Eternal Security

mailmandan said:
Here is how I see it.
Click to expand...

Think of it like this..

Being born again, is Spiritual, and the "new creation"... is the Child of God.
Where is the new Creation?

A.) "IN Christ".....as "One with God".......= "seated in heavenly places" in the KOG.

So, that is what it means to be BORN AGAIN..., and this is finished......so, that Sanctification is eternal.

Now, as we are a child of God...... in Heaven....with them, in the KOG..........we are also still in a dying body......down here......doing what?

AA.) "Discipleship"........so, this is us, living for God.......daily, and this has its ups and downs....its good times and its "issues" related to being a human who is a Christian......and this whole process, along with what we are given by God to do and to deal with......is our process of sanctification.
Paul calls this our "course".......and He finished his.
 
Behold said:
Think of it like this..

Being born again, is Spiritual, and the "new creation"... is the Child of God.
Where is the new Creation?

A.) "IN Christ".....as "One with God".......= "seated in heavenly places" in the KOG.

So, that is what it means to be BORN AGAIN..., and this is finished......so, that Sanctification is eternal.

Now, as we are a child of God...... in Heaven....with them, in the KOG..........we are also still in a dying body......down here......doing what?

AA.) "Discipleship"........so, this is us, living for God.......daily, and this has its ups and downs....its good times and its "issues" related to being a human who is a Christian......and this whole process, along with what we are given by God to do and to deal with......is our process of sanctification.
Paul calls this our "course".......and He finished his.
Click to expand...
I like to Study "Abide in Christ" also.

Abiding in Christ means:
  1. Believing, trusting, or welcoming Christ.
    https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=5839...LW1lYW4tdG8tYWJpZGUtaW4tY2hyaXN0Lmh0bWw&ntb=1
  2. Intentionally remaining in an ever-growing relationship with Him.
    https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=f841...hYmlkZS1pbi1jaHJpc3QtaG93LXRvLWRvLWl0Lw&ntb=1
  3. Allowing God to work through us to transform us.
    https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=f841...hYmlkZS1pbi1jaHJpc3QtaG93LXRvLWRvLWl0Lw&ntb=1
  4. Living in humble dependence on Him for life and vitality.
    https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=a39a...lYW4tdG8tYWJpZGUtaW4tamVzdXMtY2hyaXN0Lw&ntb=1
 
Here is a little from a book on abiding in Christ. "Abide in Christ: Thoughts on the Blessed Life of Fellowship with the Son of God" by Andrew Murray

“Abiding in Jesus is nothing but the giving up of oneself to be ruled and taught and led, and so resting in the arms of Everlasting Love.” (Page 26)

“Dear souls! how little they know that the abiding in Christ is just meant for the weak, and so beautifully suited to their feebleness. It is not the doing of some great thing, and does not demand that we first lead a very holy and devoted life. No, it is simply weakness entrusting itself to a Mighty One to be kept,—the unfaithful one casting self on One who is altogether trustworthy and true. Abiding in Him is not a work that we have to do as the condition for enjoying His salvation, but a consenting to let Him do all for us, and in us, and through us. It is a work He does for us,—the fruit and the power of His redeeming love. Our part is simply to yield, to trust, and to wait for what He has engaged to perform.” (Pages 28–29)

“It must have been this: you had not understood how entire surrender to Jesus is the secret of perfect rest. Giving up one’s whole life to Him, for Him alone to rule and order it; taking up His yoke, and submitting to be led and taught, to learn of Him; abiding in Him, to be and do only what He wills;—these are the conditions of discipleship without which there can be no thought of maintaining the rest that was bestowed on first coming to Christ. The rest is in Christ, and not something He gives apart from Himself, and so it is only in having Him that the rest can really be kept and enjoyed.” (Page 22)

“They did not know how, when Jesus said, ‘My yoke is easy,’ He spoke the truth; how just the yoke gives the rest, because the moment the soul yields itself to obey, the Lord Himself gives the strength and joy to do it.” (Page 23)

​

 
Eleazar said:
I like to Study "Abide in Christ" also.

Abiding in Christ means
Click to expand...

Abiding "IN" Christ......

So, how does a born again spirit, get "IN" Christ, as there is no other way to get "IN" Christ, then to be born again, "in Christ".= (INTO), as in become a part of.........as in "joined spiritually".........as in "Spiritual union".....as that is how you "Abide", "IN" = Christ.

No self effort can get you there, and no self effort can keep you there.
 
When we see 'turn away' 'fall away '..

Ask..what is it from?

Is the context about salvation itself?

Who is turning away/falling away? Already converted people or haven't yet been converted?

Is it regarding an individual or an entire group or nation?

Then you can get the real gist.
 
Behold said:
Abiding "IN" Christ......

So, how does a born again spirit, get "IN" Christ, as there is no other way to get "IN" Christ, then to be born again, "in Christ".= (INTO), as in become a part of.........as in "joined spiritually".........as in "Spiritual union".....as that is how you "Abide", "IN" = Christ.

No self effort can get you there, and no self effort can keep you there.
Click to expand...
But it's good to be there. "A living sacrifice holy and acceptable" that phrase from the Bible. Romans 12:1 It means that we should present our bodies as a living sacrifice to God, which is our spiritual worship. God has already set us apart for His purposes and declared us acceptable because He sees us in our position in Christ. We do not have to wait to be better people before we offer our bodies and lives to God. As people in Christ, He will receive the sacrifice of our everyday lives right now.
 
Good old Lordship OSAS: "I'm going to act like OSAS isn't true, but still cling to it for a false sense of security."

Blessed Inconsistency.
 
I have found that ALL false religions and cults that promote salvation by works strongly oppose OSAS which is a major red flag for me.

Salvation is not probation.
Eternal life is not temporary life.
Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.

Psalm 37:28 - For the Lord loves justice, And does not forsake His saints; They are preserved forever, But the descendants of the wicked shall be cut off. How long is forever? Of those given to Jesus by the Father, how many will He cast out and how many will He lose? (John 6:37-39) How many of Jesus' sheep will be snatched from His hand and not receive eternal life? (John 10:27-29) Of those who are predestined, called and justified, how many of them will not be glorified? (Romans 8:30) Of those who are sanctified in Jesus Christ, how long does the Lord confirm them? (1 Corinthians 1:8) How long will they be sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ and perfected? (Hebrews 10:10,14) Of those who believe the gospel and are sealed with the Holy Spirit, how long are they sealed? (Ephesians 1:13-14; 4:30) What does the word guarantee mean? (2 Corinthians 1:22; 2 Corinthians 5:5; Ephesians 1:14)

Prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church, I did not believe in OSAS and had no assurance of salvation because I was trusting in works for salvation (which is often associated with NOSAS) and was miserable! After my conversion, I now have assurance of salvation (1 John 5:11-13) and am no longer miserable but eternally grateful. Praise the Lord! 🙂
 
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast. Ephesians 2:8–9

You and I are not saved because we have enduring faith. We are saved because at a moment in time we expressed faith in our enduring Lord. Notice how Paul ends this passage:

It is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast.

Since salvation is a gift from God I find it hard to believe He would take it back. He also gave us an instruction manual, the Bible.

Sharing the Gospel with others will keep us on the right track also. When you see other peoples lives changed it makes you realize what a previous gift we have been given.

So to say that our salvation can be taken from us for any reason, whether it be sin or disbelief, is to ignore the plain meaning of Ephesians 2:8–9. To place conditions on the permanency of our salvation is to say it is not a gift.
 
Duane said:
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast. Ephesians 2:8–9

You and I are not saved because we have enduring faith. We are saved because at a moment in time we expressed faith in our enduring Lord. Notice how Paul ends this passage:

It is the gift of God; not as a result of works, that no one should boast.

Since salvation is a gift from God I find it hard to believe He would take it back. He also gave us an instruction manual, the Bible.

Sharing the Gospel with others will keep us on the right track also. When you see other peoples lives changed it makes you realize what a previous gift we have been given.

So to say that our salvation can be taken from us for any reason, whether it be sin or disbelief, is to ignore the plain meaning of Ephesians 2:8–9. To place conditions on the permanency of our salvation is to say it is not a gift.
Click to expand...

You can't stop being born again.
 
Doug Brents said:
Sure you can.
Click to expand...

@Doug Brents ..

the reason you BELIEVE that you can lose your salvation, is because you do not TRUST in Christ to keep you saved.


You trust in YOURSELF, and that is why you will find reasons and methods and situations that you must never fail.........as if you do, then you believe you are lost.
So, your faith is not in Christ.....its in Yourself.
See, you find verses that you put yourself under bondage to, to make sure that you dont do it......so that you can keep yourself saved, by that process.
So, that is = NO FAITH in Christ.......that is SELF Righteousness, = LEGALISM.


Listen, You can't undo a Spiritual Birth., and i'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you are born again and not just water baptized, and very religious, but lost.

So, what you "confess later", after you are already born again, has no bearing on the Spiritual Birth that is already ACCOMPLISHED and eternal.

Let me show you this... and maybe you can see the reality..

You are born of your mother........and you didnt cause it.
So, if you tell your mother......."i hate you, i am not your son, you are not my mother"..........does this change the fact that you are born?
Does it cause your mother to no longer be your mother?

So, if you come to a place in your Christianity, where you hate God, because of some tragedy........then your feelings do not change your spiritual birth........as nothing can change, alter, or stop...= being born again.
 
Behold said:
@Doug Brents ..

the reason you BELIEVE that you can lose your salvation, is because you do not TRUST in Christ to keep you saved.
Click to expand...
Not true. I trust in what Scripture says.
Behold said:
You trust in YOURSELF, and that is why you will find reasons and methods and situations that you must never fail.........as if you do, then you believe you are lost.
So, your faith is not in Christ.....its in Yourself.
Click to expand...
Again, not true. My faith is 100% in Christ. Nothing can take me from Him, but I can leave Him by my own choice. I fail Him often, and that does not remove my salvation, because He says that His blood continually washes me clean of all sin as long as I am walking in His Light (which I do continually).
Behold said:
See, you find verses that you put yourself under bondage to, to make sure that you dont do it......so that you can keep yourself saved, by that process.
So, that is = NO FAITH in Christ.......that is SELF Righteousness, = LEGALISM.
Click to expand...
Your opinion is noted. Thank you.
Behold said:
Listen, You can't undo a Spiritual Birth., and i'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you are born again and not just water baptized, and very religious, but lost.
Click to expand...
That convoluted mess is meaningless. Care to try again?
Behold said:
So, what you "confess later", after you are already born again, has no bearing on the Spiritual Birth that is already ACCOMPLISHED and eternal.
Click to expand...
So you are rewriting Scripture? You are better, smarter, greater than God who inspired the Scriptures? God says that verbal confession "results in" receiving salvation. Salvation is the result of verbal confession of Jesus; it cannot come before confession.
Behold said:
Let me show you this... and maybe you can see the reality..

You are born of your mother........and you didnt cause it.
So, if you tell your mother......."i hate you, i am not your son, you are not my mother"..........does this change the fact that you are born?
Does it cause your mother to no longer be your mother?

So, if you come to a place in your Christianity, where you hate God, because of some tragedy........then your feelings do not change your spiritual birth........as nothing can change, alter, or stop...= being born again.
Click to expand...
So what you are saying is that once I am saved, it doesn't matter what I do? If there is nothing I can do to lose (or walk away from) salvation, then it doesn't matter what I do for the rest of my life once I have accepted Jesus' gift of salvation. That means that I can rape, steal, murder, worship false gods, kidnap, etc., but God will still save me because I once accepted His gift of salvation.

What absolute stupidity!!!
 
Duane said:
the Bible likens it to a rebirth.
Click to expand...

Being born again is simply being restored into spiritual union with God.

In other words......1st Adam lost spiritual union with God, and 2nd Adam's Cross, allows a believer to regain eternal spiritual union with God.
 
The Holy Spirit will show you that you are eternally saved. That you will not lose you salvation.

A Christian is promised eternal life. “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life” (John 3:16). Eternal life is the promise of spending forever in heaven with God. God promises that if you believe, you will have eternal life. For a Christian to lose salvation, eternal life would have to be redefined. The Christian is promised to live forever. Does eternal not mean “eternal”? got?
Click to expand...

If a Christian can lose salvation, then Romans 8:30 is in error, because God could not guarantee glorification for all those whom He predestines, calls, and justifies.

A Christian cannot lose salvation. Most, if not all, of what the Bible says happens to us when we receive Christ would be invalidated if salvation could be lost.
 
Cyrus said:
The Holy Spirit will show you that you are eternally saved. That you will not lose you salvation.



If a Christian can lose salvation, then Romans 8:30 is in error, because God could not guarantee glorification for all those whom He predestines, calls, and justifies.

A Christian cannot lose salvation. Most, if not all, of what the Bible says happens to us when we receive Christ would be invalidated if salvation could be lost.
Click to expand...

Reader,

You can't stop being born again, as this is an eternal spiritual birth.

So...

One of the first things a real student of the word comes to understand is....regarding the New Covenant...

= "where there is no LAW, there is no Transgression"..

Now...This does not mean that there is no carnal behavior............it means that there is no LAW to define it, as sin.....therefore......"where there is no Law, there is no Transgression".

IN Genesis, we find this ......= "sin was in the world but it was not imputed"... and that is because there was no Law to define it as "sin".

So, once a person becomes born again...... they find that they are not "under the Law"........"but under Grace".

This means........regarding a Born again Christian's behavior.....= "where there is no Law, there is no Transgression".

Now, Satan misunderstood this.....and created a concept that His ministers use.......that is.....>>"oh, so you are teaching that we can live like the devil"......."we have a "license to sin".

See that?..........but the verse, and the understanding that is the theology.....says.. that "sin is not imputed, because there is no Law"., and that is not the same as saying..>>>"live like the devil, do what you want...."

So, a carnal mind... can only see that as ......>"license to sin".. whereas if you are not in a carnal mind, you see this as "God's amazing Grace".

The Devil wants you to see it as. "license to sin".......but its not........its simply "not under the law" = the Law has no power or dominion, to JUDGE YOU as a sinner, ever again, once you are born again.

A.) "You are not under the law..........but under GRACE".

Now, 2 verses that a bible student who is trying to understand this are found in Paul's Doctrine.

Romans 4:8

2 Corin 5:19
 
Behold said:
Reader,

You can't stop being born again, as this is an eternal spiritual birth.

So...

One of the first things a real student of the word comes to understand is....regarding the New Covenant...

= "where there is no LAW, there is no Transgression"..

Now...This does not mean that there is no carnal behavior............it means that there is no LAW to define it, as sin.....therefore......"where there is no Law, there is no Transgression".

IN Genesis, we find this ......= "sin was in the world but it was not imputed"... and that is because there was no Law to define it as "sin".

So, once a person becomes born again...... they find that they are not "under the Law"........"but under Grace".

This means........regarding a Born again Christian's behavior.....= "where there is no Law, there is no Transgression".

Now, Satan misunderstood this.....and created a concept that His ministers use.......that is.....>>"oh, so you are teaching that we can live like the devil"......."we have a "license to sin".

See that?..........but the verse, and the understanding that is the theology.....says.. that "sin is not imputed, because there is no Law"., and that is not the same as saying..>>>"live like the devil, do what you want...."

So, a carnal mind... can only see that as ......>"license to sin".. whereas if you are not in a carnal mind, you see this as "God's amazing Grace".

The Devil wants you to see it as. "license to sin".......but its not........its simply "not under the law" = the Law has no power or dominion, to JUDGE YOU as a sinner, ever again, once you are born again.

A.) "You are not under the law..........but under GRACE".

Now, 2 verses that a bible student who is trying to understand this are found in Paul's Doctrine.

Romans 4:8

2 Corin 5:19
Click to expand...
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A Gift Is a Gift Is a Gift

You and I are not saved because we have enduring faith. We are saved because at a moment in time we expressed faith in our enduring Lord. Notice how Paul ends this passage: It is the gift of God; n…
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