acts 22:14. please look this up.
And here is the Icing on the cake, this word is used only here in these two verses. so your belief that the Lord Jesus is Just a Man is a big ERROR on your Part. ..... Just an agent of God. when he's God Himself. .....
now examine what what have been said, and then we can argue. ..... (smile)....
101G.
Any time it takes that long for one to answer a simple yes or no question, it means they are no sure. And yes, for good reasons. Because there is a third account of this same incident. but you said, " Jesus is no kind of god, of our father's or anyone else, but a man.". well that's enough. Paul is before king Agrippa, and gives the same testimony but now the revelation of who chose him. And here is this account.
Acts 26:12 "Whereupon as I went to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests," Acts 26:13 "At midday, O king, I saw in the way a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed with me." Acts 26:14 "And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks." Acts 26:15 "And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest." Acts 26:16 "But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;"
Here this term “MAKE” is the Greek term, G4400 προχειρίζομαι procheirizomai (pro-chei-riy'-zo-mai) v.
1. to handle for oneself in advance.
2. (figuratively) to purpose.
[middle voice from G4253 and a derivative of G5495]
KJV: choose, make
see how the KJV can translate this word. Which is the same exact word used by Ananias in Acts 22:14. please look this up.
And here is the Icing on the cake, this word is used only here in these two verses. so your belief that the Lord Jesus is Just a Man is a big ERROR on your Part. ..... Just an agent of God. when he's God Himself. .....
now examine what what have been said, and then we can argue. ..... (smile)....
101G.
Wrangler
Well-known member
No, rejecting inherently contradictory thinking has led me to think logically.
I've just explained about manifest in the flesh. See post # 67.
You don't believe that Jesus is the "I Am" God of the OT? This is where we part.
101G
Well-known member
You already said that it was Jesus who is the Word who became flesh and dwelt among us:
https://berean-apologetics.communit...trinity-is-wrong-language-usage.201/post-5219
Therefore, everything that pertains to the Word (that the Word was God) pertains to Jesus. Case closed.
Wrangler
Well-known member
No. I said God put his words in one among the people in fulfillment of Deuteronomy 18:15-18. Any paraphrasing if this does not change what I was stating.
Wrangler
Well-known member
Wrong. You cannot accept that every use of the word ‘word’ in Scrioture does NOT pertain to Christ.
This is how weak your argument is.
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